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Gantlin FatSac 25ft'r is in!

Zuppy51

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Let us know how it goes?! It's on the top of my shopping list.
 

Wicked92

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Let us know how it goes?! It's on the top of my shopping list.
Worked awesome. Still working on my tie down technique but it def helped the wave considerably.

High quality. Very happy with it.
 

BC/Alberta

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Looks like you also installed TVs on your 255XD? How are they when the wakebooster is deployed? Any issues? Just got my 255xd (my first Yamaha) and I’m reluctant to install TVs without feedback about how they interact w/ the wakebooster.
 

Wicked92

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Looks like you also installed TVs on your 255XD? How are they when the wakebooster is deployed? Any issues? Just got my 255xd (my first Yamaha) and I’m reluctant to install TVs without feedback about how they interact w/ the wakebooster.
I installed Cobra Jets as i wanted influence at speed also. Im still in testing phase.

While i love how the boat performs with the CJs from a steering staindpoint only, im interested in also not dimishing its surf capabilities either.

The wake booster deployed directs water, (which ive verified by surfing behind the boat and watching the transom) right at the outside fins. It hits them and directs the water a lil different then what Yamaha intended. Did it ruin my wave? No....but i know its def impeding the boosters usefulness. TVs i would think are much worse with this as they are longer and also rotate directly into the incoming water path from the wake booster. The CJs i can adjust by moving down the fin further into the water and not into direct conflict.

Another thing to note is the CJs and the TVs also force you to straighten the nozzles. Does the booster work as well with the nozzles straight? Im not sure, thats why im still testing various setups and noting my findings.

So far ive tested CJs on and all the way up as per Jeffs suggestion if i kept the Surfpointe canted settings as the fins would only work at low speeds and not cause drag once beginning to get on plane, as a fin severly toed out in the front would just cause drag and make the boat struggle more, on top of the canted jets which take a lil thrust away while trying to move the stream into center of boat.

Ive tested straight nozzles with CJs all the way up, and thats where i saw the most conflict with the wakebooster water stream.

Ive now moved the CJs all the way down, to be the least intrusive to the wake boosters water stream and my nozzles are straight current. Going out testing this weekend.

Reason im hoping the straight nozzles work better and the CJs down not interfering little as possible is the boat needs a lil more thrust with all this weight im adding to the boat. I have the 25ft fatsac 850lbs, and have had to put almost 350lbs up front with only 2 on the boat and 1 in the water cause the boat had a real hard time getting up and starting the wave. Im also going to be resealing my pump tunnels to remove as much cavitation as i can.

A win win will be gaining the gas mileage and thrust from straight nozzles, while allowing the booster to do its job without fighting another flap in the water and having the steering enhancement the CJs provide both slow speed and high speed. The boat was awesome with the cjs at speed! I may even trace Jeffs shape on a sheet of aluminum i have here at shop and alter the top shape to completely be out of the wake boosters intended water path.

Photos provides are CJs up @ setting 5 vs 8

20210718_194009.jpg20210718_193951.jpg20210718_193812.jpg20210718_193801.jpg
 

BC/Alberta

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Thanks for the quick and comprehensive response. You have confirmed my decision to hold off until there is consensus about the best set up.
 

Wicked92

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Thanks for the quick and comprehensive response. You have confirmed my decision to hold off until there is consensus about the best set up.
im no expert, but looking at the pictures you cant tell me it doesnt NOT interfere. Right? I also verified behind boat. Is it enough to ruin? NO we went ropeless in all instances even in 6-10ft of water BUT...i want the cleanest wave possible.
 

blueturtle

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Have you had a chance to surf more with the CJ's installed. I like your idea of trimming the top corner. I'm thinking of ordering a set for my 255.
 

Wicked92

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Have you had a chance to surf more with the CJ's installed. I like your idea of trimming the top corner. I'm thinking of ordering a set for my 255.
Not yet, im also going to trace the outer fin shape and make a modified set to test with also while im waiting to get back in the water.
 

Zuppy51

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Just to clarify, that on our AR250, with CJ fins and Wake Booster. No ballast, wake is shaping up really well, and the kids and wife can all surf rope less. The board is key, we are using the Hyperlite landlock. 5'9". The other boards we tried so far, no go for rope less.

Me only occasionally. I need more ballast. (I'm 6'5" 265lb)...
I've ordered the transom bag, hopefully will have more pic's soon.

Izzy1.jpeg
 
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wvuhops

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Just curious if anyone has had more insight on using CJ with the wakeboost system? I also have a 255XD and haven't found a thread with any definitive results on whether they impact the wakesurf wave or not. I'm leaning toward getting a set of CJ's to improve the slow speed tracking and high speed turning but since it does well enough on its own, I don't want to ruin the wakesurfing ability.
 

Wicked92

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Just curious if anyone has had more insight on using CJ with the wakeboost system? I also have a 255XD and haven't found a thread with any definitive results on whether they impact the wakesurf wave or not. I'm leaning toward getting a set of CJ's to improve the slow speed tracking and high speed turning but since it does well enough on its own, I don't want to ruin the wakesurfing ability.
ive modified my cjs.

Moving the jets back to straight def impacted my wave quality. The whole purpose of the wake booster is the knock the jet away from the wave face. Also with the cjs the directed water from the wakebooster was hitting the outer fin causing another disturbance. I made a new set of outter fins and trimmed the upper portion so it didnt interfere with the boosters water flow. I then put my nozzles back to surfpointe angles and ran spacers to make sure the cjs were perpendicular to the back of the boat (straight like the articulating keel).

I plan on over the winter designing something to do away with the spacers and have an adjustable pivot on the outer fin so i can easily set the angles and lock down.
 

TX_Mercenary

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new to the jet boating world. but quickly learning exponentially from you guys. awesome write up.
any updates? how many inches did you remove from the top? or your goal in mind was to make it level with planning plate(that was enough to remove any disturbance)? also, when you say you went back to surfpointe angles, you mean pointing your nozzles inwards by 1/8 turn from center?
very curious how you are going to keep the outside fins perpendicular, maybe using a mini turnbuckle type of mechanical device?
do you plan on making the inside fins perpendicular? or is that moot?
 
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Cobra Jet Steering LLC

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Sadly you can not make your own fin modified or not you can make the additional modification and add it to a fin or change the shape of the fin but in order to do what you did even for your own use you have to get a license from the patent owner of the original fin and the fin must be purchased or licensed from the patent holder.
The way lawyers explain it, if I patent a pencil and you invent an eraser you can not sell the pencil with the eraser attached.
My suggestion would be to purchase a fin and make the changes to it add what you want and make changes to the top etc once you purchased the original fin you can do with it what you like.
But you can not make your own so that is it in a nut shell but don't take my word for it ask a patent lawyer.
Also I am required to say cease and desist.
I know most people don't understand this so please discuss it with a patent lawyer I have no problem discussing licensing etc but I have a lot of money invested in my patents so I must protect them. I hope you understand. I welcome a discussion on this . Also I just looked at your pictures again and if you wanted to use a fin below the paining surface just by a top fin and reverse mount it so it is under the plaining surface rather than on top no mod required just mount it on the outside of the nozzle in place of the super fin upside down!!
 
Last edited:

Wicked92

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Sadly you can not make your own fin modified or not you can make the additional modification and add it to a fin or change the shape of the fin but in order to do what you did even for your own use you have to get a license from the patent owner of the original fin and the fin must be purchased or licensed from the patent holder.
The way lawyers explain it, if I patent a pencil and you invent an eraser you can not sell the pencil with the eraser attached.
My suggestion would be to purchase a fin and make the changes to it add what you want and make changes to the top etc once you purchased the original fin you can do with it what you like.
But you can not make your own so that is it in a nut shell but don't take my word for it ask a patent lawyer.
Also I am required to say cease and desist.
I know most people don't understand this so please discuss it with a patent lawyer I have no problem discussing licensing etc but I have a lot of money invested in my patents so I must protect them. I hope you understand. I welcome a discussion on this . Also I just looked at your pictures again and if you wanted to use a fin below the paining surface just by a top fin and reverse mount it so it is under the plaining surface rather than on top no mod required just mount it on the outside of the nozzle in place of the super fin upside down!!
Jeff i think you need to slow down here with all the patent talk and lawyers. I BOUGHT YOUR FINS.

I dont need a license from you or anyone to modify the fins i bought from you to work better for my intentions. I can also make a fin for my boat as I see fit with my own material or a combination of, as im the end user. Im not selling your fin shape, or offering to make copies of it. I would never in my life think of stealing someones work. BUT i will look for areas of improvement or additonal ways it can perform for my benefit, and my benefit only. Im doing this for my personal boat, im not selling them, nor did i solicit anything in that form. The reason I traced my CJ fins i bought from you was so i didnt screw up that set if i made a mistake in cutting or my testing didnt pan out how i suspected. Nothing more, nothing less.

I would think a smarter approach would be, hey bud, i see what you are trying to do, let me know how the testing goes. Ever think it might be something you could incorporate? Seeing as the majority of your designs we way BEFORE the wakebooster came out.
 

Wicked92

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new to the jet boating world. but quickly learning exponentially from you guys. awesome write up.
any updates? how many inches did you remove from the top? or your goal in mind was to make it level with planning plate(that was enough to remove any disturbance)? also, when you say you went back to surfpointe angles, you mean pointing your nozzles inwards by 1/8 turn from center?
very curious how you are going to keep the outside fins perpendicular, maybe using a mini turnbuckle type of mechanical device?
do you plan on making the inside fins perpendicular? or is that moot?
I cut it to make it level with the planning surface. With them unaltered and even at the lowest settings the wakebooster water flow still smacked into the fin. Like i said im trying to clean up the wave as much as possible.

I went back to surfpointe angles also. So temporarily i spaced the fin out to correct the angle to make sure the fin was pointing perfectly perpendicular to the stern of the boat. I measured both outter fins to the center articulating keel to make sure everything was square etc. Surfpointe, gimmick initially or not def helps, my boat didnt see that drastic of an improvement with straight nozzles, so i wanted the added benefit of getting the jets more toward the center. Surfpointe is about 1/2 difference on the cables. Say your cables are 11 3/4 when the nozzles are dead straight (thats my measurement) you want 12 1/4 and 11 1/4. I got a buddy who works at yamaha get me the shop manual pictures they want 12.3 and 11.3 which is based on a 11.8 inch straight nozzle measurement.

I would like to design FOR MYSELF, some way of having the fins mounted to the planning surface but have the ability to rotate to get to perpendicular then lock down. Richt now my washers on the outside fin and some by hand "teaking and bending" of the mock up fins i cut out of thinner than Jeffs CJ material.
 

Cobra Jet Steering LLC

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I tried to advise you that you can not make any patented item for your own use without the permission of the owner of the patent not for any use not even your own, check with a lawyer and he will advise you of that and he will also probably tell you why I told you this. it is sad that you think otherwise. Because infringing on a patent not knowing it was patented is not a defense in federal court but knowingly infringing allows the patent holder to ask the court for a triple judgement award. I want you to be sure you understand this. I tried to be nice about it but you MUST CEASE AND DESIST!!!!! I pay a lot of money to patent lawyers and I follow their direction so take the smart approach and save yourself a lot of problems and just destroy the one you made if you need to modify some get with me and discuss this . but if you show this to a patent lawyer he will probably ruin your day advising you how wrong you are. This is very serious .
 
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