Ok, What are my chances on cleaning up salt plugged block coolant passages?

[BrentEB]

Here is what they look like in an old 2008 boat with the MR-1 engine.
View attachment 109942View attachment 109943View attachment 109944

Are those the metal the zinc anodes were cast on? The surface looks odd. Build-up rather than pitted.

 

[buckbuck]

Those are the actual anode. I boat in fresh water and never see anodes deteriorate. The pump anodes are original and look virtually new.

 

[BrentEB]

UPDATE: Got water flow through the inlet and outlet to the block & outlets on each cyl on the head to the jacket. What a relief! No flow out the anode port. I'm cleaning that out physically to fit the new anode. I'll post more detail later if there's interest.

 

[Liveto99]

UPDATE: Got water flow through the inlet and outlet to the block & outlets on each cyl on the head to the jacket. What a relief! No flow out the anode port. I'm cleaning that out physically to fit the new anode. I'll post more detail later if there's interest.

There is interest! Good going.

 

[BrentEB]

OK. Here's a summary of the chemical cleaning procedure I used to remove the salt build-up in the block coolant passages. The apparatus was pretty much "MacGiver'd" from existing parts, but could easily be put together for less than $100. Much better than the $2k I've heard that dealers can charge. Also, my thanks for others that have posted doing this same or a similar procedure successfully - I needed the encouragement that it could work!

First off, the exhaust manifold had to be removed to access the thermo switch and sensor as well as the coolant lines at the block. I disconnected the air filter/inlet hose assembly and moved it out of the way, then removed the bolts from the manifold and first exhaust connection. It popped off the head with a tap from a dead blow hammer.

There are two water lines to the manifold jacket - one on the top that I refer to as the exit from the block, and a lower one that feeds cooling water during operation and also functions as a system drain when the engine is stopped. That line was left connected and the manifold was moved out of the way.

The thermo switch and sensor were removed and checked out OK per the service manual procedure. I then plugged each cylinder exhaust at the head with some cloth rolled up and wrapped with plastic wrap to keep water from possibly splashing up and entering the cylinders. At that point it was ok to flush water through all the lines without the engine running.

Numerous Salt-Away(SA) and sulfamic acid flushes had been performed on the engine up to this point and all the cooling passages looked good and had good water flow, except for the inlet/exit of the block. At that point it appeared there was a BIG problem.

My plan was insert small diameter hose as far as possible into both block water lines and pump in an acid mixture to dissolve the salt and catch the exiting liquid in a clean catch pan with the pump. The first hose iteration was with automotive vacuum line and the small pump because the big one broke while testing. I used a 1.5% sol'n of sulfamic acid with a squirt of Dawn. There was no change to either the sp gr or the pH of the liquid during that time, although it went from clear to "dirty dish water" color after a week.



Could not post a movie of this which showed flows; it was a no go.




Changed the sol'n to 3% sulfamic and about 1/2 cup of SA and used the bigger pump. The next day switched to aquarium air line hoses to get more flow into the plugged section. The aquarium air line has a larger ID and smaller OD than the vacuum hose. It was also more supple and got a little farther into the block. That is my hose of choice for this for anyone that attempts this procedure.

The next day the water pan level was down almost a qt. No leakage or spills, brought the level back up with a mix of SA & water. The level was down again the following day so added more dilute SA. I think this was the critical indication that the plug was being attacked as the sol'n density and pH were pretty much constant.

The next day the the big pump had crapped out again. While changing things out decided to put hose pressure (55 psi) on the block exit line. There was a little "whomp" and water flowed out the open ports on the head. Put pressure on the inlet line and again water out the head. Found a handful of salt in the funnel and pan. Seems like that got it! Bought beer.

Next day physically cleaned the anode port with an ice pick & screw drivers followed with hose flushes. Had to use a punch to remove a part of the anode that had broken off and fused to the port, but it cleaned up well and eventually had water flow as well. Now to put it all back together.




I have to say I am impressed with the Salt-Away product. The close-up of the salt is very interesting. It shows large grains that appear to be hydrated due to surfactants. Those grains shrink dramatically when dried. I think that hydration is key to softening and removing salt accumulation/plugs. Likely better than acid & Dawn. To each his own, but I'm sold. Also, the color of SA will let you know if your addition nozzle is working. If the color doesn't lighten in 30-45 seconds the nozzle isn't working, which you won't see with a clear product. I know!

I rushed this through so feel free to ask questions. Best to all and happy boating.

 

[buckbuck]

That is a big clump of sand. Are you confident you got everything around the cylinder walls?

 

[BrentEB]

It does look like course sand - that's what I thought the first time I caught some and is why I took a close-up this time. But it's salt crystals that are ballooned up by surfactant action and hydration. They shrink down to a fine salt when allowed to dry. No sand in the inlet screen or in any inlet water lines that I could find.

The big factor is there is now flow through the block passages. Since I have a good idea of what's going on all future flushes should continue to decrease any remnants in there.

 

[swatski]

It does look like course sand - that's what I thought the first time I caught some and is why I took a close-up this time. But it's salt crystals that are ballooned up by surfactant action and hydration. They shrink down to a fine salt when allowed to dry. No sand in the inlet screen or in any inlet water lines that I could find.

The big factor is there is now flow through the block passages. Since I have a good idea of what's going on all future flushes should continue to decrease any remnants in there.

Do you have a sense of how would that buildup/deposits compare to those found in powerhead passages of an outboard with similar hours?
I'm just curious, I think we are likely going to see the same issues in the 1.8s over time.

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[BrentEB]

Swatski asked:
Do you have a sense of how would that buildup/deposits compare to those found in powerhead passages of an outboard with similar hours?
I'm just curious, I think we are likely going to see the same issues in the 1.8s over time.

Reply: I don't know. I do think it will depend on how the engines are flushed, of course. If most of the flush water from a hose runs out the inlet rather than going to the engine it's safe to assume there will eventually be problems. That's where the valves for flushing/towing will help.
I also think a product such as Salt-Away, which is now my preference, should be used fairly frequently depending on where one boats.
Don't let anyone tell you that you don't need to flush if used in brackish water. Trouble will find you like the mayhem guy. Fresh water, depends. There are carbonates in most and the reverse solubility with temperature of those salts will likely result in scale buildup at some time if not flushed out periodically.
With all the $$ invested in these boats the $45-$50 for a gallon of Salt-Away per season just makes sense to me. And as a disclaimer I've no affiliation with that firm, just impressed with the product.

 

[swatski]

Swatski asked:
Do you have a sense of how would that buildup/deposits compare to those found in powerhead passages of an outboard with similar hours?
I'm just curious, I think we are likely going to see the same issues in the 1.8s over time.

Reply: I don't know. I do think it will depend on how the engines are flushed, of course. If most of the flush water from a hose runs out the inlet rather than going to the engine it's safe to assume there will eventually be problems. That's where the valves for flushing/towing will help.
I also think a product such as Salt-Away, which is now my preference, should be used fairly frequently depending on where one boats.
Don't let anyone tell you that you don't need to flush if used in brackish water. Trouble will find you like the mayhem guy. Fresh water, depends. There are carbonates in most and the reverse solubility with temperature of those salts will likely result in scale buildup at some time if not flushed out periodically.
With all the $$ invested in these boats the $45-$50 for a gallon of Salt-Away per season just makes sense to me. And as a disclaimer I've no affiliation with that firm, just impressed with the product.

I think you are spot on about flushing and tow valves (or flush valves as @Gym likes to call them), I use SaltAway for exactly the reasons you mentioned and it bothers me seeing most of it just flowing out the pump.
If and when I get my boat fixed (one of the engines started making milkshake oil) I will be installing "Flush" valves!
Will need those next season - moving to salt.
Right now I'm more concerned with mud and crap so I make a habit to run the boat hard at least from time to time.


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[VitaminSea]

@BrentEB Just saw this thread, glad you were able to clear your blockage and that you for sharing your journey with us!

Novice question here as I do not fully understand the cooling system as you have referenced (I have looked at the diagrams and watched the referenced video a few time, but have yet to study the engine using a hands on approach). Is there a one can easily flush and keep some Salt Away in the engine to address any deposits? I am the second owner for a 210, and do not see water exiting the “P-holes” unless I am around 3k, hence my thought is I might have some blockage ( prior owner never mentioned flushing with salt away). Guess is boat has seen around 50% salt, 50% Fresh.

Also, did you have any tips on installing the tow valves? I have seen other post, but I do not believe they were for the 210...

 

[BrentEB]

@BrentEB Just saw this thread, glad you were able to clear your blockage and that you for sharing your journey with us!

Novice question here as I do not fully understand the cooling system as you have referenced (I have looked at the diagrams and watched the referenced video a few time, but have yet to study the engine using a hands on approach). Is there a one can easily flush and keep some Salt Away in the engine to address any deposits? I am the second owner for a 210, and do not see water exiting the “P-holes” unless I am around 3k, hence my thought is I might have some blockage ( prior owner never mentioned flushing with salt away). Guess is boat has seen around 50% salt, 50% Fresh.

Also, did you have any tips on installing the tow valves? I have seen other post, but I do not believe they were for the 210...

I never saw water out the pilots ("pee holes") when flushing until the valves were installed and closed. If you had a fouled exhaust system I'd expect you'd get an alarm from the exhaust thermo switch.

One could leave the valves closed following a flush, but I don't recommend doing so. A leak between any one of the exhaust/coolant gaskets could allow coolant into the cylinders which you do not want. So I flush with valve closed and engine running, turn off the hose, shut down the engine, and then open the valve to drain the system. The block won't completely drain, however, because of the check valve in the cooling inlet so if you end the flush with Salt-Away some will remain in the block passages.

I pulled the panel at the clean out ports and added the valves in the cooling line off the pumps. With the panel back on both are easily accessed through the small lift-away panel. I used a gate valve on each motor, but a ball valve (1/4 turn valve) should be fine as long as there's room for the handle swing. I painted the valve handles white for visibility.



Do not forget to open the valves before taking the boat out! I always remove the clean out plugs after a flush so am back in there before going out and will double check the valves then.

 

[Scottintexas]

I am the second owner for a 210, and do not see water exiting the “P-holes” unless I am around 3k, hence my thought is I might have some blockage ( prior owner never mentioned flushing with salt away).

Also, did you have any tips on installing the tow valves? I have seen other post, but I do not believe they were for the 210...

Vitamin,
If you have any concerns about build up I would unscrew the anode for a look see, if it's clean I would suspect there were no issues,
BrentEB's was completely clogged, it's an easy job that should only take a few minutes.

Do you have to be at 3k to get the p-holes working on the hose or while you on the water?
most of us can't get any flow on the hose without the tow valves, on the water I don't get any flow until I at least get to 2k and sometimes more than that, If I were you I wouldn't be worried until I saw something on the anode or get an alarm,

installing valves is the same on any model it's just a matter of do you want to put it before or after "Y' coupling that the flush hose goes into.
If I were flushing salt water I would put them aft of the "y", then you decide do you want to put it in under the cleanout tray (probably not if you're flushing regularly or in the engine compartment (may be tight fit between the engine compartment wall and the "y" fitting.

We've got three or four write ups with pictures about installing the valves in the FAQ.


.

 

[VitaminSea]

My reference to the p-holes and 3k relates to on the water when under way. I am prepping for doing an oil change and plugs and will certainly look at the anode (now that I am aware). My only other experience with yammies is my Ski which has the 1.8L and at idle I always have a strong stream coming out the p-hole (on water and while flushing). I get it’s a different engine and a longer run on the 210, so just trying to ensure I understand what to look for.

as for the placement of the valves, I struggle with that. Seems like by the clean out tray would be the easiest, but it’s a long reach. If in the engine compartment, how does one generally reach those? I can’t reach the aft wall without leaning on the engines. (I’m 5’6 so don’t have the longest reach).
Thanks for the input/feedback and the additional pics!

 

[BrentEB]

installing valves is the same on any model it's just a matter of do you want to put it before or after "Y' coupling that the flush hose goes into.

If the valve is installed after the "Y" fitting it can't be used for flushing and I guess is what's called a "tow" valve.

 

[Damsroy]

I boat in saltwater. I installed the flush valves under the clean out tray and flush both engines with SA after every outing. So far no issue but it has been only one season (50hours). Will report as I put more hours on the engines.

 

[Damsroy]

And to report on my experience you can easily access the valves even when installed under the clean out tray. In my opinion it is easier a lot safer to have them under the clean out tray. Engines are hot when I get back to my slip and I would hate burning myself closing the flush valves and there is no way I’m gonna wait for the engines to cool down. Under clean out tray is the way to go. You very quickly learn where they are even if you can't physical see them.

 

[BrentEB]

What is the clean out tray? I've only just heard that term.

 

[Damsroy]

This is what you call the “panel at the clean out ports”. Same location as where you installed your valves. I got mind from Island Racing and installed them even before my first outing thanks to experiences Shared by fellow boaters on this very forum.

 

[WREKS]

I've been fighting an engine overheat problem for a couple months now. All the usual washes, ect, really didn't do a thing. Dropped the exhaust manifold and the only plug is in the engine block. MR1 110hp. Pulled the anode assembly, completely plugged with salt. Geez. I've rigged a "drill" from 3/32" vinyl coated multistrand wire stripped at the end that seems to get in there. 12" length now, but going up as it pretty easily goes through the salt. Just started that today.

This was not a "neglect" problem as I washed on the hose after each outing. I attribute it to the "hose" flush design - there is not enough water pressure to get through the check valve for a good block flush because of leak back through the normal inlet. I have manual valves to close off that leakage for hose flushes NOW.

If I get a flow established versus a dead head I think the problem will be licked. What does experience say? Do I have a chance?

Have you resolved your "engine overheat problem?"