Sorry for another Speaker and Amp Thread

[Rushfan67]

Let me first start out by saying I’m sorry for another thread on speakers and amps. I have been searching the forums and just need some more clarity on a few things and I hope you guys can help me. So here it goes....

I have a 2019 SX190 in which we all know the stock sound is terrible. I ordered yesterday and they will be here today (4) Polk DB651’s to replace the stock speakers. I am good with being able to install these.

Next is the Amp... so in many of the posts I found, many of you mentioned the Clarion XC1410. It seems that that amp is very hard to find now so my thought was the XC2410 to power the (4) DB’s. So my questions are:

On the SX190 would it be ok to mount the amp in the storage area in the helm or should it be back near the battery compartment.

I want to add a sub, any thoughts where would be the best place to install it in the 190?

I believe I would need another amp to power the sub, would it be best to add another XC2410 to power it.

I apologize as I have never done a amp or sub install, done a few basic car stereos and that’s it. From all the posts I have read I have tried to understand about the wiring , ohms and different brands of speakers and amps. I truly want to learn and do this myself and not just pay someone to install it. Any help or guidance will be very much appreciated.

 

[tdonoughue]

On the mounting location, I can tell you generally (not having a 190) that for me the analysis on the location (helm/battery) worked out to a) there is plenty of physical space to put the amp in both locations, b) if you put the amp in the helm, the existing speakers are all wired to there, but you have to run the power up there, and c) if you put the amp by the batteries, the power run is much shorter/easier, but then you have to run all the speakers there. I opted for behind the helm, but I don't think there is necessarily a 'right' answer on that one.

I would not do another XC2410 for the sub. I don't have one to recommend, but you only need a single channel amp to run the sub. The XC2410 is a 4 channel (that you can bridge to 2 channels)--that means that half of your amp will be unused. The exception would be if there is another project planned about which you have not told us (example: tower speakers/bar). Then you could bridge 2 channels to the amp and have the tower/bar on the other 2 channels.

That said, I am not an expert as some around here. Just giving you what I know so far... Welcome to be corrected by others.

 

[Dantheman7292]

I just bought a 2019 AR195 and ill be the first to tell you that the Polks do not need to be amplified!!. the stock head unit already over powers them. I have just 25 hours on my boat and I'm already considering a JL upgrade because they start to distort at about 80% volume. I don't see them lasting till my next service to be honest.

 

[Mainah]

Happy to help another Pats Fan since I know how hated we are in most parts. Since you are in Charleston now and I assume going to be doing a fair amount of salt and brackish water boating I strongly recommend you only consider one brand for amps and speakers if you intend to keep the boat a while. That brand is JL Audio. Yes I know pricey. There is none better at standing up to salt air, salt water, moisture, and uv rays. Jl makes the only completely sealed amps that I am aware of and this protects everything from corrosion. They could even run underwater. Their speaker standards are also the very best for this as well. For the sub a JL IB will get the job done. I would strongly recommend a JL m700/5 of m1000/5 depending on how much power you need for the sub you choose. Keep in mind JL ratings are real and everyone else tends to be inflated.

I know you already ordered them but I very strongly recommend against the Polk DBs in general and and even more so around salt water, salt air, etc.. I know because I have had some. The finish on the grills will be the first thing to go particularly with the silver grills. Otherwise they sound good and just too bad they degrade cosmetically so fast.

If looking to stay on a tight budget and get the most out of the DBs then make sure you select a a class D amp that has a high pass crossover. Cutting everything under 80hz will make those dbs sing much louder and cleaner. As @Dantheman7292 is experiencing any full range connected to the stock head unit will distort without a highpass cross over as the head unit is sending stuff to the speakers they can't handle. An amp with a crossover will make a very discernible difference and really should be used. If there is a crossover option in headunit as there is on some high end car stuff today certainly make use of that. Another option would be inline bass blockers but once you buy those you might as well have purchased a cheap amp.

 

[Dantheman7292]

Thanks i didn’t know that just adding an amp would benefit the factory speakers. I figured they were already over powered.

 

[Mainah]

With a clean unclipped signal within the boundaries of the sound spectrum the speaker is best at they can take a lot more power and play a lot louder. Some will say no such thing as too much power if not clipping which is not quite true. With too much power it is possible to melt the voice coil or do other damage. I start by testing the headhunt to see where it clips at on its volume knob, I set the amp crossovers and then tune the amps below clipping and in rare cases a bit lower when the amp has too much power. Then I fine tune. No everyone has the equipment to do that just knowing that most headhunts clip above 90% volume and that most full ranges should be high passed no lower than 80hz is a good start. Most amps won't need more than 1/3 to 1/2 gain before they start clipping depending on the input source.

I like using my recent truck project as an example. I pulled the factory headunit out and swapped in a high end one with built in electronic crossover settings. I added one amp for the sealed sub I added. The difference in everything was immense as I was able to get easily more than twice the clean volume out of the factory door and dash speakers by cutting the lows from them in the headunit (more clean power from the headunit too) and sending it all back to the subwoofer. No one who heard it before believed they were the same factory door speakers and powered by just the headunit. It is all about clean power in the right frequency range for the speaker. the best range for each speaker is usually quite a bit inside the rated response range. Full range speakers rated at 20hz to 20khz are full of BS.

 

[Rushfan67]

On the mounting location, I can tell you generally (not having a 190) that for me the analysis on the location (helm/battery) worked out to a) there is plenty of physical space to put the amp in both locations, b) if you put the amp in the helm, the existing speakers are all wired to there, but you have to run the power up there, and c) if you put the amp by the batteries, the power run is much shorter/easier, but then you have to run all the speakers there. I opted for behind the helm, but I don't think there is necessarily a 'right' answer on that one.

I would not do another XC2410 for the sub. I don't have one to recommend, but you only need a single channel amp to run the sub. The XC2410 is a 4 channel (that you can bridge to 2 channels)--that means that half of your amp will be unused. The exception would be if there is another project planned about which you have not told us (example: tower speakers/bar). Then you could bridge 2 channels to the amp and have the tower/bar on the other 2 channels.

That said, I am not an expert as some around here. Just giving you what I know so far... Welcome to be corrected by others.

Thanks @tdonoughue, I really appreciate the help and the advice.

 

[Rushfan67]

I just bought a 2019 AR195 and ill be the first to tell you that the Polks do not need to be amplified!!. the stock head unit already over powers them. I have just 25 hours on my boat and I'm already considering a JL upgrade because they start to distort at about 80% volume. I don't see them lasting till my next service to be honest.

Thanks @Dantheman7292, at the advice of @Mainah I returned the DB’s and I am rethinking my strategy on the speakers due to the salt. I appreciate your advice. Thank you!

 

[Rushfan67]

Happy to help another Pats Fan since I know how hated we are in most parts. Since you are in Charleston now and I assume going to be doing a fair amount of salt and brackish water boating I strongly recommend you only consider one brand for amps and speakers if you intend to keep the boat a while. That brand is JL Audio. Yes I know pricey. There is none better at standing up to salt air, salt water, moisture, and uv rays. Jl makes the only completely sealed amps that I am aware of and this protects everything from corrosion. They could even run underwater. Their speaker standards are also the very best for this as well. For the sub a JL IB will get the job done. I would strongly recommend a JL m700/5 of m1000/5 depending on how much power you need for the sub you choose. Keep in mind JL ratings are real and everyone else tends to be inflated.

I know you already ordered them but I very strongly recommend against the Polk DBs in general and and even more so around salt water, salt air, etc.. I know because I have had some. The finish on the grills will be the first thing to go particularly with the silver grills. Otherwise they sound good and just too bad they degrade cosmetically so fast.

If looking to stay on a tight budget and get the most out of the DBs then make sure you select a a class D amp that has a high pass crossover. Cutting everything under 80hz will make those dbs sing much louder and cleaner. As @Dantheman7292 is experiencing any full range connected to the stock head unit will distort without a highpass cross over as the head unit is sending stuff to the speakers they can't handle. An amp with a crossover will make a very discernible difference and really should be used. If there is a crossover option in headunit as there is on some high end car stuff today certainly make use of that. Another option would be inline bass blockers but once you buy those you might as well have purchased a cheap amp.

Thanks @Mainah, I sent the Polk’s back. I’m going to rethink my approach a little more. I want to do all the work myself and I have no issue with the speakers of course but the amp scares the hell out of me as I have never done one before. Thanks for all the great advice especially on the DB’s.

 

[Mainah]

Thanks @Mainah, I sent the Polk’s back. I’m going to rethink my approach a little more. I want to do all the work myself and I have no issue with the speakers of course but the amp scares the hell out of me as I have never done one before. Thanks for all the great advice especially on the DB’s.

No idea what your budget is but if you can justify it here are my recommendations. 4 jl m650 (not mx) or if you can make larger holes jl m770, and a jl m10ib (you may be able to find a deals since they just came out with a new models with internal lighting, try odin at earmark marine). Then for the amp a jl m700/5 will drive all those speakers in a single unit but not be able to drive them all the way to their max. Honestly will be plently loud and clean. Real easy to tune with a volt meter as jl is so consistent in their build. Start with 80hz high pass on the full ranges and 120hz low pass on the sub. Download f generator pro app for a few bucks from one of the app stores and play 1k sine wave test tone with the headunit at 90 percent for the full range channels and 50hz test tone for the sub channel. Adjust gain to the volatge specified in the jl manual. Done.

I am not familiar enough with a 190 to recommend mounting but if accessible the helm is a good place. Use shield rca cable and 4awg flexs wire from knuknoceptz. Inline fuse between the battery and the battery switch then direct connections to the amp to simplify.

All of this will add up to well over $1k. All of this will hold up to salt water, salt air, uv, and heat like nothing else. It does come at a price and many opt for other stuff. I have no real world experience with how other mid range brands like kicker hold up so just can’t make any other recommendations. I can say nothing else is even close considering talking fully sealed amp and speakers hand built in Florida. Search youtube for videos of the insane environmental testing that JL does and of their speaker assembly line. As for the wire others like jl use the same stuff in their high end but knuknoceptz has the best price on the best wire. The wire is also something to worry about corooding and their kolossus flex wire will not and is pretty much the same as underwater welding wire.