Slalom Skiing behind 187?

[Bizz]

Hey,

I was checking out a GTS 187 the other day. My friends and I are into slalom skiing and wakeboarding. I realize that those will have different ideal boats. I am just looking around for opinions on what might be the best fit. When checking out the GTS 187 I was really impressed with the roominess of it and the bang for buck performance you get with it. However I am worried about how well it will track when pulling a slalom skier through a course. I am not quite at that level yet, but since I just moved onto a lake I can see me getting to that point in a few years. Would the boat get pulled around a lot more than a dedicated ski boat? I know have read about other skier not liking to ski behind jet boats but I do know this is a new hull design for a jet boat so perhaps it will be better? Also how would it do pulling a wake boarder? Could it handle excess water in the bilge or a skirt to generate the big wake for a wakeboarder?

How would it compare in these regards to say a used Malibu response?

Like I said, I was impressed with the layout of the boat and the performance you seem to get for the (relatively) reasonable price for a new boat. But I worry it might not live up to what we want when we start to get more extreme later.

Glastron Pros:
Roomie layout allows for very accessible lounging times.
Style is bitchin
Good performance for value
Very shallow draft for my rather shallow lake front area for docking

Cons:
I am reading that jet boats are not ideal for water sports especially if I want to get more into those.


Malibu Pros:
5.7 liter 350 HP engine tickles me where it matters and will have good torque
Known commodity for skiing and I would think could be modified for decent wakeboarding
Also Good style
Also shallow draft but not quite as shallow (worried if my lake has an extra shallow day I could bend the prop or any possible hull fins before I am able to move the boat, will have to ask around about lake level fluctuations)

Cons:
Engine is right in the way of the lounging area
Likely have to buy used to be affordable


Would one be able to attach fins to the glastron or otherwise modify it to help it track with a slalom skier behind it?

I suppose this is all premature since we are probably at least a year off from buying our long term boat solution but it is fun to think about. Especially with the options I am looking at here. Looking for honest opinions.

Context for use: smallish inland lake for putzing around, wakeboarding, skiing and zipping around when I feel like it. Minimal traffic.

 

[Joey Martinez]

I own a seadoo jetboat about the same size and my friend has the 201 glastron jet boat dont let the wakeboard forums intimidate you on boats they like there inboard boats. I ride on my GF parents Malibu 22mxz and its a great boat but I pull my friends fine behind my jetboat I put fat sacs in and even surfed behind my boat.

you can get fins to go on the jet drive @genwrx just put them on his and I know he wants to slalom behind his boat im sure he will chime in here and later in the summer give you a more detail on the handling.

 

[genwrx]

Welcome Bizz, i was gonna get the 187 also but went for the 207 instead, tiny bit more seating all around, 2 more speakers, and a bigger fuel tank. definitely will keep these threads updated on how slalom skiing is on it, also the whole boat in general and keep an eye on the other post about how the fins (thrust vectors) handle and work out, next time i get the boat out will be the first time with the fins.

 

[Speedling]

Whatever fins you get they can be loaded/locked to stay down pretty much all the time so that you have great tracking during pull sports. I know the old school cobra fins would totally keep you planted but they didn't spring up.
The jet boat is never the BEST at any one thing, but does a lot of things well.

 

[Bizz]

@Joey: Sounds like your friends enjoy the wakeboarding jet boat experience so that is good. Have you wakeboarded behind your boat or do you try to use the Malibu for yourself because you have ready access to a dedicated wakeboard boat?

@genwrx: I would be stoked to hear your experience about slaloming behind a jet boat with tracking fins. I have heard the center wake can be a little sloppy but that's not really that much of a concern for me. As long as I don't ride directly through upspray from the jet and the side wakes aren't super high (I am guessing they wouldn't be due to the extremely small draft of a jet boat) then I would be fine. I am going back and forth about the 187 vs the 207 (also considering something like a Malibu Response). The extra room form 207 might be nice but it also add like 500 lbs dry weight so I might like the lighter boat for better performance/pulls...then again maybe the extra weight would help it track better for slaloming?...fun to think about though.

@Speedling: What is your favorite opening? I used to play terran in Wings of Liberty and loved blue flame hellion openings...those tended to make people pretty mad though. Are there good fins that will go up and down? I think I would mainly want to use them for slalom skiing and then have them up for spinning about and docking the boat (have a rather shallow dock area, hence the appeal of a jet boat with small draft). I am thinking about a Glastron jet boat because I am hoping that with some minor modifications it will be able to do each thing I want pretty well, though won't be the best at it, and I'll get the advantages of having that cool back end and shallow draft.

Though to be honest I used to ski behind an old Rinker Wedge fresh out of the late 70s/early 80s. It had a "120 hp" engine in it. The starter was dodgy so I used to use a screwdriver to short out/bypass it to get the engine started. Took some convincing to get the insurance company to insure it. Would plane out with a slalom skier behind it in 12 seconds flat (I might be being generous there). So pretty much anything would be a massive upgrade from what I was used to about 7 years ago. Good thing to come out of it is that my form for deep start on one ski is impeccable.

 

[Bizz]

Sorry to bombard the forums. Another issue I was seeing was speed control. Seems like the lower torque of jet motors and less surface area of the impellers could make speed control for slalom skiing through a course tough? Again these are all on like forums from 2010 and past (most from 2008 or past actually) so these seem like older hulls and older motors.

 

[Joey Martinez]

I go wake to wake on my jet boat but thats about all I do I am no pro at wakeboarding but ya I can pull the back of my boat if I carve really hard because I don't have fins where as the Malibu I could do what ever and it would never move an inch and that thing makes some serious wakes that can be intimidating when I first started haha. It would defiantly good starter boat but im sure if you become closer to intermediate or pro you might have to move on to a dedicated boat its hard getting as much ballast on my boat haha.

 

[waterboy]

@Bizz Reading through this, all of the responses were good. Then I came across your comment about wanting to run the course, speed control etc. We have been slaloming behind our boats for years. Let's reset expectations a bit here though.

A jet boat is a good all around boat, good for tubing, skiing behind, hanging out, you name it. Once you start comparing it to running a slalom course as compared to a "ski" boat, you are comparing apples and oranges. If you are expecting that type of performance, a jet boat is not for you.

As I said, we have been slaloming behind ours for years. For recreational lake skiing... speed control is fine, I don't yank the back of the boat (too much), I don't fly across the wakes because they are a bit steep, etc. I can have a good time out there though and run it hard. It's lake skiing, not course skiing.

The jet wash is not an issue to me at all. Any deep V hull will throw a wake that you don;t want to ski across at speed, that's why Nautiques and other have flat bottom boats. If you are expecting a ski boat experience, you won;t get it.

I hope that helps a bit more. I think any of the jet boats are that way though. But really any open bowrider type will be the same. A Sea Ray or Chapparal standard boat will throw the same wakes though too.

Good luck in your search.

 

[Speedling]

@Joey: Sounds like your friends enjoy the wakeboarding jet boat experience so that is good. Have you wakeboarded behind your boat or do you try to use the Malibu for yourself because you have ready access to a dedicated wakeboard boat?

@genwrx: I would be stoked to hear your experience about slaloming behind a jet boat with tracking fins. I have heard the center wake can be a little sloppy but that's not really that much of a concern for me. As long as I don't ride directly through upspray from the jet and the side wakes aren't super high (I am guessing they wouldn't be due to the extremely small draft of a jet boat) then I would be fine. I am going back and forth about the 187 vs the 207 (also considering something like a Malibu Response). The extra room form 207 might be nice but it also add like 500 lbs dry weight so I might like the lighter boat for better performance/pulls...then again maybe the extra weight would help it track better for slaloming?...fun to think about though.

@Speedling: What is your favorite opening? I used to play terran in Wings of Liberty and loved blue flame hellion openings...those tended to make people pretty mad though. Are there good fins that will go up and down? I think I would mainly want to use them for slalom skiing and then have them up for spinning about and docking the boat (have a rather shallow dock area, hence the appeal of a jet boat with small draft). I am thinking about a Glastron jet boat because I am hoping that with some minor modifications it will be able to do each thing I want pretty well, though won't be the best at it, and I'll get the advantages of having that cool back end and shallow draft.

Though to be honest I used to ski behind an old Rinker Wedge fresh out of the late 70s/early 80s. It had a "120 hp" engine in it. The starter was dodgy so I used to use a screwdriver to short out/bypass it to get the engine started. Took some convincing to get the insurance company to insure it. Would plane out with a slalom skier behind it in 12 seconds flat (I might be being generous there). So pretty much anything would be a massive upgrade from what I was used to about 7 years ago. Good thing to come out of it is that my form for deep start on one ski is impeccable.

Zerg.
I build overlords. Lots of them.

 

[robert843]

I agree completely with @waterboy if you are strictly looking for a ski/wake boarding boat you need to get a dedicated boat for that as you will likely be disappointed from any other boat jet or not or you will keep eye balling the dedicated boats and wind up upgrading to one any way so the old rule applies buy your second boat first. In the same sense the overall ride and driving experience is different in the direct drive boats that are dedicated to wake boarding and skiing and the overall pleasure boating experience won't be the same so decide on what's most important to you. If you plan to do a lot of cruising and adventure boating the jet maybe an option but if those things do not interest you and skiing and wake boarding are your primary concern buy a boat dedicated to that. Most people who buy a jet boat want a little of everything but understand that it will not be perfect at anything.

 

[Bizz]

@Robert and waterboy

Thank you very much for the honest insight. This is what I figured would be the case. I really do love the overall leisure look of the back end of the Glastron jet boats. It just looks like so much fun to have that stadium seating in the back. At the same time I do really think some of my friends and I will be skiing and wakeboarding quite a bit which would make the ski boat more worth it. Part of me was hoping that with a few upgrades I could make the Glastron 187 passable enough to be able to use it for skiing and wakeboarding and still have the more party feel to it. So yeah I will have to do some soul searching. Am still looking forward to what genwrx experiences with the fins on his boat. Any idea why there isn't that stadium style back seating on some of the mid engine ski boats? There can't be engine in both the mid section AND the back end can there?

 

[Joey Martinez]

alot of the newer models of wake boarding boats are adding seats on the back but because on most lakes you cant ride back there while the boat is in motion its just for sitting and relaxing

 

[robert843]

@Robert and waterboy

Thank you very much for the honest insight. This is what I figured would be the case. I really do love the overall leisure look of the back end of the Glastron jet boats. It just looks like so much fun to have that stadium seating in the back. At the same time I do really think some of my friends and I will be skiing and wakeboarding quite a bit which would make the ski boat more worth it. Part of me was hoping that with a few upgrades I could make the Glastron 187 passable enough to be able to use it for skiing and wakeboarding and still have the more party feel to it. So yeah I will have to do some soul searching. Am still looking forward to what genwrx experiences with the fins on his boat. Any idea why there isn't that stadium style back seating on some of the mid engine ski boats? There can't be engine in both the mid section AND the back end can there?

The reason I believe you do not see this is in the center engine direct drive boats you still need storage and since this massive engine block sits in the middle of the boat I'm assuming they are moving the storage to the rear and since its a staging area they keep it flat for ease of in and out of the boat. Most companies are moving away from the center engine boats and switching to the rear engine direct drive boats as its a lot more functional. If it where me I would look at more rear engine direct drive boats I know they produce a little more wake but over probably a more fun boat with party style seating in the boat.