No more V8 in two-row Grand Cherokee

[adrianp89]

I am militantly opposed to the "phone as a key" crap. That sounds like a recipe for the worst day of your life, losing your phone at the dock or something and no longer being able to get into your car. I would never buy a car without a key fob, hard pass.

You usually can buy a Key Fob if the car doesn't come with. You can with Tesla. Honestly that might be the biggest thing I miss from the Tesla... not having a bulky key in my pocket was great.

 

[Murf'n'surf]

I agree overall but love push button start. Keys live in pocket forever and I never have to worry about it. No jingle jangle of them against the dash, no futzing about with them, just convenience. I also like console shifters because at least it's something I can pretend is a manual and hold on to. I've grown to be satisfied with rotary shifters too. Still don't like column shifters, too awkward and no reason for them.

Multiple driving modes only exist to make it so you don't have to spend time developing a good one. Way faster and cheaper to throw 5 adjustable modes at something and let the customer decide than to actually engineer one mode that works well.

I am militantly opposed to the "phone as a key" crap. That sounds like a recipe for the worst day of your life, losing your phone at the dock or something and no longer being able to get into your car. I would never buy a car without a key fob, hard pass.

As a very new Tesla owner I can appreciate the phone key. They also have a credit card key and available key fobs for y’all old fashion peeps. My Ram had the keyless fob and rotary shifter which was the bomb….I wish Tesla would get rid of the column shifter on all models.

 

[2kwik4u]

I agree overall but love push button start. Keys live in pocket forever and I never have to worry about it. No jingle jangle of them against the dash, no futzing about with them, just convenience. I also like console shifters because at least it's something I can pretend is a manual and hold on to. I've grown to be satisfied with rotary shifters too. Still don't like column shifters, too awkward and no reason for them.

We're polar opposites here, and that's OK. Love a column shift and hate keyfobs in general. Probably stems from hating anything in my pockets, pretty much all the time. I have to unload my phone, wallet, and now keys every time I get in/out. I hate sitting with full pockets. Even at dinner that stuff sits on the table or the seat next to me. I'm certain I'm in the minority here.

Multiple driving modes only exist to make it so you don't have to spend time developing a good one. Way faster and cheaper to throw 5 adjustable modes at something and let the customer decide than to actually engineer one mode that works well.

Disagree here. Different levels of traction control, stability control, and abs intervention are needed for different situations. Rivian found this the hard way with no "snow mode" on the R1's. Lots of regen on a slick surface with a heavy vehicle made them really difficult to drive safely. Took fiddling with 3-4 settings to get something OK, but a single "mode" made all those settings into one place. Still, only need that once or twice a drive generally, so bury it in a menu somewhere and call it good.

I am militantly opposed to the "phone as a key" crap. That sounds like a recipe for the worst day of your life, losing your phone at the dock or something and no longer being able to get into your car. I would never buy a car without a key fob, hard pass.

I do agree on the super extra double hard effing pass on the "no key" setup. Proximity unlocking is an absurd feature, and arguably a safety risk depending on where you are. Single touch gets me in my door, double touch gets all doors open. I like my proximity key for that, will admit.

Final thought.....you see the Denali EV has a portrait screen similar to the Exploder ST? Gonna make it an even worse uphill battle for me to want one of those things.

 

[BlkGS]

I don't carry a ton of stuff in my pockets, I keep a smallish wallet, a handful of keys, and my phone. 2 key fobs isn't a major difference maker to me, plus the key fob for the expedition is really no bigger than the key and keyless remote for the trailblazer. I don't go places where I have safety concerns, but every keyless vehicle I've owned you can set it to only open the door youre at.

I don't know much about driving in snow, everywhere I've lived you just.... Don't. Lol. So the different modes tend to be different suspension stiffnesses, throttle sensitivity, shift points, exhaust sound, etc. These are things that if you calibrate correctly one time you don't need multiple versions of. Maybe I'm the weirdo that just puts everything in the most aggressive mode, but I don't care. Worse yet, I shouldn't have to set the mode EVERY TIME. The car should remember what it was in last time and return back to that.

That was a huge gripe I had with the explorer ST. In Sport mode it was pretty good, the dash worked, the car drove right, I was happy. But every time you turn it on it defaults.to normal, which has an ugly display, everything feels sloppy and laggy, and the car kinda sucks vs sport mode. If they had just spent the time to have sport mode as the only mode, they could have put in more time on it and made it even better. But instead they had 8 other stupid modes that would never get used. I don't need a sand, rocks, gravel, small creatures, or any of the other modes like that in a road oriented SUV. A bronco or timberline, ok, sure, but not an ST.

Portrait screens are another hard pass for me. They just don't work as well. I can't wait for that design fad to go away.

 

[adrianp89]

I don't carry a ton of stuff in my pockets, I keep a smallish wallet, a handful of keys, and my phone. 2 key fobs isn't a major difference maker to me, plus the key fob for the expedition is really no bigger than the key and keyless remote for the trailblazer. I don't go places where I have safety concerns, but every keyless vehicle I've owned you can set it to only open the door youre at.

I don't know much about driving in snow, everywhere I've lived you just.... Don't. Lol. So the different modes tend to be different suspension stiffnesses, throttle sensitivity, shift points, exhaust sound, etc. These are things that if you calibrate correctly one time you don't need multiple versions of. Maybe I'm the weirdo that just puts everything in the most aggressive mode, but I don't care. Worse yet, I shouldn't have to set the mode EVERY TIME. The car should remember what it was in last time and return back to that.

That was a huge gripe I had with the explorer ST. In Sport mode it was pretty good, the dash worked, the car drove right, I was happy. But every time you turn it on it defaults.to normal, which has an ugly display, everything feels sloppy and laggy, and the car kinda sucks vs sport mode. If they had just spent the time to have sport mode as the only mode, they could have put in more time on it and made it even better. But instead they had 8 other stupid modes that would never get used. I don't need a sand, rocks, gravel, small creatures, or any of the other modes like that in a road oriented SUV. A bronco or timberline, ok, sure, but not an ST.

Portrait screens are another hard pass for me. They just don't work as well. I can't wait for that design dad to go away.

I really like the portrait screen on mine, it essentially acts as two 8.4" screens. If you can't run split screen on one - then yes its stupid/.

 

[BlkGS]

I really like the portrait screen on mine, it essentially acts as two 8.4" screens. If you can't run split screen on one - then yes its stupid/.

My dad has the big screen on his Ram. It's OK. It basically turns the bottom half of it into on screen HVAC controls. Sure, it can use the extra screen size for other tasks, but in the time I've used it, it's mainly just putting HVAC down there. So you could just have some more practical HVAC buttons, and the screen would retain the same function.

The screen on the new tundra and new f150 is really the best implementation I've seen.

 

[adrianp89]

My dad has the big screen on his Ram. It's OK. It basically turns the bottom half of it into on screen HVAC controls. Sure, it can use the extra screen size for other tasks, but in the time I've used it, it's mainly just putting HVAC down there. So you could just have some more practical HVAC buttons, and the screen would retain the same function.

The screen on the new tundra and new f150 is really the best implementation I've seen.

I haven't seen those yet. I use CarPlay a lot so I will split screen with CarPlay and my media at the bottom. I use the physical buttons for HVAC.

 

[2kwik4u]

My dad has the big screen on his Ram. It's OK. It basically turns the bottom half of it into on screen HVAC controls. Sure, it can use the extra screen size for other tasks, but in the time I've used it, it's mainly just putting HVAC down there. So you could just have some more practical HVAC buttons, and the screen would retain the same function.

The screen on the new tundra and new f150 is really the best implementation I've seen.

I like the Toyota size, but it's mounted to high. I personally don't want anything sticking out of the top of my dash.

yes I know that is EXACTLY what my Q7 does, but I can hide that screen so it's a bit different.

 

[BlkGS]

I like the Toyota size, but it's mounted to high. I personally don't want anything sticking out of the top of my dash.

yes I know that is EXACTLY what my Q7 does, but I can hide that screen so it's a bit different.

I don't like it when screens stick up either. I haven't noticed it being super obnoxious like on explorer, but I haven't seen many in person. The screen being part of the dash entirely like in f150 is definitely preferable.

 

[TimW451]

+1:
- Resetting drive mode on restarts is bad, hated that on my Mustang.
- Portrait screen not good. Didn’t like it on the Mach E. Reason I didn’t get the large screen on the Ram. (I will say the split screen with CarPlay is nice, but never saw that in any picture until this past year. Maybe I’d have gotten it and felt differently about it. Pretty sure the Mach E didn’t split screen.)
- No to screens projecting over or out of dash. Looks like somebody glued an iPad to the dash.

 

[BlkGS]

The best implementation IMO of the adaptive suspension has been on my Vette. My c4 had a dynamic valving thing where you had 3 modes on a knob, sport, normal, comfort. Since it was a knob, it stayed where you put it, and you didn't have to change it unless you wanted to. They continued this on to at least my c6 but did mag ride, which has 2 modes, sport and touring. It also is controlled by a knob switch, and stays where you put it.

I never change them off sport, and I appreciate that they stay there. They also don't make enough of a difference vs the non adjustable suspension to matter to me, and the c4 is so old that all it's adaptive suspension crap is long gone, and doesn't work as well as a regular pair of modern shocks anyways, but that's how drive modes should be handled, lol.

I'm ok with a rarely used button for snow or sand or whatever being hidden, or even in some hellish menu somewhere, but between the main modes of normal and sport, it should be a knob that stays on what you set it to forever until you change it.

 

[adrianp89]

The best implementation IMO of the adaptive suspension has been on my Vette. My c4 had a dynamic valving thing where you had 3 modes on a knob, sport, normal, comfort. Since it was a knob, it stayed where you put it, and you didn't have to change it unless you wanted to. They continued this on to at least my c6 but did mag ride, which has 2 modes, sport and touring. It also is controlled by a knob switch, and stays where you put it.

I never change them off sport, and I appreciate that they stay there. They also don't make enough of a difference vs the non adjustable suspension to matter to me, and the c4 is so old that all it's adaptive suspension crap is long gone, and doesn't work as well as a regular pair of modern shocks anyways, but that's how drive modes should be handled, lol.

I'm ok with a rarely used button for snow or sand or whatever being hidden, or even in some hellish menu somewhere, but between the main modes of normal and sport, it should be a knob that stays on what you set it to forever until you change it.

Just put it on the steering wheel.... maybe I've just been looking at Porsche's too long lol.

 

[BlkGS]

Just put it on the steering wheel.... maybe I've just been looking at Porsche's too long lol.

Honestly that's the worst place for it. I find it to be a "set it and forget it" thing. Porsche used to just have a button labelled sport that made everything good, sharpened the throttle response, opened the exhaust valves, stiffened suspension... It was perfect. Then they decided they wanted to play gimmicks like their competition. Hell, even in the 991 they barely would put radio buttons on the wheel for you. And the 991 was kinda a bloated tick of a 911.

What's happened at Porsche makes me sad. They keep trending towards being the Cayenne company vs the 911 company, and they keep adding more Cayenne into their other vehicles.

 

[2kwik4u]

The best implementation IMO of the adaptive suspension has been on my Vette. My c4 had a dynamic valving thing where you had 3 modes on a knob, sport, normal, comfort. Since it was a knob, it stayed where you put it, and you didn't have to change it unless you wanted to. They continued this on to at least my c6 but did mag ride, which has 2 modes, sport and touring. It also is controlled by a knob switch, and stays where you put it.

I never change them off sport, and I appreciate that they stay there. They also don't make enough of a difference vs the non adjustable suspension to matter to me, and the c4 is so old that all it's adaptive suspension crap is long gone, and doesn't work as well as a regular pair of modern shocks anyways, but that's how drive modes should be handled, lol.

I'm ok with a rarely used button for snow or sand or whatever being hidden, or even in some hellish menu somewhere, but between the main modes of normal and sport, it should be a knob that stays on what you set it to forever until you change it.

My Audi is setup very similar.

(2) buttons on dash with up/down arrows. Lets you "scroll" through the drive modes. I get Auto, Dynamic, Comfort, AllRoad, and Off Road. Shock valving, right height, throttle response, transmission mode, shift timing, and steering response all varies across the modes. I might change them a few times a month. Usually when I have to go from daily driver to mom-mobile transporting my mother/grandfather to a doctors appointment. Or when I have to drive over/through some sketchy place to get to where I'm going. By sketchy I mean muddy field, or fire road type stuff. No major off roading, but I do like the extra ground clearance and softened inputs.

Stays where I put it across key cycles (OK, what the hell do we call "key cycles" now that I don't have an effing key? Ignition cycles?). It would be infuriating to have a setting like that that DIDN'T stay where you left it.

*edit*
I should mention that I lived for years without this capability and was just fine. Only now that I have it do I enjoy it. Sporty daily driver mode versus tow/haul mode vs off road mode. It's neat that I have that capability, and I like it, but I would be just fine with a decently sorted chassis, acceptably sorted driveline, and appropriately sensitive throttle/steering inputs.

 

[Coult45]

I'm fairly techy and tend to be an early adopter, but our current two vehicles have made it clear that my dashboard preferences are old school.

I love the way the MachE drives and handles. Great in the snow too. And the drive mode preferences are saved along with seat positions, etc, on the three presets. But finding my seat heat, or the front or rear defrost while we're moving...what a pain in the ass. I like phone-as-a-key, but it's still too glitchy so we always carry the key. Even if the key and your phone are both at the bottom of the lake, though, you can still get in, start, and drive the car with codes on the door and dash. Lot of additional options buried in the menus that just take too much time to find or care about. One thing they did very well on the big screen was to put a real volume knob on it. Easy to grab and adjust without looking.

My Silverado 2500HD LT, on the other hand, is perfectly simple. Small screen that's still big enough for Apple CarPlay, and everything else is a quick button or knob. Not too many options on the LT, but nothing I can't live without.

Only one experience with a Tesla. Had to move one that someone parked in my driveway during a party. Performance in that car is amazing, but there is nothing intuitive about operating it. Tapping the card somewhere on the side window to get it to unlock, turning it on and off, hell...I think I struggled to find reverse when I first got in. I've rented cars well over 200 times, and have driven more types of vehicles than I can count. I never had one make me feel stupid like the Tesla did.