2019 Yamaha AR190 - Wakesurf? or upgrade

[Lyons7]

We are looking at getting the 2019 AR190 but wondering if it will be possible to wakesurf without putting extra weight on the back of the boat? The 19ft seemed to be enough for us because we don't have any kids but we have friends over often and would like to be able to wake surf, wakeboard, tube etc. without any issues. The price point is nice but obviously lacks some upgrades compared to the other models. Trying to decide if its worth spending more and getting the 2019 AR210 or if the 190 is sufficient. Or should we be looking for a different model? Trying to stay between $40-$50k if we upgrade from the 190. Any thoughts are appreciated.

 

[RiverRat]

If you ever want to surf ropeless and weigh more than 80 lbs, you'll need ballast on any model of boat. However one custom fit transom bag will do the trick on the 19 footers.

 

[SCP1]

You should probably just buy my 195 and I will get a bigger boat, lol. Honestly if you have the space get a 210 is my two cents. Keep in mind if purchasing a 190 your going to need to up grade the cone to a Lucky 13 and even then with a ballast bag on the swim deck you may have issues. I had a 190 and now have a 195 and I’m almost certain I would not get up on plain with the ballast bag on the back of my 190. Any Yamaha model your going to need a custom ballast bag on the rear deck to surf well. We had no intentions of moving and our house would only fit a 19’. Hence the upgrade from a 190 to a 195. As I will never own a boat and not be able to keep it at home at least during the boating season. My parents had a bigger boat and had to store it and it was a huge inconvenience. However things change and now we moved and have a bigger garage. Soo a 21 or 24 maybe in our future.

 

[d_coyne1984]

The 190 series is really not a great boat if surfing is what you are looking for. It is a very light weight hull and there is not much of it on top of that. You can make it happen, but you'll need a lot of ballast to get the most out of it. If you want to make it work, I would definitely opt for the 195 over the 190. You'll really appreciate the extra power when plowing through the water while loaded down.

 

[Lyons7]

Appreciate the input from everyone. Would the AR 190 or 195 have issues tubing or wakeboarding? If so, it sounds like the AR 210 would probably be the best option for what we want to use the boat for. But is there a better boat that would fit our needs in the 40k price range? Obviously new to the boating scene, appreciate any feedback.

 

[2kwik4u]

I can't surf behind my '17 AR190. Not nearly enough wake back there. The boat is too light weight to make a decent wave. I've not read of anyone putting enough ballast in a 190 to surf. Several have done it in a 195 though. Same hull, just more power and bigger pump in the 195. A 190 SHOULD do it, but I'm not sure anyone has tested it. Wake Wedge and swim platform ballast bag should get you close. You'll also have to run the L13 cone nd seal the intake tunnel well to prevent the smaller 155mm pump (the 195's get a 160mm pump)from cavitating. That's a quick Saturday afternoon of work, and is easily doable at the ramp honestly.

All in, you're probably $2.5k-ish in options/accessories to do it. $250 L13 Cone. $350 Custom Ballast Bag. $350 Wake Wedge. $100-ish for pump to fill the bag. $1,200 Hydrophase GPS Speed Control. Still much less expensive than a bigger boat, but a cost none-the-less. I could have some of these numbers wrong, but it should be in the ballpark.......Keep in mind, you'll need the same things for a 195, minus the L13 cone.

Unless range is a concern, the 195 will make a better platform to start surfing with, mostly due to the increased pump diameter. The 195 burns significantly more fuel than the 190 under heavy loads, and has the same 30gal tank.

Wakeboard, WakeSkate, Water Ski (double and slalom), Hydrofoiling, and Tubing are all done with ease behind the 190. Plenty of power to pull even the larger slalom guys out of a deep water start. If the 19' boat fits your size needs, you can find gently used 195's for under $40k. @haknslash has one for sale right now I think.

*edit*......Forgot to comment about top speeds. SInce someone else mentioned it, thought I would toss it in here as well.

My AR190 will run around 42 with the bimini up and loaded with my family of 4 (2 adults, 2kids). That is flat out as fast as it gets. I've seen 43 on GPS once, but have never been able to duplicate it. With 6 adults and 3 VERY large coolers I was able to get about 38mph or so from it. If I didn't have the L13 Cone, I suspect it would have been even less. I think the 195's will run into the high 40's even with a considerable load on them. If speed is your thing, then the AR190 isn't for you. Buddy with a 150hp powered 24' Tri-Toon runs 35-37 regardless of load and has about 6x the deck space I do. There is a guy here with an SX195 that is into the low 60 range with some upgrades.

 

[d_coyne1984]

Appreciate the input from everyone. Would the AR 190 or 195 have issues tubing or wakeboarding? If so, it sounds like the AR 210 would probably be the best option for what we want to use the boat for. But is there a better boat that would fit our needs in the 40k price range? Obviously new to the boating scene, appreciate any feedback.

I can't speak for the AR190, but the the AR192 pulls very well. Plenty of power to pull up a wake boarder or tube even well loaded down. The 195 can only be better. It's to bad they don't offer the 192 as an option still because it is nice not to have to pay for premium fuel and I think the power sacrifice compared to the 195 is minimal. Just be advised that the top speed of the AR210 is pretty pokey in case that is something to be concerned about. I bet it pulls just fine though with the torque and impeller surface area of twin engines to grab the water.

 

[BigAbe75]

Wake Wedge and swim platform ballast bag should get you close.

No wake wedge for the 19' models. It isn't needed, as I understand it, as it's purpose is to clean the wake from the surf side pump. Can't do that on a single pump. I think??

http://www.gantlinproducts.com/pricing-models.html

 

[2kwik4u]

No wake wedge for the 19' models. It isn't needed, as I understand it, as it's purpose is to clean the wake from the surf side pump. Can't do that on a single pump. I think??

Pricing/Models

I sit corrected. Thanks for clearing that up.

 

[jcyamaharider]

I have surfed ropeless behind both a 195 and a SX190. It can be done. That being said I would defiantly want a bigger boat if that was the focus.
190:

 

[swatski]

I can't speak for the AR190, but the the AR192 pulls very well. Plenty of power to pull up a wake boarder or tube even well loaded down. The 195 can only be better. It's to bad they don't offer the 192 as an option still because it is nice not to have to pay for premium fuel and I think the power sacrifice compared to the 195 is minimal. Just be advised that the top speed of the AR210 is pretty pokey in case that is something to be concerned about. I bet it pulls just fine though with the torque and impeller surface area of twin engines to grab the water.

The only time I had any issues pulling with the 190 was after "upgrade" to a Solas aftermarket impeller which is a lot more prone to cavitation on hole shot.
With the OEM impeller and the L13 cone a 190 pulls like a mule.

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[haknslash]

Thanks for the plug @2kwik4u but my boat is already spoken for

 

[2kwik4u]

Thanks for the plug @2kwik4u but my boat is already spoken for

Didn't realize the decision was made and it was done. Glad you got it worked out!

 

[njmr2fan]

We wakeboard, wakeskate, kneeboard, tube, and ski behind our 190 with no problems at all.

 

[chrisinslc]

The only time I had any issues pulling with the 190 was after "upgrade" to a Solas aftermarket impeller which is a lot more prone to cavitation on hole shot.
With the OEM impeller and the L13 cone a 190 pulls like a mule.

--

What exactly is an L13 cone?

 

[Chillypilot]

Consider buying used. More boat less $$$

 

[2kwik4u]

What exactly is an L13 cone?

It's an aftermarket cone that replaces the factory cone on the rear of the jet pump. It increases pump loading due to creating a more uniform volume reduction within the nozzle. This additional loading helps to prevent pump cavitation. Cavitation leads to reduce performance during launch, or when heavily loaded. In extreme cases it can damage the impeller blades leading edge, and mid surface.

Here is where you can buy one <--That one is for the 1.8L NON supercharged (155mm) pumps

Here is the @swatski writeup on putting them on his AR240. Same process on the 190's

This Post is from @swatski putting them on his 190, and includes some EXCELLENT videos that really demonstrate how well they work.

The change on my boat wasn't as dramatic. Honestly I was somewhat disappointed after my first installation because my results were pretty dismal. I put it on during a cool day with only two people and no gear on the boat. Once it got hot in the middle of summer, and I loaded the crap out of the boat, it still performed the same. So for me, it wasn't about getting any additional speed or holeshot, it was getting a boat that was FAR FAR more consistent in performance. Thats a big deal for me, as I can run above 40mph now loaded or not. It planes every single time, and I don't have to feather the throttle to keep it "hooked up". I have the L13 Cone, ribbon delete, and sealed pump intake tunnel. Otherwise, no performance mods to speak of, and the boat is very consistent and a pleasure to drive in all conditions. Might have 4hrs total in all those mods.

 

[2kwik4u]

Consider buying used. More boat less $$$

I was going to get used, but the financing on new was too good to pass up. These boats and engines are very robust IMO, and getting a used one is a lower risk than similar boats. Even if you do get a lemon, this side of engine replacement, they're less expensive to repair and refurbish mechanically than a comparable boat.

 

[SamCF]

Here's a video surfing behind a 192. I don't remember the details, but I think this was an 800 lb bag on the surf side swim deck. Only 1 adult in the boat. Wave was very nice with a slight turn to the left. This would be easily duplicated with the custom swim deck bag.

 

[mdchachi]

I have a stock AR195 and a Zup 2.0. My son may want to mix it up and wakesurf. Is it possible?
I don't mean drop the rope wake surf but somehow get into the wakesurf pocket in front of the wave and see how it feels to be there.
If so, how? I mean do you make the rope shorter and start there? If so, how long should the rope be?