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Investing & Financial Advisors

adrianp89

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Hey guys,

Looking for some help here. I would like to have someone manage my 401k instead of just having it in a Target Date Fund (and their stupid .71% fee). Complete newb so any help is appreciated. If I have a personal advisor, can they manage my account through Fidelity, even if they are not with Fidelity? Do you guys recommend this? If so, any recommendations?
 

thefortunes

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Former advisor here...

Technically a financial advisor cannot manage your 401k as it, by definition, is an employee directed account.

HOWEVER, any good advisor will look at your entire portfolio and will make recommendations for your 401k based on the options available within the plan.

Reach out to your friends and family to see if they have an advisor that they would recommend. Take the time to interview a couple and find one that you are comfortable with, has a proven track record and can describe what they will do for you in terms that you can understand. Ask them how they are compensated and what their typical client portfolio looks like (there should be no "typical" portfolio - every client is different).

Good luck.
 

AZMark

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0.71% is less than an advisor will probably cost and an advisor for a 401k isn’t really worth it. You can’t actively trade in a 401k very effectively since there are no individual stocks and a lot of the funds prohibit “round trips” in an out of funds within a month to try and time the market.
You could look at the makeup of those target date funds (or just a generic stock/bond mix for your age) & copy that allocation yourself using the available investment options in your 401k. Sticking to index funds would be best to minimize fees vs the managed mutual funds.
You’d just need to update/rebalance it on whatever interval you’re comfortable with. Once per year would probably keep things fairly close to the target allocation and wouldn’t take much work.
 

2kwik4u

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Hey guys,

Looking for some help here. I would like to have someone manage my 401k instead of just having it in a Target Date Fund (and their stupid .71% fee). Complete newb so any help is appreciated. If I have a personal advisor, can they manage my account through Fidelity, even if they are not with Fidelity? Do you guys recommend this? If so, any recommendations?
I have a finance guy. It started when I rolled a $25k (yea, I'm behind at 40) 401k into an IRA through him when I left one company and didn't want my retirement to be tied to my place of employment moving forward. I met the guy when he was setting up his office in our small rural town, and he was literally coming around door to door. He's through Edward Jones, so despite his unorthodox client finding methods, he's a reputable shop IMO.

Anywho; He's been great. He's helped us navigate changing jobs (like when I took a major salary cut to work for a company with a nutso bonus structure), setting up wills We had nothing before we met him and significant details that needed to be resolved like where our kids go if we both pass at the same time), refinancing the house, and a few other life events. Overall, he's worth his fees just in the connections he has, and the single point of contact convenience. He has our life insurance policies now, and they're setup to ensure if one of us kicks the bucket the other gets paid in days, not months. He's the executor of our wills at this point as well, as he becomes an impartial 3rd party and has our written consent to tell our family to go pound sand if they get unruly. Things of that nature are what he takes care of, and it's worth the fees if for nothing else, but that impartial 3rd party to help navigate complex financial life decisions. All of our parents are REALLY REALLY bad with money, so it's nice to have someone I can call to ask financial questions about on major life decisions. I don't call him to ask if a TV is a good deal or not, but if I'm considering refinancing the house, buying a vehicle, changing jobs, or things like that. He gets a call as a sanity check to make sure whatever crazy ass scheme I have in my head will work out the way I expect. Saved me a few times in there as well already.

In terms of retirement funds. My wife and I both took risk assessments, and he plans accordingly. That last 4 years he's averaged a shade over 20% growth in our accounts. His fees are such that he gets a $500-ish flat rate, then essentially 2% of our "winnings" for the year. So we get 18% and he gets 2%. We win, he wins. We have yearly meetings to make sure nothing has changed, and evaluate where we are and where we're headed. This year we decided to open a Roth IRA and fund it personally (outside of office contributions). He has all that setup and working for us, and it was super convenient.

I know my guy is through Edward Jones, and he can't get to my Fidelity account or my wifes IRA through her office. I mean I could give him the login and he COULD, but I don't think he's allowed to by Edward Jones rules.........SO, instead he gives us advice on what to do, and we make the changes ourselves while we're in his office doing the yearly checkup. Last years checkup took 2 hours and he ordered pizza for us, which was nice.

Overall, I always thought having a "Finance Guy" was for people that had a ton more assets than I do. At this point I have a net worth that is probably sneaking up on negative if you count the house and cars being financed. My retirement fund is small in comparison to where it should be, and I know he's not making a ton of money off of me. Even if he does, that's fine he takes care of ALL OF THE THINGS for me, and has been super helpful when navigating oddball life events. He's earned my business several times over, and it helps me sleep better at night knowing that I'm not just "floundering around" with my retirement. We have a plan, someone to hold us accountable to that plan, and goals we're working towards. That's worth his fees IMO.

Hope that helps.
 

thefortunes

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I have a finance guy. It started when I rolled a $25k (yea, I'm behind at 40) 401k into an IRA through him when I left one company and didn't want my retirement to be tied to my place of employment moving forward. I met the guy when he was setting up his office in our small rural town, and he was literally coming around door to door. He's through Edward Jones, so despite his unorthodox client finding methods, he's a reputable shop IMO.

Anywho; He's been great. He's helped us navigate changing jobs (like when I took a major salary cut to work for a company with a nutso bonus structure), setting up wills We had nothing before we met him and significant details that needed to be resolved like where our kids go if we both pass at the same time), refinancing the house, and a few other life events. Overall, he's worth his fees just in the connections he has, and the single point of contact convenience. He has our life insurance policies now, and they're setup to ensure if one of us kicks the bucket the other gets paid in days, not months. He's the executor of our wills at this point as well, as he becomes an impartial 3rd party and has our written consent to tell our family to go pound sand if they get unruly. Things of that nature are what he takes care of, and it's worth the fees if for nothing else, but that impartial 3rd party to help navigate complex financial life decisions. All of our parents are REALLY REALLY bad with money, so it's nice to have someone I can call to ask financial questions about on major life decisions. I don't call him to ask if a TV is a good deal or not, but if I'm considering refinancing the house, buying a vehicle, changing jobs, or things like that. He gets a call as a sanity check to make sure whatever crazy ass scheme I have in my head will work out the way I expect. Saved me a few times in there as well already.

In terms of retirement funds. My wife and I both took risk assessments, and he plans accordingly. That last 4 years he's averaged a shade over 20% growth in our accounts. His fees are such that he gets a $500-ish flat rate, then essentially 2% of our "winnings" for the year. So we get 18% and he gets 2%. We win, he wins. We have yearly meetings to make sure nothing has changed, and evaluate where we are and where we're headed. This year we decided to open a Roth IRA and fund it personally (outside of office contributions). He has all that setup and working for us, and it was super convenient.

I know my guy is through Edward Jones, and he can't get to my Fidelity account or my wifes IRA through her office. I mean I could give him the login and he COULD, but I don't think he's allowed to by Edward Jones rules.........SO, instead he gives us advice on what to do, and we make the changes ourselves while we're in his office doing the yearly checkup. Last years checkup took 2 hours and he ordered pizza for us, which was nice.

Overall, I always thought having a "Finance Guy" was for people that had a ton more assets than I do. At this point I have a net worth that is probably sneaking up on negative if you count the house and cars being financed. My retirement fund is small in comparison to where it should be, and I know he's not making a ton of money off of me. Even if he does, that's fine he takes care of ALL OF THE THINGS for me, and has been super helpful when navigating oddball life events. He's earned my business several times over, and it helps me sleep better at night knowing that I'm not just "floundering around" with my retirement. We have a plan, someone to hold us accountable to that plan, and goals we're working towards. That's worth his fees IMO.

Hope that helps.
Edward Jones is a little "different" (bordering on cultish), but there are good (and bad) advisors at any firm. Their focus is on the mom & pop rather than the high net worth individual. Raymond James is similar.

If you desire the type of help that is described here (going above and beyond just investment advising) then you want to look for a Certified Financial Planner (CFP) which EdJ requires of their advisors. To become a CFP takes a bunch of time and passing tests beyond that which is required just to get your securities license.

As kwik mentioned it will cost you more, but it can be worth it if you need the "personal" touch. Just be aware that the cost over 10, 20, 30 or more years adds up.

About the only thing I didn't (not sure if it is still true) like about EdJ is that they typically sold their own mutual funds, rather than the entire universe of funds. In some cases their funds were not as good as Fidelity, Vanguard, American Funds or others but you were locked into their menu.
 

TimW451

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+1 to use index funds in your 401k. Many people don’t even recommend putting as much in bond funds as they used too, so it makes many target funds ineffective.
 

2kwik4u

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Edward Jones is a little "different" (bordering on cultish), but there are good (and bad) advisors at any firm. Their focus is on the mom & pop rather than the high net worth individual. Raymond James is similar.

If you desire the type of help that is described here (going above and beyond just investment advising) then you want to look for a Certified Financial Planner (CFP) which EdJ requires of their advisors. To become a CFP takes a bunch of time and passing tests beyond that which is required just to get your securities license.

As kwik mentioned it will cost you more, but it can be worth it if you need the "personal" touch. Just be aware that the cost over 10, 20, 30 or more years adds up.

About the only thing I didn't (not sure if it is still true) like about EdJ is that they typically sold their own mutual funds, rather than the entire universe of funds. In some cases their funds were not as good as Fidelity, Vanguard, American Funds or others but you were locked into their menu.
Good info. This is my first and only experience with a "finance guy". He is also very much setup in a rural community and has low value clients like myself as well as the family that owns all the local farms and I'm sure is a high net worth account. I can definitely see how the wholistic finance view, and extra personalized touch could get out of hand with a bad advisor. Our particular firm has just one guy and his assistant, and the community is small, so if he wasn't worth a crap I suspect he'd have his shop closed up in a hurry.

I'm really unsure which accounts I'm in, I would have to go look. They might be EdJ accounts, might not. I'm a very "hands off" investor, so I only look at the returns and the generalized categories (that I honestly don't understand all that well). I'm sure that's a wildly over simplified view on the situation, but it's where I'm at.
 

BigN8

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All I can say is MAX THAT SHIT OUT. Tax incentives combined with employer match, it just makes sense. Wife and I have been maxing ours out for years. I even take advantage of the HSA and max that out. It hurts a little. We can't buy the things we see our friends and neighbors buying, but I hope the sacrifice is worth it one day.
 

2kwik4u

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All I can say is MAX THAT SHIT OUT. Tax incentives combined with employer match, it just makes sense. Wife and I have been maxing ours out for years. I even take advantage of the HSA and max that out. It hurts a little. We can't buy the things we see our friends and neighbors buying, but I hope the sacrifice is worth it one day.
Maxing it out only hurts the first time. Once you adjust it's not bad.

Grandfather told me years ago. "Half now, Half later." He started pushing a metal cart around the shop floor and retired to Sawgrass as a VP of manufacturing from that same company. That half now, half later premise works anytime you get more money for any reason. Say you get a 4% raise this year. 2% goes into retirement, 2% goes into paycheck. Keep that up and before you know it, you're 15-20% of your income into retirement, and you haven't even "noticed" the hit.

Wife and I are playing catchup because of poor money decisions earlier in our life, so we had an initial "hit" of 5% each to get started. It sucked for awhile. Now we're 5 or so years in, and we're both sneaking up on 15% contributions. She has company match, I'm in an ESOP program so we're taking as much advantage of that as we can as well.

Still gonna be close with only ~20yrs left to save.....assuming we want the same lifestyle when we retire as what we have now. The other big piece of advice I give anyone that can listen. START EARLY. Time is your friend, and compounding interest is a HUGE benefit over the long run!
 

adrianp89

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Thank you everyone, looks like I still have more homework to do, but by all means keep any and all advice coming.

I have been putting about 10k into my 401k, I just took a new job and will be at about 13k/year. I plan to quickly pay off some high-interest debt and then max out my 401k, see how I am doing financial there and start to work towards maxing out a Roth IRA. My goal from this thread is ensure I am maximizing the most out of my 401k. I am 31 now and would like to hit 500k by 40. For that to happen with my current levels I need average roughly 10% returns.
 

2kwik4u

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Thank you everyone, looks like I still have more homework to do, but by all means keep any and all advice coming.

I have been putting about 10k into my 401k, I just took a new job and will be at about 13k/year. I plan to quickly pay off some high-interest debt and then max out my 401k, see how I am doing financial there and start to work towards maxing out a Roth IRA. My goal from this thread is ensure I am maximizing the most out of my 401k. I am 31 now and would like to hit 500k by 40. For that to happen with my current levels I need average roughly 10% returns.
At 31, IMO, you've still got plenty of time. 10% doesn't sound super aggressive and should be achievable.
 

adrianp89

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At 31, IMO, you've still got plenty of time. 10% doesn't sound super aggressive and should be achievable.
I lucked out by having parents that didn't save early. They taught me from their mistakes, which in turn they realized from my grandparents who made a ton of money but didn't save anything. I refuse to be broke in retirement lol. If I am lucky enough to have SS, that will be my boat and Porsche money :)
 

AZMark

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Thank you everyone, looks like I still have more homework to do, but by all means keep any and all advice coming.

I have been putting about 10k into my 401k, I just took a new job and will be at about 13k/year. I plan to quickly pay off some high-interest debt and then max out my 401k, see how I am doing financial there and start to work towards maxing out a Roth IRA. My goal from this thread is ensure I am maximizing the most out of my 401k. I am 31 now and would like to hit 500k by 40. For that to happen with my current levels I need average roughly 10% returns.
I don’t know your situation but a Roth right now makes a lot of sense for a lot of people. Once you contribute whatever you need to the 401k to get 100% of the company matches, contributing to a Roth with the next several thousand might make sense before maxing out the 401k for a few reasons:
- Taxes are very low right now. We came into this pandemic with a huge national debt & deficit and we’re spending trillions on COVID stimulus so it’s got to get paid for at some point and taxes will go up.
- Youre 31 and it sounds like making decent money if you’re talking about maxing out plans. You may hit the income limits for a Roth so it’s better to get that money in there now & it’s then it’s all yours forever.
- A Roth account has unlimited investment options vs whatever funds your employer has decided to include in their 401k plan.
 

BigAbe75

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I would add Housing choices into the list of considerations...

Someone previously mentioned the power of compounding interest... think about that in reverse when you take that 30yr mortgage vs a 15yr.

Right after we got married, age 25, we rushed out and bought our first house. A house that we could be proud of, and that our parents could be proud of.... signed up for that 30yr loan and was still darn near maxing out our budget. 5 years later, I'd had enough of subdivision life and having people sneak notes in my mailbox about my grass being 1/2" too tall and not letting me build a little shed for my lawn tractor, and we sold the house and moved back to the country.

Anyway, new house, we've lived here 16 years. If I had started off with a 15yr mortgage, it'd be paid for already. As it was, I went 30 again, then in mid 2000's rates started coming down drastically, re-fi'd twice in 5 years (which kept extending out to the full term - dumb), and finally was able to refi down to 15yrs. During that final refi, I asked the loan officer where we are at on the current loan and she's like you've only got 27 more to go... wait a minute, I've been in the house 10 years??

Anyway.... round about story, but the point is this: Just starting out, don't try to maintain your parent's lifestyle. We should have started with a cheaper home and got other things in order first. And, truthfully, do you really need a big house anyway? We've got 3 kids and a dog, and the bigger the house the more crap you get to fill it. If you finance for 30 years that big house that will fit your eventual family size, the bad thing is that by the time it's paid for, all the kiddos should be gone and you no longer need that big house.

Bunch of rambling here.... for whatever it's worth.
 

AZMark

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I would add Housing choices into the list of considerations...

Someone previously mentioned the power of compounding interest... think about that in reverse when you take that 30yr mortgage vs a 15yr.

Right after we got married, age 25, we rushed out and bought our first house. A house that we could be proud of, and that our parents could be proud of.... signed up for that 30yr loan and was still darn near maxing out our budget. 5 years later, I'd had enough of subdivision life and having people sneak notes in my mailbox about my grass being 1/2" too tall and not letting me build a little shed for my lawn tractor, and we sold the house and moved back to the country.

Anyway, new house, we've lived here 16 years. If I had started off with a 15yr mortgage, it'd be paid for already. As it was, I went 30 again, then in mid 2000's rates started coming down drastically, re-fi'd twice in 5 years (which kept extending out to the full term - dumb), and finally was able to refi down to 15yrs. During that final refi, I asked the loan officer where we are at on the current loan and she's like you've only got 27 more to go... wait a minute, I've been in the house 10 years??

Anyway.... round about story, but the point is this: Just starting out, don't try to maintain your parent's lifestyle. We should have started with a cheaper home and got other things in order first. And, truthfully, do you really need a big house anyway? We've got 3 kids and a dog, and the bigger the house the more crap you get to fill it. If you finance for 30 years that big house that will fit your eventual family size, the bad thing is that by the time it's paid for, all the kiddos should be gone and you no longer need that big house.

Bunch of rambling here.... for whatever it's worth.
I think this depends on where you live. I’ve made more on my houses than I have in market returns but I’m in a high growth state. I went very affordable on my first starter home and regretted not getting something more expensive after a couple years and when I sold it.
 

swatski

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Hey guys,

Looking for some help here. I would like to have someone manage my 401k instead of just having it in a Target Date Fund (and their stupid .71% fee). Complete newb so any help is appreciated. If I have a personal advisor, can they manage my account through Fidelity, even if they are not with Fidelity? Do you guys recommend this? If so, any recommendations?
I'm late to this thread, you already got great advice and sounds like you already know what to do. If your employer is matching your contributions - that's a no brainer to max those out.

Starting early would be the most important thing if you ask me, everything else falls in place if you do, it just does.
There is no magic, unless you are some kind of a financial wiz, just start early and keep on it.

In my experience, once you pick your provider just stick with them as anytime you change and try to move your money around they just f@^&ing clobber you, financially, with one million penalties that you can spend weeks to try to understand only to make you even more mad/confused.

As said above, either index funds or actively managed, just set it up and forget it, I wouldn't even look at the thing too often, really no more than about once a year, of less - there is actually very little you can do that's beneficial to your portfolio your managers won't already be doing (nothing if it is an index fund). I was very fortunate, didn;t even know it at the time, had an access early on to plans offered by TIAA_CREF, a low cost financial services company and just rolled with them, for the most part. At least in my experience (over about 25 years), what amazes me is this: every time - the less I would do to my investment portfolio the better it would fare, long term. No kidding.
I'm in my early fifties, and already retired once, lol, but I now started working again - yes, because I have too many kids, and I like nice things - like boating, lol.


EDIT: Pro advice: if you want to retire early - do not have kids. lololol.

--
 
Last edited:

drewkaree

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I have no idea if your job's 401k offers this ability, but both of my last two employers had this option - set your contribution to AT LEAST be at the level where your employer will match the highest amount (if they match the first 2%, for example, you need to be at least at that level, if it's a dollar amount, etc).

Second thing, and at your age the thing that will be surprising to you when you realize this - set your contributions to be where you want them (some folks, including me, would say set them SLIGHTLY higher than you're comfortable, and adjust them as you see how comfortable you feel in 3 months). Set your contributions to automatically increase at a percentage you set. My past/current employers have offered the automagic increase, and I could set it from 1% to whatever I wanted. I set mine for 3%. You will be absolutely SHOCKED, I'll bet, to see how much you DON'T miss the money, since you'll never see it to know you had it to spend on stuff. Even if you left it in the targeted date funds, you're still going to be happy in 5 years to see how much you have and how much it hasn't hurt you.

I bought a house with this principle - set up an online account, had a portion of my paycheck deposited to that account, and NEVER told my wife about it until it was time to buy a house. After closing on the house, she said she never felt like we were going without, and she agreed that if I had told her, we would have treated the money like it was cash we had access to, and would have dipped into it, delaying our purchase of a house. Never changed that deposit, and that account is back up to the same level, and now we DO use it to fund projects around the house as-needed.
 

Yambers

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I am a self admitted financial moron, but I agree with @drewkaree. I went YEARS without contributing to a 401k due to a divorce. I had forgotten about it for a long time. When I remembered it, 10 years had passed. When I jumped back in at a new employer, I rolled everything over, started putting in 3%, and I have automatic increases every year for the next 5 years of 2-3%. It is adding up quickly, and I don't miss it. Annual pay increases are 2-3%, and 401k contributions are pre-tax, so I still end up with something extra on my checks.

Now everyone can chime in and confirm I am a financial moron. Or just a moron in general..
 

AZMark

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I am a self admitted financial moron, but I agree with @drewkaree. I went YEARS without contributing to a 401k due to a divorce. I had forgotten about it for a long time. When I remembered it, 10 years had passed. When I jumped back in at a new employer, I rolled everything over, started putting in 3%, and I have automatic increases every year for the next 5 years of 2-3%. It is adding up quickly, and I don't miss it. Annual pay increases are 2-3%, and 401k contributions are pre-tax, so I still end up with something extra on my checks.

Now everyone can chime in and confirm I am a financial moron. Or just a moron in general..
A lot of people miss a lot more than 10 years. Getting back on track was the important part.
 

swatski

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Slightly off topic, something I just read this morning that really stuck with me...

From Elon Musk:
"To be clear, I am *not* an investor, I am an engineer. I don’t even own any publicly traded stock besides Tesla.
However, when fiat currency has negative real interest, only a fool wouldn’t look elsewhere.
Bitcoin is almost as bs as fiat money. The key word is “almost”.
— Elon Musk (@elonmusk) February 19, 2021"

Is this something we should be thinking about? My retirement and investment portfolios are, as far as I know, strictly fiat money... lol

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