Carbon Seal Function and Explanation For Pre-mature Failures.

[Slugger55]

@Ron@Scarab where are we supposed to take our boats now? I have been told that my MarineMax dealer no longer services Scarab Boats... I didn't even get an answer as to where I am supposed to go now?? I just had a carbon seal go last fall and I was without my $34,000 boat for several weeks and was told we will get to it when we can. Their (MM) priority was to get new boat sales rigging done... Carbon seal went at 24 hours... due to a mis-alignment.. BRP ponied up and got it right, but now we (Floridians) are screwed because MM was the only dealer down here to take care of us...

 

[Neutron]

Is this the same type of carbon seal that Seadoo used in their skis since the begining of Seadoo time?
If so then why the problems now?
I have seen hundreds of jetskis with a carbon seal and tons of hours on them, none that leaked and could run on hose for a long time.
What gives?

 

[Neutron]

And, to put this into further perspective for you, on average if you can truly can afford a Scarab, you can afford a professional service. Scarab owners are an elite group of boat owners but if I have to explain that, you wouldn't understand anyway.

Really?

 

[Speedling]

@Ron@Scarab i appreciate you trying to help here!
You noticed a lot of us are the diy types and also pointed out that the chapp, scarab and glasstron all have the same setup.
Would you say that an average diy person could replace the seal themselves fairly easily? Like, could someone theoretically change seals out inexpensively every off season for a little extra piece of mind?

In fact, i have no idea how the yamaha system exactly keeps water from entering the same spot but i have taken the shaft put at least 50 times. Seems a bit of grease on it so i usually re-grease slightly. If the brp system of seals rely on water lubrication then they must have a very tight tolerance so i can see how that would heat up quickly. I wonder if there is a way to grease or oil bath it to "correct the deficiency there?
If i didn't have a yami i would look at a chapp myself because the boat show swayed me as far as quality on the brand over the cool looking scarab.

 

[Ronnie]

Glad I don't own a brp powered boat but have noticed there are a lot more complaints here about scarab boats than any other brp powered boats. I Also dont recall this being a (well known) problem in the last generation of seadoo boats. All of which indicates to me that this is more of a scarab qc problem not brp problem.

How does Yamaha's system differ? I've heard of the bearing going occasionally but it usually results in a slow/small leak and a lot of noise, nothing that would sink a boat quickly.

 

[Speedling]

Glad I don't own a brp powered boat but have noticed there are a lot more complaints here about scarab boats than any other brp powered boats. I Also dont recall this being a (well known) problem in the last generation of seadoo boats. All of which indicates to me that this is more of a scarab qc problem not brp problem.

How does Yamaha's system differ? I've heard of the bearing going occasionally but it usually results in a slow/small leak and a lot of noise, nothing that would sink a boat quickly.

And is that because it is more of a grease seal? I don't know what keeps water out of the yamahas! Basically i think on bigger boats these are called cutlass beatings.

 

[jpass]

Basically i think on bigger boats these are called cutlass beatings.

Sort of. A cutlass bearing usually lives outside the boat and in the "strut" that supports the driveshaft between the hull exit and prop. These are most seen in inboard or V-drive boats where the drive-line is fixed. Our Ski Nautique had one. If it failed, you never risked water intrusion as the bearing resides outside the boat. The biggest risk with wear was vibration that could lead to other types of damage if not fixed in time.

The seal where the shaft enters the hull is called a flax seal (basically wax infused rope) and is intended to "weep" a tad to allow for water to be used to keep the shaft from heating up where it meets the wax seal.

 

[Ron@Scarab]

@Ron@Scarab where are we supposed to take our boats now? I have been told that my MarineMax dealer no longer services Scarab Boats... I didn't even get an answer as to where I am supposed to go now?? I just had a carbon seal go last fall and I was without my $34,000 boat for several weeks and was told we will get to it when we can. Their (MM) priority was to get new boat sales rigging done... Carbon seal went at 24 hours... due to a mis-alignment.. BRP ponied up and got it right, but now we (Floridians) are screwed because MM was the only dealer down here to take care of us...


View attachment 59358 View attachment 59359

Go to Scarabjetboats.com and put in your Zip code, and it should come up with a dealer near you. Scarab has been setting up new dealers this entire year for this reason.

 

[ScarabMike]

Go to Scarabjetboats.com and put in your Zip code, and it should come up with a dealer near you. Scarab has been setting up new dealers this entire year for this reason.

Yea, good luck with that Joe, LOL. The two dealers near me are having "scheduling" issues, and the other doesn't have "the computer".

There are more people coming forward on their facebook page with issues. Its only a matter of time.

 

[Ron@Scarab]

@Ron@Scarab i appreciate you trying to help here!
You noticed a lot of us are the diy types and also pointed out that the chapp, scarab and glasstron all have the same setup.
Would you say that an average diy person could replace the seal themselves fairly easily? Like, could someone theoretically change seals out inexpensively every off season for a little extra piece of mind?

In fact, i have no idea how the yamaha system exactly keeps water from entering the same spot but i have taken the shaft put at least 50 times. Seems a bit of grease on it so i usually re-grease slightly. If the brp system of seals rely on water lubrication then they must have a very tight tolerance so i can see how that would heat up quickly. I wonder if there is a way to grease or oil bath it to "correct the deficiency there?
If i didn't have a yami i would look at a chapp myself because the boat show swayed me as far as quality on the brand over the cool looking scarab.

I can never measure a person's mechanical abilities that I don't know, but if they want to invest in the appropriate tools to do the job, and have some knowledge first, they could tackle this. I support DIY's, but some times, you might just be better off taking it to your dealer or a reputable facility if you're in over your head so to speak. It's just not worth it in my opinion.

The Yamaha has a bearing housing with a small shaft pressed into it that couples with a coupler to the back of the motor. The jet-pump will have an extended shaft with splines that will insert into that bearing housing from the back-side. It needs to be regularly greased on your service intervals. They do fail, but they are reliable. Also, the Yamaha's have a small coupler (the drive-shaft or pump shaft runs through this) hose with 2 clamps in the area under your pump clean-out area that will leak from corroded clamps (They snap off from corrosion). You should check those if you haven't if you are here in the south.

 

[Ron@Scarab]

Yea, good luck with that Joe, LOL. The two dealers near me are having "scheduling" issues, and the other doesn't have "the computer".

There are more people coming forward on their facebook page with issues. Its only a matter of time.

Which dealers are near you Mike claiming scheduling issues? I am not sure what you mean by Scheduling issues? Are they just busy or is it something else?

 

[ScarabMike]

Beach Marine, and Waylen Bay. They basically told me, I don't have time for you, Im not going to schedule you, and I don't care if you almost sunk your POS jetboat. And Riva says that carbon seals arent a warranty item, and they want $1500 to repair it. That was from the service manager in Pompano.

 

[Elio195HOI]

Beach Marine, and Waylen Bay. They basically told me, I don't have time for you, Im not going to schedule you, and I don't care if you almost sunk your POS jetboat. And Riva says that carbon seals arent a warranty item, and they want $1500 to repair it. That was from the service manager in Pompano.

@ScarabMike , If I'm not mistaken. Riva Pompano doesn't have a deal with scarab yet as I called them a few weeks ago before taking my boat over to @Ron@Scarab since I didn't want to take the 5 hour round trip ride. I'm happy I did, Ron knows his stuff and taking a look at his shop and speaking to him made me feel confident. I was told only their Riva Miami and Riva Key largo stores are authorized reps at the moment.

 

[Ron@Scarab]

Beach Marine, and Waylen Bay. They basically told me, I don't have time for you, Im not going to schedule you, and I don't care if you almost sunk your POS jetboat. And Riva says that carbon seals arent a warranty item, and they want $1500 to repair it. That was from the service manager in Pompano.

Mike, call Brad over at Waylen Bay in St. Augustine at 904-217-3778. They are 2 weeks out right now on service so be patient. He will let you set up an appointment to get your boat serviced for your current issues.

 

[ScarabMike]

Mike, call Brad over at Waylen Bay in St. Augustine at 904-217-3778. They are 2 weeks out right now on service so be patient. He will let you set up an appointment to get your boat serviced for your current issues.

They told me that they couldn't take care of the boat till September/October because they had too much work, and not enough techs. But ok, they keep changing their stories.

 

[Slugger55]

Wow!!

 

[Stantm]

Is there a step by step video of a carbon seal removal and replace for these boats. Has not happened yet would like to know if this is a DIY fix.

 

[Ron@Scarab]

This is to add to my proof of knowing what I have been saying here in this post (I finally had a spare moment) . Secondly, it is for those of you that don't know this, nor possibly was explained to you by your dealer at that time of purchase.

 

[Ron@Scarab]

They told me that they couldn't take care of the boat till September/October because they had too much work, and not enough techs. But ok, they keep changing their stories.

Nope, that story was true (by Waylen) , and they have more techs, but they are still behind per Brad, just like the rest of us. I hope it all works all out for you.

 

[Stantm]

Thank you Ron, I am new to this and I know this is a dumb question. Where would I supply the water to the drive line to say I need to trouble shoot the engine out of the water? I love to work on my previous boats (all stern drive) but I always did it safely and to manufactures specs.