AR230 Engine Oil Question

[boudin]

Its definitely not a time issue, but bad luck.
Moisture in any cylinder when laid up will ruin the walls and when you start up it grinds down the rings..... then loss of compression happens......
Fog it heavy if being laid up

Agree on the fogging if the motor is going to laid up for a while.

The MR1 cylinders are Nikasil coated and should not rust. However, the steel piston rings will rust and stick causing low compression. You can get rust from the rings sticking to the cylinder walls, but the walls should not rust.

If I recall, the older FX140s were not Nikasil coated.

-Greg

 

[boudin]

I have personally installed approximately 30 SBT engines or cylinder heads with no issues. I would use one in either of my crafts with no worries.

I have installed 20+ of them as well, and would put one my personal boats too.

My intention in my earlier quote was not to knock SBT, but just to let the poster know that even with the no-fault warranty (which is great BTW) there will be labor and shipping costs involved in replacing the motor. And also that there are other routes a competent mechanic can take to remedy the stuck valve issue.

-Greg

 

[Nate Fallow]

Okay, glad to see that this thread has garnered some attention....You guys will get a chuckle out of the latest update. When I talked to the broker, the boat was gonna get an SBT rebuilt motor. When I talked to the mechanic he said that SBT uses cheap China parts in their rebuilds and he was gonna have some local guy do it. When I talked to the boat owner he said that rebuilding the engine was, and I quote, "option number 2". The 1st option is to, and again I quote, "take the boat out on a lake and run the piss out of it in hopes that the rings will pop back out." WTH is that???? It was all I could do to not burst out laughing...I can't make this up. Feeling super confident about it now....I can't wait to buy a boat that he and his mechanic named "Skeeter" took out on a lake and beat the piss out of....YEAH!!!

 

[bronze_10]

UMMMMM.... ... . Run!

 

[Neutron]

UMMMMM.... ... . Run!

What he said

 

[Scottintexas]

@boudin thanks for jumping in on this, I knew I was forgetting somebody with some skills
@Neutron

So I'm trying to consider if I should add something about this to my "known Issues" thread. I know of 3-4 MR1's that lost bearings or rods that put a hole in the block but at less than 1 every couple of years I chalked it up to "luck of the draw" and sometimes stuff breaks rather than an issue a normal MR1 owner should be aware of.

I think we all agree a compression test when buying a boat is a good idea just so you know what you're getting.

I put 30-40 run time hours on my boat every summer and it sits from Nov-Apr.

In your experience would think my boat was at risk for sticking valves or rings?

if not how long would you think sitting up before an issue might start to arise (understanding a salt environment will be different than fresh)1 year /2years / 3 years / just luck of the draw ?

Is Jorm's experience below your experience also?

I have pitting on the exhaust seats on 2 and 3. 3 had a 50% leak when the shop tested the heads off the engine. 1 and 4 look great. I suspect this is common these days on these engines. 3 out of 4 mr1s I've tested in the last year's had this issue with low compression on 3.
View attachment 73984

@Jgorm - those three that had bad compression, do you know who many hours were on them or if that sat for long periods of time (years) ? were they skis or boats?



.

 

[scokill]

@boudin thanks for jumping in on this, I knew I was forgetting somebody with some skills
@Neutron

So I'm trying to consider if I should add something about this to my "known Issues" thread. I know of 3-4 MR1's that lost bearings or rods that put a hole in the block but at less than 1 every couple of years I chalked it up to "luck of the draw" and sometimes stuff breaks rather than an issue a normal MR1 owner should be aware of.

I think we all agree a compression test when buying a boat is a good idea just so you know what you're getting.

I put 30-40 run time hours on my boat every summer and it sits from Nov-Apr.

In your experience would think my boat was at risk for sticking valves or rings?

if not how long would you think sitting up before an issue might start to arise (understanding a salt environment will be different than fresh)1 year /2years / 3 years / just luck of the draw ?

Is Jorm's experience below your experience also?



@Jgorm - those three that had bad compression, do you know who many hours were on them or if that sat for long periods of time (years) ? were they skis or boats?



.

I'm not sure I would add this to a known issue given that these models from a volume perspective is huge. This isn't like the timing chain issue or the oil cooler bolt issue that you saw in specific models and never saw again. With the amount of MR1s out there, and the propensity for folks to come on to a forum with issues and the vast majority of owners never visiting or even hearing of jetboaters.net (or the other forum), and even then issues being a very small % there is no blanket issue here in my opinion....not to mention MR1s being in many, many PWCs.

 

[Cambo]

[QUOTE="....You guys will get a chuckle out of the latest update, "take the boat out on a lake and run the piss out of it in hopes that the rings will pop back out." WTH is that???? It was all I could do to not burst out laughing...I can't make this up. Feeling super confident about it now....I can't wait to buy a boat that he and his mechanic named "Skeeter" took out on a lake and beat the piss out of....YEAH!!![/QUOTE]

That may sound strange but watch this video I would consider this you tube poster a master mechanic he has videos showing a complete rebuild.

At around minute 2:20 you can see the compression is lower due to carbon build up this is a wave runner but the motor is very similar. The mechanic "Skeeter" May have described it wrong but running it hard to clear out the carbon allowing the rings to seat properly is the goal.

Nate what model boat is it the Black AR230 that has the high output or Red standard motors and what is your general location? Both are great boats my friend has the the 2006 AR230 HO and the high output is almost non noticeable between the two

 

[boudin]

Advise 'Skeeter' to add this to the fuel before his lake run. It's good stuff.

https://www.amazon.com/Yamaha-Yamalube-Ring-Additive-ACC-RNGFR-PL-12/dp/B002GU4SN2/ref=sr_1_2

-Greg

 

[Jgorm]

@boudin thanks for jumping in on this, I knew I was forgetting somebody with some skills
@Neutron

So I'm trying to consider if I should add something about this to my "known Issues" thread. I know of 3-4 MR1's that lost bearings or rods that put a hole in the block but at less than 1 every couple of years I chalked it up to "luck of the draw" and sometimes stuff breaks rather than an issue a normal MR1 owner should be aware of.

I think we all agree a compression test when buying a boat is a good idea just so you know what you're getting.

I put 30-40 run time hours on my boat every summer and it sits from Nov-Apr.

In your experience would think my boat was at risk for sticking valves or rings?

if not how long would you think sitting up before an issue might start to arise (understanding a salt environment will be different than fresh)1 year /2years / 3 years / just luck of the draw ?

Is Jorm's experience below your experience also?



@Jgorm - those three that had bad compression, do you know who many hours were on them or if that sat for long periods of time (years) ? were they skis or boats?



.

One is my 04 ar230 with 400hrs fresh water, my 03 fx140 had just under 100 hrs salt water. I can't thread the compression tool into 3, but it pulls half the vacuum as the other cylinders. The 02 fx140 i looked at had 78 fresh water hours. 3 plug was stuck hard and i didn't want to break the plug, but number 2 was down about 75psi from 1 and 4. If it's like my boat, 3 will be worse. My theory is that somehow they inner cylinders get more exposure to water from the design of the header, but i have no basis for this theory, only that 1 and 4 seem to be better than 2 and 3. Remember that 1 and 4 run in sync, just like 2 and 3. (They are both at tdc at the same time)

 

[Nate Fallow]

[QUOTE="....You guys will get a chuckle out of the latest update, "take the boat out on a lake and run the piss out of it in hopes that the rings will pop back out." WTH is that???? It was all I could do to not burst out laughing...I can't make this up. Feeling super confident about it now....I can't wait to buy a boat that he and his mechanic named "Skeeter" took out on a lake and beat the piss out of....YEAH!!!

That may sound strange but watch this video I would consider this you tube poster a master mechanic he has videos showing a complete rebuild.

At around minute 2:20 you can see the compression is lower due to carbon build up this is a wave runner but the motor is very similar. The mechanic "Skeeter" May have described it wrong but running it hard to clear out the carbon allowing the rings to seat properly is the goal.

Nate what model boat is it the Black AR230 that has the high output or Red standard motors and what is your general location? Both are great boats my friend has the the 2006 AR230 HO and the high output is almost non noticeable between the two[/QUOTE]


Hi and thanks for the responses. Yes it is the black Ar230 HO, I live in Ohio. The video is quite informative actually... I'm just getting nervous in general on the boat. I don't think that Skeeter is quite the master mechanic that the guy from the video is. I just don't want to buy a headache...