Engine help

[BigAbe75]

packing up for Shelbyville and need a little help.

Driving my grandparents motorhome. They’re getting older and it only gets used rarely.

Recently had all batteries and alternator changed.

Driving from the farm to my house (about 15 miles) it died about a dozen times on me. Each time was rolling up to a stop or taking my foot off the gas to coast a bit.

Dad and I both believe that the engine forgot how to idle while in gear after the recent battery work. Rpms just drop and it dies. Starts right up, and runs fine while driving. Idling in Park is nice and smooth.

How do I go about retraining the computer?

It’s an ‘06 Ford gas engine. I’ve got a slew of manuals, but nothing on the engine itself. The unit is a Class A, 40’ motorhome so I would assume largest gas engine available. ?

Anyway, anybody have any thoughts? If not, I’ll just drive it tomorrow and hope that it learns as we go. It’s about a 90 minute drive.

Tagging a couple guys that I think have some bit of knowledge. (Way more than me, I know) Lol @veedubtek @gmtech16450yz

 

[veedubtek]

I know absolutely zero about Fords and their engine management, so don't listen to me.

I'm assuming the gas isn't years old/is fresh/has been treated/something. With that said, I'd be looking for a vacuum leak. I highly doubt it's a "relearn" thing, but again, I know nothing about Ford EMS. Vacuum leaks can also be internal, which is kinda what I'd suspect in this case - like a stuck EGR/IAC valve.

 

[Scottintexas]

sorry it's not better info, maybe you have the triton v10,

found this at ford truck
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1049067-v10-wont-idle-after-battery-change.html

 

[Scottintexas]

you need @buckbuck he love's ford,

 

[—Яiвs>]

The throttle blade is dirty so the computer has to learn how to compensate the lost air flow. You can either clean the throttle with brake/ parts cleaner and a rag. Or you just keep driving but try to 2 foot when it reaches the point of stalling and should learn eventually.

 

[BigAbe75]

Well, gas is 4-5 months old. It went to FL from IL in Feb, stayed parked there for a month then drove back, towing a Jeep Liberty both ways. Ran a couple tanks through it at that time and they say trouble free.

Vacuum leak sounds not trivial?

Ok to continue as is do you think? Or, likely courting larger problems? (Obviously, I make my own decisions and nobody else is responsible for me).

 

[BigAbe75]

The throttle blade is dirty so the computer has to learn how to compensate the lost air flow. You can either clean the throttle with brake/ parts cleaner and a rag. Or you just keep driving but try to 2 foot when it reaches the point of stalling and should learn eventually.

This is what I was doing the other day.

 

[BigAbe75]

sorry it's not better info, maybe you have the triton v10,

found this at ford truck
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1049067-v10-wont-idle-after-battery-change.html

Indeed, it does have a Triton V10 emblem on the side! I’ll check it out!

 

[—Яiвs>]

This is what I was doing the other day.

Then I’d start with cleaning the blade to speed up the learning curve.

 

[buckbuck]

I have had my Fords do funny things after a battery change out. Stalling was one of them but they learned pretty quick if I recall correctly. Transmission shifting seemed to take longer to return to normal. How many miles? Throwing any codes?

 

[BigAbe75]

Just to catch up for anyone still interested.

After watching a few videos and reading a couple links above, I went out and let it idle with everything turned off about 10 minutes then turned it off. Then started back up and let it idle about 10 minutes with max AC on and full blower. Then shut it off.

Next day, we left on our trip. It ran pretty well, but I did notice a couple times that rpm would drop to about 300 when rolling up to a stop sign. A little feathering of the gas pedal kept us going. Only died twice on the 90 minute drive. (Vast improvement over the other day). 1st time I was feeling so good about the drive that I forgot to pay attention and it died on me. 2nd time, I had to stomp the brakes as a light changed faster than expected.

Anyway, I’m hopeful that we are on the mend.

If I don’t see additional improvement on the way home Sunday, I’ll revisit with our local shop. (Who is also a high school buddy that has worked on this rig for years).

 

[Beachbummer]

I wonder if it has a separate idle air controller, or if it manages your and throttle plate to keep idle.

The two Ford's I ever worked on use a separate Idler Air Control module, which controls the air on a separate path very close to the throttle plate, but it's a separate thing. These get stuck with gunk due to the recirculation of dirty air for emission purposes. (egr valve and all that)

What you need to do (i meant to add here, there is only the slightest chance Im right) in the very very slight chance this is the issue, is to find this module, unbolt it, and clean the crap out of it, and then BAM idle control is fully restored.

Best of luck!

 

[BigAbe75]

I wonder if it has a separate idle air controller, or if it manages your and throttle plate to keep idle.

The two Ford's I ever worked on use a separate Idler Air Control module, which controls the air on a separate path very close to the throttle plate, but it's a separate thing. These get stuck with gunk due to the recirculation of dirty air for emission purposes. (egr valve and all that)

What you need to do in the very very slight chance this is the issue, is to find this module, unbolt it, and clean the crap out of it, and then BAM idle control is fully restored.

Best of luck!

Thanks a bunch for the info!!

 

[Ronnie]

I had to replace the iac on a Used navigator/Ford Expedition with trition 5.4 liter v8 that exihibited the same symptoms as your ford powered Vehicle @BigAbe75 . It worked perfectly afterwards. T&m came out to around $200. Apparently it’s a common problem with older ford v8s and it sounds like the v10 you are dealing with has the same problem.

If you are going to do the work yourself cleaning the IAC sounds like the best first course of action but if you take it to a shop you may as well replace it for about the same cost as them cleaning it.

As you know there are a lot of videos on cleaning and replacing the iac as well as how to reinitiate the learning process (often by disconnecting the battery for a few minutes) on you tube.

 

[Gym]

Fuel filter.

 

[gmtech16450yz]

Fuel filter.

Most common suggestion but 99% of the time wrong. If the fuel filter is plugged, idle is actually when it WON'T act up. Almost no fuel flow needed at idle. Fuel filters will cause symptoms only under loads.

As others have said, clean the throttle plate or idle air control valve and let it relearn the idle. Letting it idle in gear for at least 5 or even 15 minutes helps .

Not only does it have to relearn the idle, it has to relearn the fuel trims also .

 

[Gym]

Most common suggestion but 99% of the time wrong. If the fuel filter is plugged, idle is actually when it WON'T act up. Almost no fuel flow needed at idle. .

Hmmm. Well, I won't argue with you but take a look at #5 in this link. Just think changing a fuel filter on an old vehicle would be a good idea even if it doesn't resolve the issue.

https://www.doityourself.com/stry/symptoms-that-your-truck-may-have-a-dirty-fuel-filter

Another possibility is sometimes people drain their fuel systems then run their engine until it quits in order to drain all the fuel out of seasonal equipment. This is a bad idea as dirt, grit & water end up going through carburators or fuel injectors. More than once I've had to blow out carburator jets because of this.

 

[Jgorm]

Iac valve. I'd bet on it. Get motorcraft brand from the dealer or rock Auto. I've had issues with brand new napa iacs. Cleaning then doesn't work as a long term fix. I've been dealing with Ford modular engines for over a decade.

 

[gmtech16450yz]

Hmmm. Well, I won't argue with you but take a look at #5 in this link. Just think changing a fuel filter on an old vehicle would be a good idea even if it doesn't resolve the issue.

https://www.doityourself.com/stry/symptoms-that-your-truck-may-have-a-dirty-fuel-filter

Another possibility is sometimes people drain their fuel systems then run their engine until it quits in order to drain all the fuel out of seasonal equipment. This is a bad idea as dirt, grit & water end up going through carburators or fuel injectors. More than once I've had to blow out carburator jets because of this.

I agree with what you said that I put in bold. But I looked at that link and laughed! That is a PERFECT example of why you have to be very skeptical of anything you read on the internet. What a pile of cr@p!

I hope this doesn't come off snotty, but I've had more fuel filters in my hands than most people have had hamburgers in their hands. lol. I specialize in driveability, engine management and electronics. I averaged 10 cars FIXED a day in my dealership job. Multiply that by 5 days a week, 52 weeks a year, 34 years in my dealership experience alone. (edit- Yikes! I just did that math. That's somewhere around 88,400 hoods I've opened in my dealership career!) I have thousands of hours of training, am fully ASE certified and am also a BAR licensed California smog inspector and repair tech. I didn't learn any of this off the internet. lol.

Don't feel bad about the fuel filter idea. That's why I said it's such a super common diagnosis for a wide range of symptoms, but unfortunately it's almost always wrong.

 

[Gym]

I figured that from your screen name @gmtech16450yz and not dismissing your experrience at all but oil & fuel filters are part of schedueled maintenance on all vehicles. Just thought it was worth mentioning whereas you mentioned it was an old vehicle that is rarely used. I'll be looking forward to the solution.