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JL Audio MX770 speakers in 2011 SX210?

OrangeTJ

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Looking at getting 2 sets of JL MX770 speakers into my 2011 SX210 in the stock locations. Will power with an Alpine MRX-F65 (have this amp in truck and love it). Just curious if anybody here has run the MX770s and, if so, how they like them. I won't be installing a sub. This is an upgrade with the goal to be able to actually hear music while cruising and have better sq while at anchor. Any input?
 

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Did this additional as well as addition over this summer. Night and day difference. You won't be disappointed.
 

OrangeTJ

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Do they provide a router guide or did you need to make one yourself to enlarge the stock hole?
 

txav8r

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I'm not sure your biggest bang for the buck is with MX770's. The MX650 will deliver a better voice reproduction than the 770 (and it is cheaper!), but if your not going to run a sub, the 770 may give you better mid base response. Drive either speaker with the appropriate power and they will sound awesome, but no sub and your requiring either speaker to extend about 1/3 more in range than with a sub, and that means the speaker is roughly 33% less efficient and can't reproduce the other 66% of the music as cleanly. The reason for the sub is not the thump...it is to provide the coaxial with the job of reproducing what it is best at, mids and highs. Let a sub do the deep work. Again, not the direction your wanting to go, but if your asking for input and your not locked in yet...those are things to consider. Also, go to JL's website and read what the middle of the road power requirements of the 770 is, there are two, the M770 and the MX770, make sure you are powering them appropriately, and not to the maximum capability, but to recommended power. Great speakers no matter which direction you go...just make sure your in the slot on power, and do consider how much cleaner they would be not having to do the down and dirty along side those crisp vocals.
 

OrangeTJ

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Thanks for the input. Yeah, I'm not going to try to ask them to reproduce real lows. I will likely set them on a high pass at 60hz so as not to send real low bass to them in the first place. Looking for decent mid-bass energy, clean vocals and enough higher-frequency presence to reasonably overcome wind and engine noise at speed. If it were just up to me, I'd go with a sub and dedicated amp to run it but my wife isn't down with spending the kind of money it takes to go that route. I've run fairly simple but well-rounded systems in three cars now and am pretty familiar with the characteristics of speakers and what they can and can't realistically do as well as the impacts of under-powering or grossly overpowering. I've had great success with JL products in the past (though I don't have any in my truck's system at this point) and I'd expect that their marine speakers would be good. You raise a good point, though - are the 7.7s going to deliver any meaningfully greater/fuller sound than the 650s? 6 1/2 inchers would definitely be a super easy install and they cost less to boot. I'm only going to get to do this once, though, and don't want to regret not getting the 770s for the incremental cost increase and somewhat more involved install.
 

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If you're not going to use a sub and you're trying to get maximum full range low end from your coaxial speakers then the 7.7" can give you a little more low end than a 6.5". In that application I prefer the M770 over the MX770 (in the 6.5" I actually prefer the MX version, but that's an entirely different product).

Also, I doubt you have the room for them in factory locations, but if you can make them fit the M880 coaxial a are absolutely awesome running full range. They require more power, but they sound unlike anything I've heard in a full range marine speaker and they're perfect for a system without a sub.

On the subject of power, if you do upgrade to the M770 series coaxials then I suggest putting as much power to then as possible. They really shine with 150 watts to each speaker.

If you haven't made final decisions on the speakers and amps then let me know your ideas and I will try to help put together the best possible plan for you. Any way you choose you won't be disappointed with the JL marine coaxial speakers.

Odin
 

txav8r

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I am glad you got in on the conversation Odin @Earmark Marine ... your understanding and ability to glean the maximum from this equipment is amazing. I would love to see those 880's in one of our boats! If I remember, those do jump up in price a good bit more than just an incremental increase, but for those with the budget and wanting THE sound system on the water, I sure would like to hear it!

@OrangeTJ , it sounds like you understand the audio stuff pretty well. You don't really have to lose anything if you put it together right. You won't regret the JL's at all. Odin knows of what he speaks and he can help you to gain the best from your system. I am glad he is around, he and his team have helped 1000's of guys to get that sound they can hear in their head, into their cars and boats. These guys know music, and they know audio, but the best for us, is that they understand the dynamic of applying what they know in the auditorium, even if it is in a boat! Will love following your install!
 

OrangeTJ

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Thanks for the great input! Odin, can you give me a bit more input on the m vs mx770s, assuming about 100 watts rms to each? What would you recommend as a crossover point, with no sub in the equation? I don't expect sub bass from these but would obviously like to get the best and fullest overall sound they can deliver. Thanks again!
 

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Consider the JL Audio XD400/4 amplifier or the marine m400 equivalent if using the MX series. It's very conservatively rated in that it will still put out its full 14.4 volt rating even with a 12.5 volt supply, as tested. Plus, this amplifier will deliver 97% of its 1 kHz power rating across the entire audio bandwidth, as tested. You just won't find those abilities with other products. These are ultra high speed analog switching amplifiers (Class D) which makes them great sound quality amplifiers. Lots of proprietary, domestic, JL Audio engineering.
Also, you can get a deeper discount from Odin with a complete zone purchase.
You'll definitely be better off with Odin as your source. The pre-purchase selection is just the tip of the iceberg. Odin can give you the installation, set-up and tuning guidance that will make the identical equipment perform at a much higher level.
 

txav8r

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Consider the JL Audio XD400/4 amplifier or the marine m400 equivalent if using the MX series. It's very conservatively rated in that it will still put out its full 14.4 volt rating even with a 12.5 volt supply, as tested. Plus, this amplifier will deliver 97% of its 1 kHz power rating across the entire audio bandwidth, as tested. You just won't find those abilities with other products. These are ultra high speed analog switching amplifiers (Class D) which makes them great sound quality amplifiers. Lots of proprietary, domestic, JL Audio engineering.
Also, you can get a deeper discount from Odin with a complete zone purchase.
You'll definitely be better off with Odin as your source. The pre-purchase selection is just the tip of the iceberg. Odin can give you the installation, set-up and tuning guidance that will make the identical equipment perform at a much higher level.
I can vouch for every bit of this, Earmark Marine is a great partner to have in your corner, before, during, and after the sale. They will give you detail and knowledge that you would get no place else. I want to say a few things about that. These guys have talent and knowledge that is life long experience in the industry, from music engineers to musicians and beyond, that isn't something you get from the average "online" experience. You may tell yourself that your previous experience doesn't require this kind of help...good luck with that. The knowledge base on here is helpful, but misses the mark in true high fidelity. I may not know audio the way this reputable dealer does, but I know enough to saddle my horse at their corral. And I am looking forward to hearing the continued discussion about the M770 vs the MX770, I love this as I have had this discussion with both David and Odin. And if you have the desire to get bigger sound, you can! Most of us have a target in mind, and that generally has a budget perimeter around it. I chose to go MX650 with a sub, because that was certainly less of a financial commitment than was a full compliment of M770's, but the performance of the M770 with 150w behind each speaker would destroy my setup. Then again, 60 full watts to each of my 650's with 180 w to my sub...it will be rich, especially with the additional helm located speakers. But they are not really apples to apples. Give Odin your budget, and let him help you design a system that will fit within it. Going for one coaxial or one amp vs another and then trying to align the rest of the system to get where you want to go is bassakwards. Money is money, make sure your getting what you want for what your spending...Earmark can get you there.
 

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Odin, @Earmark Marine, I'm considering upgrading the speakers on my boat. I'm not planning on replacing the head unit unless it wouldn't produce the sound I am looking for in a new speaker. I don't really want to get into the sub and amp setup. I would just like a speaker that sounds just as good or better than my factory speakers which a few are starting to sound like they maybe busted. The 242 LS has a decent sound system IMO and with some of the speakers sounding like they are busted, it's time replace all the speakers. Any suggestions from all is definitely welcomed. This would be the first mod I will have done on this boat since I bought it in 2010.
 

txav8r

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I have 4 brand new Seaworthy speakers that may have been stock in 2010 on your boat @pagekl , but I would steer you away from them. I do intend to sell them after my install isn't my priority.
 

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Thanks, all, for your insights. Earmark certainly has a solid reputation. So, getting away from any preconceived notions about what I want to install, here are the parameters and objectives:

1. Total budget of no more than $1,000. Preferrably less.
2. Want to be able to hear music clearly at cruising speed - 30 -35 mph in my SX210. The boat is loud.
3. Want to be able to play music softly but with good detail when anchored and relaxing with friends in a cove; looking for balanced and accurate sound
4. Would prefer not to cut any extra holes in my boat. I'm OK enlarging holes in stock locations but don't really want to cut up other parts of the boat
5. I will install myself. I'm capable of this and, while I realize a boat is not a car, I have done installs of head units, amps, component speakers, subs (including building simple enclosures) in several of my own vehicles.
 

txav8r

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Hmm, well, with the top end of the budget at $1000, that will leave you short if you go the 770 route with either the MX or M line. And those drivers just require more power. The good news is that you can indeed get music you can hear clearly at cruising speeds with the 650's as well. Your parameters and objectives sound very similar to my initial desires. I didn't want a sub either, but in order to get the most out of system, I went with it. I don't know what the savings would be to go up to 770's with no sub vs 650's with a sub. And you could certainly go 650's without a sub and still get clear music, but the difference in a sound system with and without is eye opening with any speaker setup and any manufacturer.

Hearing music at cruise vs hearing the words and the music are two very different things, and you have to have the power behind as well as a speaker that can compete with the wind and engine noise. One thing I have noticed, if I am standing and leaning against the bolster cushion, which I do at cruise much of the time, my head is up in the wind, and if I turn the music up to hear it clearly, then the inside of the boat is getting blown away! So there is a balance to how and what you have to do to please everyone. The clarity and true reproduction you get from a JL system will not be topped in the marine environment or car. But you may be low on the budget to get there.

And as Odin said yesterday, when you reach for the M series, the power requirements go up. The M770 will want north of 100w per speaker to be happy, and 150 is better. The MX770 is going to want at least 70W, and the MX650 will need 60W. All of these being +/- of those, and you can drive them all a little harder, but you may waisting money, IMO, if you go with less power, and might as well go with a lesser speaker if you don't get your money out of what you buy.

My first install, I did 4 - MX650's in the boat, two on the transom, and a M10iB5 infinite baffle sub, powered by the M700/5 amp. You don't use 100% of these amps, yet they deliver far greater than the numbers they test and publish. The setup to my system only used 530W of that amp at 12.2V. It delivered 50W to each of the in boat speakers, 75 to each transom speaker, and 180 to the sub. I could hear detail, lyrics, highs and lows with good range...even at cruise. In the new boat, I have purchased just about the same with the exceptions of an acoustic suspension sub in a sealed enclosure, designed to optimum parameters, as well as two extra speakers in the cockpit. So I am north of $2K a good deal with all the stuff to install it. With 4 speakers and an amp, you may be able to get close to your budget if you don't go too big.

The amp you listed, the MRX F65, is rated at 14.4V. Our boats don't put out 14.4V. The stator magneto charging system and electrical system run around 13.3V at cruise, and of course 12V at anchor or at rest. So the numbers are a bit skewed to the 14.4V end and they don't rate the amp at 12V. Keep us posted...we all love these audio upgrades!
 

OrangeTJ

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Buying online, I can get 4 m770s and a good quality amp for well under $1k. I can also get 4 mx650s a JL IB sub and amp for under $1k. I would expect 4 650s and a sub to sound better overall. I would just really prefer not to cut a sub hole in my boat. Perhaps I just need to get over it!

Based on past experience, I like Amps from Alpine and Rockford Fosgate, as they have provided me with great sound at a reasonable price. RF p500x4d and p1000x4d are also on the "possible"list. I have nothing against JL amps - very good stuff, but more expensive than really fits my budget for this project. I have found that quality speakers make the biggest difference in sound (provided they receive sufficient clean power). I will say that virtually all amps I have seen have ratings based on 14.4 volts. The Alpine and RF amps I have bought have shown significantly greater than rated output on their birth sheets. This puts them pretty close to rated output at 12 volts.

Fun stuff to talk about!
 

txav8r

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JL rates theirs conservatively, at
Both 14.4 and at 12v, so you know what your actually getting.

Caution, buying products from non "authorized" online resellers like sonicelectronics, will not get you a factory warranty, only a warranty thru sonic...not that you will need it, but authorized factory authorized service and knowledge can't be beat. Good luck with it all.
 

David Analog

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Specs, smecks.
There is soooo much more to know about amplifier performance than just the power spec taken at one voltage (that you can't produce in a boat), taken at one frequency (that is actually the easiest to produce), etc. etc.
Generally, most amplifiers will drop 25% or more of their 14.4 V power with a 12.5 volt supply. They might drop another 15% of their power at the extremes of the audio bandwidth. They might drop another 10% of their power when ALL channels are driven simultaneously. How does the amplifier perform with a pure steady state sine wave into a purely resistive load resistor, as tested, versus a very complex and diverse musical signal into a highly reactive speaker??? You can build an amplifier specifically to spec well or you can build an amplifier to sound and perform well. In many cases, one does not always dictate the other.

Got to echo the comments about buying from a non-authorized on-line dealer. When a non-dealer sells a JL Audio woofer he cuts the serial number out which is concealed under the spider by slicing the spider and gluing it back with lord knows what type of glue. Not having a factory warranty is often the same as zero warranty on a product with a questionable origin. At a savings that is too small to justify sacrificing all support, IMO.
 

pagekl

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@txav8r, Mel, I like the sound from the stock speakers, but I'm looking for a replacement that is similar or better than the stock speakers. Again, this would be a first mod of any sort on my boat. I think the head unit is decent and wouldn't look to replace it if I didn't have to unless a newer one would make a huge difference in sound with the speakers.
 

OrangeTJ

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I am not dead set on buying online, but I have had good success before doing that and the price difference is hard to ignore.
 
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