Towing: Diesel vs. Gas

[AZDANSX230HO]

I've got the 3.55 rear end. I set cruise on the interstate about 75-77 empty, more like 70-72 towing. I drive it pretty lightly from an acceleration perpective

Might want to check with the dealership on any software updates on the ECM.

 

[waterboy]

Do you mean - something like this:
http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?zip=77002&endYear=2017&modelCode1=EXCURSION&showcaseOwnerId=54376346&makeCode1=FORD&startYear=1981&firstRecord=0&searchRadius=50&showcaseListingId=415241814&mmt=[FORD[EXCURSION[]][]]&listingId=430185646&Log=0

I love the idea! Is 24k listed in the right range? That is a lot of a car.

I am familair with them but have not shopped so I can say. Where the Expedition is built on an F150 frame, that is built on the F250 frame. Yeah they are quite a monster. A friend of mine had one years ago and it is huge. I just glanced at the pictures on that one. Being that it is a car dealer selling it, I am sure it is in line. As @AZDANSX230HO said, that thing is just getting broken in and does sound like it could be a decent buy.

They may not have all of the modern features we see on cars now, but they were pretty well outfitted for the time.

 

[viggen]

Gas vs diesel debate is never ending at RV forums

It really boils down to how deep your pockets are and also how far you drive

Diesels cost more to buy and maintain however they last longer and can tow more.

If you can afford it the miles driven and extra cost of ownership isn't a concern. For those that money is a concern, with RV's most state at least 10,000 miles a year before a diesel is cheaper to operate vs gas.

A gas truck will tow a boat up a hill, it will just be slower.

 

[billyb]

Do you have any suggestions for a diesel SUV with a 3rd row bench/seat?
Anyone uses a Durango to tow?
These vm motori diesels seem very capable.

EDIT: Q7/X5/MB are out of my price range, I would like to buy new.

My wife just turned in her 2008 Chrysler aspen. It was a great vehicle to passengers and towing. I would recommend one if you can find low miles.

The aspen was built on the Durango frame, so as long as you have a hemi in the Durango, you should be fine towing your boat.

Edit: sorry, missed the diesel part of your question.

 

[swatski]

My wife just turned in her 2008 Chrysler aspen. It was a great vehicle to passengers and towing. I would recommend one if you can find low miles.

The aspen was built on the Durango frame, so as long as you have a hemi in the Durango, you should be fine towing your boat.

Edit: sorry, missed the diesel part of your question.

That is an awesome SUV, very surprised they stopped making it. If they continued and offered a diesel, like for durango, it would be a very easy choice!

 

[Rob9550]

I found a few Rams and F250s that are nice. What years did the Rams have transmission issues? I have also heard that the F250 has an issue with the front suspension. Any truth? Hell, I may just stick with Chevy...

 

[blacksapphirez]

i pull away from most cars at a stop light with a boat

 

[swatski]

i pull away from most cars at a stop light with a boat

Of course you do.

 

[2nazt]

Did my first long tow with my EcoDiesel to the keys and avg 18.5-20 towing round trip and mid 20's without the boat. Love it so far!

 

[DCB-270]

Diesel for towing. 08 Cummings 6.7 260 k Revmax transmission. EFI live tune.

 

[su laxplayer21]

There is no solid return on investment when it comes to diesel anymore. Diesel fuel used to be the least expensive, less refined fuel compared to gasoline. The introduction of ULSD, $.06 more per gallon fed tax and other economical factors increased the price to where it is today. New diesels have so much emissions technology on them that the price for a 3/4 ton+ diesel from the big three is a $8500 "option". If there wasn't a HP/TQ war out there between the big three companies I am sure we could see some really efficient diesels! However, marketing sells trucks... and people love to have bragging rights!

My last three 3/4 ton trucks have all been diesel, and I can honestly say I would never go back to gas for my personal truck if I can always swing it. I have a 2013 6.7 F250, with 400hp/800ft/lbs, which makes driving it a lot of fun. Big lazy power makes pulling loads enjoyable. I am looking forward to the release of the 2017 F250-450. The 6.7 will have 445hp/925ft/lbs of torque! As much as I like the O'l Reliable 7.3... the twice as powerful 6.7 is on a completely different playing field.

 

[viggen]

I believe diesel is still less refined and in some areas/states diesel is still the cheapest. Here in Ohio it usually costs more for a gallon of diesel vs gas but that's not always the case. Sometimes it's $.25-$.50 more a gallon and just a few weeks ago it was $.50 less for diesel.

In RV land it's more like $100,000+ more for a diesel

The return on investment is still there and like always it's about how many miles you drive. If you put 25,000 miles a year on the vehicle and keep it for several years it will pay off to have the diesel. If you put 2,500 miles a year on the vehicle then gas is a better option from a $$$$ standpoint.

 

[LTM1964]

I think another factor in the diesel vs. gas debate is trade-in or resale value. Even though I probably can't show where fuel savings will cover the $7K I paid to get the diesel on my F250. When I get ready to trade or sell it after around 125K miles, I believe I will get a large chunk of that back as there should be a demand for 4x4 diesel trucks. I would hate to try to sell a high mileage gas F250 myself and I think it would take a big hit if I traded it in. If I have any significant diesel related repairs not covered by warranty, I will probably wish I had gotten rid of it sooner. Regardless, I enjoy towing and hauling with the diesel.

 

[AZDANSX230HO]

I paid 45K for my 2012 F-250 Crew Cab Diesel 1 1/2 years ago, got damn near that on trade-in a month ago. I will never go back to gas engines, towing with a diesel is a pure joy.

 

[su laxplayer21]

I believe diesel is still less refined and in some areas/states diesel is still the cheapest. Here in Ohio it usually costs more for a gallon of diesel vs gas but that's not always the case. Sometimes it's $.25-$.50 more a gallon and just a few weeks ago it was $.50 less for diesel.

In RV land it's more like $100,000+ more for a diesel

The return on investment is still there and like always it's about how many miles you drive. If you put 25,000 miles a year on the vehicle and keep it for several years it will pay off to have the diesel. If you put 2,500 miles a year on the vehicle then gas is a better option from a $$$$ standpoint.

Diesel is still less refined compared to gas, but much more refined compared to where it used to be prior to 2007/2010 when ULSD 15ppm of sulfur was mandated for 100% of highway diesels. This caused a roughly 2% decrease in mpg from fuel alone. Here in NY, (which isn't always a good example because of state taxes) Average regular price is $2.19, diesel is $2.39. So comparing apples to apples in the 2016 3/4 ton truck market (RV land would be different) I have this in fuel savings per year below:

Diesel: 25,000 miles/17mpg avg = 1470 gallons of fuel per year X $2.39 = $3513 yearly fuel expense
Gas: 25,000 miles/14mpg avg = 1785 gallons of fuel per year X $2.19 = $3909 yearly fuel expense

Diesel Savings Per Year = $396.00

The Ford 6.7 diesel is a $8500 option, lets figure you get half of the value back in resale.
$8500/2 = $4250/$396 = 10.7 years ROI.

This doesn't take into account the twice as expensive oil changes, the regularly changed fuel filters, and the consumption of DEF Fluid.
So the diesel savings per year is wiped out when you consider all of the other expenses involved. Not to mention the repairs on these high tech diesels is substantially more than any gas truck.
I'll still run my diesel though.

 

[AZDANSX230HO]

Diesel is still less refined compared to gas, but much more refined compared to where it used to be prior to 2007/2010 when ULSD 15ppm of sulfur was mandated for 100% of highway diesels. This caused a roughly 2% decrease in mpg from fuel alone. Here in NY, (which isn't always a good example because of state taxes) Average regular price is $2.19, diesel is $2.39. So comparing apples to apples in the 2016 3/4 ton truck market (RV land would be different) I have this in fuel savings per year below:

Diesel: 25,000 miles/17mpg avg = 1470 gallons of fuel per year X $2.39 = $3513 yearly fuel expense
Gas: 25,000 miles/14mpg avg = 1785 gallons of fuel per year X $2.19 = $3909 yearly fuel expense

Diesel Savings Per Year = $396.00

The Ford 6.7 diesel is a $8500 option, lets figure you get half of the value back in resale.
$8500/2 = $4250/$396 = 10.7 years ROI.

This doesn't take into account the twice as expensive oil changes, the regularly changed fuel filters, and the consumption of DEF Fluid.
So the diesel savings per year is wiped out when you consider all of the other expenses involved. Not to mention the repairs on these high tech diesels is substantially more than any gas truck.
I'll still run my diesel though.

It's worth the extra costs associated in the long run, most diesel engines if well maintained should run 400k miles or more, I have seen Duramax's hit a Million Miles:

https://www.facebook.com/highmilageduramaxdiesel/

 

[viggen]

Yes oil changes and other maintenance do cost more for diesel however the intervals I believe are longer.

My gas RV I would get 6-6.5 mpg going 65 mph sometimes worse, rarely better
X Inlaws diesel pusher would get 8.4 mpg with cruise set at 65

Most gas class A RV get similar mpg, DP can vary from 6.5-12 mpg

If I set cruise I would get about 5mpg due to the slightest incline (like a overpass in Florida) and it would shift down and floor it, thus no cruise for me.

Presently low test is $2.13 a gallon and diesel is $2.34 and premium is $2.57 thus surprisingly close to NY prices

I am searching for a used DP, pre DEF generation and am also debating selling my wrangler for a new wrangler, once they finally throw a diesel in there.

 

[Jgorm]

I had a c3500 4 for dually with the 454. It hauled my heavy 11.5' cab over camper easily. I was probably around 10k lb and could do 75 up huge grades. I sold that and got a 24' motorhome, e450 with the 7.3 psd, 13500lb. It's loud, and "slow". There is no intercooler on the van version, and that costs a lot of power. I drive off the egt gauge. I tune Ford's and could slap a tune on it for free, but it's already at the limit. 4" straight exhaust too. I get 10mpg over a dozen full ups. I talked to a guy with the v10 and nearly identical rv, said he gets 6!
I wanted a boat, so I needed a truck to pull it. I drove the ram trucks, gas then diesel, back to back, both brand new. I liked the hemi better. The diesel seems slow, and the hemi sounds way cooler. Then I drove a used ram with the Cummins. Loud AF, shaking at idle.

Down in socal there is not a lot of diesel. Usually if a station even has it, it's only at one pump.

Down here is not like Texas, diesel trucks are rare, and demand a huge premium. Looking at used trucks under 20k, the diesel seemed to be about $10k+ or 100k miles more compared to the gas.
I ended up with an excursion with the v10. Tons of power, tows easily up any grade, quite except at wot, and any pump works. It gets about 10mpg loaded or not.

 

[bronze_10]

My wife just turned in her 2008 Chrysler aspen. It was a great vehicle to passengers and towing. I would recommend one if you can find low miles.

The aspen was built on the Durango frame, so as long as you have a hemi in the Durango, you should be fine towing your boat.

Edit: sorry, missed the diesel part of your question.

I still tow with my 2005 durango wiuth the hemi!!! it will just about jerk the trailer out from under the boat!!

 

[MattFX4]

It's worth the extra costs associated in the long run, most diesel engines if well maintained should run 400k miles or more, I have seen Duramax's hit a Million Miles:

https://www.facebook.com/highmilageduramaxdiesel/

I've tried to convince myself to purchase a F250 using this argument, but let's be honest. We are guys and we like new shiny toys. Who keeps a vehicle long enough to put 400k miles on it? Heck, I'm 3 years in on a 2013 F150 with 38,000 miles that I bought new, and I got the new truck bug bad!