Deep Cycle House Battery for Audio Upgrades

[kgower]

Want to add a house battery on our 195s for audio upgrades. How do I know which group battery to buy, group 31, group 24? What's the difference?

 

[VitaminSea]

This PDF might help you compare dimensions and ratings. Don’t just focus on the group, but also consider what chemistry and budget you have in mind. I’m no expert but the AGMs seem to provide a great combo of value and service longevity.

The other question you need to consider is how big of a draw and for how long…. There are lots of threads on here regarding batteries.

https://www.driveduracell.com/pub/media/wysiwyg/1853.pdf

 

[kgower]

This PDF might help you compare dimensions and ratings. Don’t just focus on the group, but also consider what chemistry and budget you have in mind. I’m no expert but the AGMs seem to provide a great combo of value and service longevity.

The other question you need to consider is how big of a draw and for how long…. There are lots of threads on here regarding batteries.

https://www.driveduracell.com/pub/media/wysiwyg/1853.pdf

Thanks. Read a few posts before reaching out.

 

[gallobg]

The difference is physical size of the battery, which leads to more reserve capacity. Group 24 is physically the smallest, then group 27, then group 31.

In the AR195, the stock battery is a Group 24 that fits in the factory recess in the floor. So that battery is limited to Group 24 only since the others won't fit. If you add a second battery, it could be any other size you want, just get the correct battery tray for it. However - I will leave it to others to say whether it matters to charge two different capacity batteries. It probably depends on whether you go the simple route (a basic 1 or 2 switch) or do the auto-charging with ACR (here, I believe the batteries should be the same).

I recently added a 2nd Group 24. I only used the basic 1-2 switch route for now, so I have to manually remember to alternate the batteries every now and again to ensure they both get some charge from the motor. I also added a NOCO Gen2 5amp dual onboard charger, which doesn't care what the types/sizes of batteries it is connected to.

Fair warning, that rear port storage locker is a small space to work in. Do yourself a favor and remove the flip-up bench seat before attempting to do any work back there.

 

[kgower]

The difference is physical size of the battery, which leads to more reserve capacity. Group 24 is physically the smallest, then group 27, then group 31.

In the AR195, the stock battery is a Group 24 that fits in the factory recess in the floor. So that battery is limited to Group 24 only since the others won't fit. If you add a second battery, it could be any other size you want, just get the correct battery tray for it. However - I will leave it to others to say whether it matters to charge two different capacity batteries. It probably depends on whether you go the simple route (a basic 1 or 2 switch) or do the auto-charging with ACR (here, I believe the batteries should be the same).

I recently added a 2nd Group 24. I only used the basic 1-2 switch route for now, so I have to manually remember to alternate the batteries every now and again to ensure they both get some charge from the motor. I also added a NOCO Gen2 5amp dual onboard charger, which doesn't care what the types/sizes of batteries it is connected to.

Fair warning, that rear port storage locker is a small space to work in. Do yourself a favor and remove the flip-up bench seat before attempting to do any work back there.

I plan on doing a similar set up with a 1-2 switch.

 

[TexAg16]

What size battery did you end up going with? I am upgrading my sound system and adding two amplifiers and trying to figure out what size battery I would need for roughly 5 hours of float time

 

[212s]

What size battery did you end up going with? I am upgrading my sound system and adding two amplifiers and trying to figure out what size battery I would need for roughly 5 hours of float time

Depends on volume. If you crank the tunes for 5 hours, just take the amperage rating of the two amps x 5 and you'll get a rough estimate of required capacity. So two amps at say 50a each = 100a x 5 hours = 500ah so about 10 x 100ah batteries would be needed. Realistically most people run their system at less than 10% of max so 50ah or one 100ah battery drained to 50%.

Perceived volume is a logarithmic scale so turning it down a notch from max cuts power usage roughly in half. Turn the volume down to what sounds like half volume and power usage is cut about 20x which means you can listen all day on one battery.

 

[scokill]

I've found AGM/Gel batteries just aren't worth it. I get 5-6 years out a regular old flooded cell battery deep cycle. The last one was duracell group 31M 105 ah. $119. I've had more expensive AGM and they lasted the same amount of time and cost 2-3 times more.

 

[biffdotorg]

I've found AGM/Gel batteries just aren't worth it. I get 5-6 years out a regular old flooded cell battery deep cycle. The last one was duracell group 31M 105 ah. $119. I've had more expensive AGM and they lasted the same amount of time and cost 2-3 times more.

Same here, I'm going on fifth season on a pair of Group 27 Deep cycle batteries on my lift and in my 242lS. In 2018, you paid a serious premium for AGM, and these had plenty of life for my investment.

That being said, I do believe the same Duracell Deep Cycles at Sam's club have been replaced with a Duracell AGM for a similar price. The cost of the AGM is in line with what I spent on the older technology. So if in fact they die, I will probably go with the same size in AGM for the same price.

Both my waverunner batteries died over the past couple seasons. And it was true for them as well, AGM was the same price that I paid for similar batteries in the past. So they both sport AGM batteries now. But I will never justify some of these crazy $300-$500 Lithium or Lithium Iron Phosphate batteries given the result we got with traditional batteries.

Everyone's use will vary. So there is a place for those. Just not running a stereo for me for the weekend.

 

[212s]

I will never justify some of these crazy $300-$500 Lithium or Lithium Iron Phosphate batteries given the result we got with traditional batteries.

I know they're pricey, but they're not at all comparable - lithium are known to perform well down to 80% discharged, and last for many more cycles, into the thousands when properly cycled. That makes them cheaper in the long run than AGM.

Everyone's use will vary. So there is a place for those. Just not running a stereo for me for the weekend.

If you don't need the juice to crank tunes all day, then lithium is not necessary. But may still be more economical than AGM.

 

[biffdotorg]

I know they're pricey, but they're not at all comparable - lithium are known to perform well down to 80% discharged, and last for many more cycles, into the thousands when properly cycled. That makes them cheaper in the long run than AGM.

If you don't need the juice to crank tunes all day, then lithium is not necessary. But may still be more economical than AGM.

I have a feeling that getting 4 years out of a pair of Group 27 Deep Cycles (not even AGM) is pretty good life. That’s including 2-3 days a week on the water and only plugging my onboard charger on every other week. That makes them cheaper than any other battery options driving a 1000w amp and twin 10” subs. I’m not a maniac on the sandbar, but I have a feeling we give it a good draw on power.

Don’t get me wrong, I know charge cycles. Ask me what I put in my fish house that draws on a pure sine wave inverter that drives 4 LED televisions, two sonars, 7 LED lights and 3 12v fans all winter long. That’s where we use Lithium and Lithium Iron Phosphate.

I guess I will worry about spending more money on batteries when I burn through my group 27 in one 2hr stint on that sandbar. As in my eyes, I will stick to the story that this battery is shot

 

[scokill]

Same here, I'm going on fifth season on a pair of Group 27 Deep cycle batteries on my lift and in my 242lS. In 2018, you paid a serious premium for AGM, and these had plenty of life for my investment.

That being said, I do believe the same Duracell Deep Cycles at Sam's club have been replaced with a Duracell AGM for a similar price. The cost of the AGM is in line with what I spent on the older technology. So if in fact they die, I will probably go with the same size in AGM for the same price.

Both my waverunner batteries died over the past couple seasons. And it was true for them as well, AGM was the same price that I paid for similar batteries in the past. So they both sport AGM batteries now. But I will never justify some of these crazy $300-$500 Lithium or Lithium Iron Phosphate batteries given the result we got with traditional batteries.

Everyone's use will vary. So there is a place for those. Just not running a stereo for me for the weekend.

Yep, in general the AGM version are about double. In the grand scheme of things about $100 or so difference every 5-6 years isn't that significant. I run the stereo alot and loud for extended periods...sometimes. But I have 2 batteries so I've never really had a problem with enough running time or battery life.

Now, my brother is a big bass fisherman. He has the biggest baddest Ranger bass boat and 3 lithium batteries for the trolling motor. The biggest advantage for him (in addition to the longevity) is the discharge curve. Full voltage until it's dead. Of course being lighter weight doesn't hurt either.

 

[HangOutdoors]

There are different types of AGM's some perform better than others. For my house battery I have a Northstar AGM TPPL

AGM Thin Plate (northstarbattery.com)

 

[biffdotorg]

Yep, in general the AGM version are about double. In the grand scheme of things about $100 or so difference every 5-6 years isn't that significant. I run the stereo alot and loud for extended periods...sometimes. But I have 2 batteries so I've never really had a problem with enough running time or battery life.

Now, my brother is a big bass fisherman. He has the biggest baddest Ranger bass boat and 3 lithium batteries for the trolling motor. The biggest advantage for him (in addition to the longevity) is the discharge curve. Full voltage until it's dead. Of course being lighter weight doesn't hurt either.

Amen, trolling motors eat batteries. I think the fisherman on the water have figured out battery life out of necessity for sure. Weight is a big advantage in those boats as well. Since 24 and 36v configurations are common for motors, rather than the 12v for their electronics.

 

[212s]

There are different types of AGM's some perform better than others. For my house battery I have a Northstar AGM TPPL

Can your battery go to 80% discharge and recover 100% for thousands of cycles?

Not saying TPPL is bad, I'm still on the dual purpose batteries from the dealer because I rarely pump 500w through my stereo. Given my typical use, I'm sure a lithium would last my lifetime, or close to it.

Having said that, TPPL batteries up here is like gold...hard to find and very expensive. Lithium is only 2x the price up here making them more attractive for heavy users.

 

[HangOutdoors]

I have lithiums for my trilling motor. If I ever switch boats or need to replace the house and starter will go that direction as well most likely

 

[Farny]

Can your battery go to 80% discharge and recover 100% for thousands of cycles?

Not saying TPPL is bad, I'm still on the dual purpose batteries from the dealer because I rarely pump 500w through my stereo. Given my typical use, I'm sure a lithium would last my lifetime, or close to it.

Having said that, TPPL batteries up here is like gold...hard to find and very expensive. Lithium is only 2x the price up here making them more attractive for heavy users.

Here’s what I installed for AGM reasonable price and available

XS Power XP3000

Supplemental 12-volt battery for car audio and marine applications

www.crutchfield.com

 

[MrBubbaGump]

Reviving this post... I am very close to pulling the trigger on a new house battery (replacement or addition) here and have been leaning toward the X2Power 31M from B+... I just saw this post with some digging however and am very intrigued. Has anyone else had experience with replacing their house battery with this battery. I do feel like a battery not designed for dual purpose would in theory work better for my needs. Or I am not opposed to just adding this battery (isolated) specifically for my stereo as I already have a 3 bank charger installed. I would just be a little concerned with the potential list when adding close to another 80lbs in the battery compartment.

 

[MrBubbaGump]

Pulled the trigger on an XS Power XP3000 as suggested above. Decided to just add the 3rd battery and hope I don't have too much list on the water. Currently temp installed with a piece of plywood so I could figure out what size of starboard to order. I already have some battery trays on order and now have a dedicated battery that only runs my amps for the sound system. It's getting a little crowded in the batter compartment!

 

[VitaminSea]

Pulled the trigger on an XS Power XP3000 as suggested above. Decided to just add the 3rd battery and hope I don't have too much list on the water. Currently temp installed with a piece of plywood so I could figure out what size of starboard to order. I already have some battery trays on order and now have a dedicated battery that only runs my amps for the sound system. It's getting a little crowded in the batter compartment!
View attachment 202652

Noticed you have an invert sandwiched in their as well!

On top of the new battery, it looks like both the positive and negative terminals have a “Noco” lead with a fuse. Just wondering, do the larger Noco chargers have a fuse on both leads?