Explorer ST

[anmut]

Sorry I was confused there. Rams are independent front and coil link rear. In any case, yes they tow amazing.

Ah right - yeah the guy I was talking to was towing with a large SUV with the IRS in the rear. Said it was scary when it got windy because the suspension would lift/sag in a strong cross wind.

 

[BlkGS]

I get it. I don't care about the environment (arguments can go either way) and we don't keep cars longer than 5-6 years, so our Model 3 works well for us. The driving experience is unmatched, and its the quickest car under $100,000 (last time I checked). My wife gets re-imbursed for mileage so it's almost dumb not to own one. The battery has an 8 year warranty, but if you plan on 10+ years, I wouldn't buy one.

If you are seriously considering Jeep or Dodge, I think both are getting a re-model very soon. A loaded ST is a little bit more than a standard (albeit still pretty loaded) SRT Durango, no? Not sure what discounts are Ford - I know at minimum You can get almost 4k off the Durango due to the HP incentive deal thing they have.

I think the most serious item here may be tow capacity. I think the Durango is nearly 3,000lb more than the Jeep and Ford.

Dura go SRTs are super expensive actually. Base prices of 63k. The explorer st tops out at like 58k.but major a lot of incentives as well. Loaded for 50k isn't too bad.

 

[Bluewater272]

I guess it depends on your needs, I forgot this is a boat forum for a minute lol. If you need an SUV then your choices are limited. In that price range I'd take a truck over an SUV (if towing is no concern, then quite a few cars) The only down side is 5/6 seating vs 7.

I'm surprised the Atlas was so slow, you can get it with 275/360... really shouldn't be a slouch. I really like their gauge cluster and the overall car is done nicely. Though, I'd personally never buy a German car for long term, I don't want my car to smell like crayons at year 3/4 lol. Taking away speed - the new Toyota Highlander looks really good, and is cheaper. We all know Toyota quality. The Hyundai Pallaside looks nice as well - zero experience with them but have heard they can't build enough to sell.

If speed was a factor - the SRT Durango would be my choice in the price range. If your giving me 15k on top of a loaded ST - The Tesla Model X would be a no brainer IMO.

Curious what you didn't like about the cars mentioned above.

For sure, at that coin there are other cars that I might look at, but she wanted a three row SUV. I'll always have a truck, so that avenue is covered.

The slowness of the Atlas surprised me too. On paper, it ought to have been quicker than the Audi, but it just drove like a dog. Not sure if it was the transmission or tuning or what, but pedal to the floor at 40+ and it was crawling. Passing on the highway would've needed some planning.

Toyota was nice, but Toyota's infotainment systems are slow and dated feeling. Similar problem for the Durango - UConnect is a love it or hate it thing. We had just gotten out of a Grand Cherokee (well, totaled out of it), and didn't really want another one because of the infotainment system (also, was on the small side), and the V8s are terribly fuel inefficient. She would average 14-15 in her V8 JGC, and we're seeing mid 19s on the Explorer.

We didn't seriously look at the Pallisade for two reasons: 1, it's a Hyundai, and even though its really nice the resale will be disastrous, and you can't get a second row bench in the nicer trims (a requirement for us).

 

[djetok]

For sure, at that coin there are other cars that I might look at, but she wanted a three row SUV. I'll always have a truck, so that avenue is covered.

The slowness of the Atlas surprised me too. On paper, it ought to have been quicker than the Audi, but it just drove like a dog. Not sure if it was the transmission or tuning or what, but pedal to the floor at 40+ and it was crawling. Passing on the highway would've needed some planning.

Toyota was nice, but Toyota's infotainment systems are slow and dated feeling. Similar problem for the Durango - UConnect is a love it or hate it thing. We had just gotten out of a Grand Cherokee (well, totaled out of it), and didn't really want another one because of the infotainment system (also, was on the small side), and the V8s are terribly fuel inefficient. She would average 14-15 in her V8 JGC, and we're seeing mid 19s on the Explorer.

We didn't seriously look at the Pallisade for two reasons: 1, it's a Hyundai, and even though its really nice the resale will be disastrous, and you can't get a second row bench in the nicer trims (a requirement for us).

Sean you can get the livernois tune. Its fun in the Lincoln. In a straight line it is close to my M car.

 

[Bluewater272]

Sean you can get the livernois tune. Its fun in the Lincoln. In a straight line it is close to my M car.

Definitely on my radar, but probably wait a couple years. Its fast enough for the wife in sport mode for now, lol!

 

[Scuba_ref]

My buddy has the Sport and I tried towing my AR230 with it...that thing out performed my tow package equipped Chevy Silverado LTZ!

 

[BlkGS]

Definitely on my radar, but probably wait a couple years. Its fast enough for the wife in sport mode for now, lol!

They say there's gonna be a Ford performance tune offered that doesn't void warranty. So that sounds like a "part of the new car purchase" sort of thing to me lol.

 

[Adrian @ JB Solutions]

For sure, at that coin there are other cars that I might look at, but she wanted a three row SUV. I'll always have a truck, so that avenue is covered.

The slowness of the Atlas surprised me too. On paper, it ought to have been quicker than the Audi, but it just drove like a dog. Not sure if it was the transmission or tuning or what, but pedal to the floor at 40+ and it was crawling. Passing on the highway would've needed some planning.

Toyota was nice, but Toyota's infotainment systems are slow and dated feeling. Similar problem for the Durango - UConnect is a love it or hate it thing. We had just gotten out of a Grand Cherokee (well, totaled out of it), and didn't really want another one because of the infotainment system (also, was on the small side), and the V8s are terribly fuel inefficient. She would average 14-15 in her V8 JGC, and we're seeing mid 19s on the Explorer.

We didn't seriously look at the Pallisade for two reasons: 1, it's a Hyundai, and even though its really nice the resale will be disastrous, and you can't get a second row bench in the nicer trims (a requirement for us).

I agree on Toyota infotainment. It's been that way for years too. I've always generally liked uConnect. It was light years ahead of the competition when it came out. It still blows my mind that Dodge was making the Magnum the same time Chevy was still making the Cavalier. Uconnect got a lot better in 2018 when they went to the new generation. The 12" on my Ram runs just as good as my iPhone, of course with COVID I only have 5k miles in the past year so not a lot of time with it. For anyone else reading this, I believe the Durango and the GC both are getting the 10" uConnect 5 next year. IIRC that will be a two generation leap for those cars. Totally agree on Hyundai, that is a car that must be bought used. Though I see lease deals on them for ridiculously cheap and it makes it somewhat attractive.

 

[Bluewater272]

It's a shame that Toyota's infotainment is so terrible. When I bought my Yamaha I didn't have a truck yet (we used to tow the old boat with the Explorer Sport), so I rented a Tundra to pick it up. That truck was AWESOME, with the exception of the infotainment. I think I listened to the same few songs on repeat for the three hour drive home because I couldn't figure out how to change anything, lol!

UConnect in the Jeep had some peculiarities that she really didn't like that aren't present on some other models, for example to turn on the heated seats you have to go through like three layers of menu. Just seems stupid for a control that should have a button, or at least a permanent on-screen button. Ford does it the best in my (biased) opinion - it's not the flashiest or highest resolution, but its clean, intuitive, and there are always hardware controls for the things you want (seats, climate, etc).

 

[2kwik4u]

Ah right - yeah the guy I was talking to was towing with a large SUV with the IRS in the rear. Said it was scary when it got windy because the suspension would lift/sag in a strong cross wind.

He had something else awry with his setup if the wind was causing a lift/sag issue. Too much or too little tongue weight, possibly significantly wrong drop on the hitch. P tires (or underrated LT tires) on a large SUV will give a similar "squirrely" feeling in my experience as well.

Several people here towing with Navigators/Expeditions, Audis, Durangos, and other IRS equipped vehicles without an issue. I really don't think it was an IRS issue, but a particular setup issue on his combination.

 

[2kwik4u]

For anyone else reading this, I believe the Durango and the GC both are getting the 10" uConnect 5 next year.

Different trims get different sizes. The lower trims get an 8in, and higher trims get the 10". Both are a new "landscape" setup with a revised dash though.

In general I like the Uconnect the best of those I've used. The system in my wifes Nissan Rogue isn't terrible, but it's not great either. I dislike GM's system (mines old, but even the new ones aren't great). Fords has gotten a LOT better in the recent years. I had a '12 Focus with some of the first Sync tech that Ford used. It was atrocious and was a general PIA. The new systems are significantly better.

@seanmclean is right though. There are some peculiarities to the UConnect that I wasn't a fan of. The heated seats is a really obvious one for me as well.

Of course I'm an "old school" guy, and would LOVE to have a high trim vehicle WITHOUT a screen at all. I hate the added interior light at night time, and I hate functions under "soft buttons" that change based on what screen you're on. Give me some physical buttons, with a nice red tinted backlighting, and let me drive instead of trying to operate an iPad to turn down the A/C, adjust the volume or otherwise adjust the vehicle systems.

 

[djetok]

UConnect in the Jeep had some peculiarities that she really didn't like that aren't present on some other models, for example to turn on the heated seats you have to go through like three layers of menu. Just seems stupid for a control that should have a button, or at least a permanent on-screen button. Ford does it the best in my (biased) opinion - it's not the flashiest or highest resolution, but its clean, intuitive, and there are always hardware controls for the things you want (seats, climate, etc).

Totally agree. One of the biggest issues for me on my wife's unconnect. No buttons, for heated seats you push controls on the infotainment , then the heated seats. On my Ford you push a button, bmw a button.

 

[djetok]

Different trims get different sizes. The lower trims get an 8in, and higher trims get the 10". Both are a new "landscape" setup with a revised dash though.

In general I like the Uconnect the best of those I've used. The system in my wifes Nissan Rogue isn't terrible, but it's not great either. I dislike GM's system (mines old, but even the new ones aren't great). Fords has gotten a LOT better in the recent years. I had a '12 Focus with some of the first Sync tech that Ford used. It was atrocious and was a general PIA. The new systems are significantly better.

@seanmclean is right though. There are some peculiarities to the UConnect that I wasn't a fan of. The heated seats is a really obvious one for me as well.

Of course I'm an "old school" guy, and would LOVE to have a high trim vehicle WITHOUT a screen at all. I hate the added interior light at night time, and I hate functions under "soft buttons" that change based on what screen you're on. Give me some physical buttons, with a nice red tinted backlighting, and let me drive instead of trying to operate an iPad to turn down the A/C, adjust the volume or otherwise adjust the vehicle systems.

They do have a button to turn the screen off . Lol

 

[2kwik4u]

They do have a button to turn the screen off . Lol

Some do. Some don't.

My '15 that button is buried about 16 menus deep. Wifes '18 Rogue is the same way. The Durango's and Jeeps have a screen off button.......BUT THEN.....Once the screen is off, you can't see what any of the current settings are. I don't want to have to look at a bright ass screen, ruin my night vision for a bit, just to adjust the temperature, move it the floor vents, or turn my seats off.

Don't even get me started on automatic climate control, and how shitty that works in transition seasons, or any of the automatic high beams, or wiper settings that are NEVER correct for the situation. I'll add in the "mismatch" between the dash and infotainment brightness that just about EVERY vehicle I've been in has. That feels like an easy problem to solve to me.

Maybe I should buy that '60's Suburban I keep talking about, put a modern drivetrain in it, and quite complaining Loved.....I mean absolutely LOVED the interior in this car. Red backlighting. No giant screen. Easy to use and find buttons with satisfying clicks. It was great!

 

[Adrian @ JB Solutions]

Totally agree. One of the biggest issues for me on my wife's unconnect. No buttons, for heated seats you push controls on the infotainment , then the heated seats. On my Ford you push a button, bmw a button.

You can make heated seat a dedicated full time on-screen button on the bottom menu. Same for the Screen Off button.

2kwik, I have different experience with the features. I never had an issue with the brightness, even then they give you an option to dim from nighttime mode. Auto climate works well, though it is a bit aggressive sometimes (we also don't have seasons here in FL, we have hot and cold-front). Auto-high beams have only engaged on a few trips, and that was on my 2013 but they worked beautifully. Windshield wipers - They never usually seem to be where I want them. They always randomly go off.... thats been on every single car I've owned. That probably has to do with Rain-X. Though on my wife's Tesla they work VERY good (thankfully because there isn't an easy way to change).

I am down for a 60's suburban retro-mod build thread though. Do it!

 

[2kwik4u]

You can make heated seat a dedicated full time on-screen button on the bottom menu. Same for the Screen Off button.

2kwik, I have different experience with the features. I never had an issue with the brightness, even then they give you an option to dim from nighttime mode. Auto climate works well, though it is a bit aggressive sometimes (we also don't have seasons here in FL, we have hot and cold-front). Auto-high beams have only engaged on a few trips, and that was on my 2013 but they worked beautifully. Windshield wipers - They never usually seem to be where I want them. They always randomly go off.... thats been on every single car I've owned. That probably has to do with Rain-X. Though on my wife's Tesla they work VERY good (thankfully because there isn't an easy way to change).

I am down for a 60's suburban retro-mod build thread though. Do it!

Would love to do a resto mod on an old 3-door suburban. Toss a new Duramax/Allison/2500 chassis under it. Revamp the interior slightly (folding/removable seats, and front captains chairs). The leave the exterior pretty well alone, and have some classic-ish wheels on there. I think it would make a helluva family hauler/boat dragger