5k tow limit

[Mainah]

Putting aside the math for a more real world experienced comparison... I made a long tow with last year with our 2015 AWD Durango RT 5.7l 8spd. 7200 lbs rated towing capacity and new tires on the 20x9.5 rims. About 800lbs in passenger weight and a few hundred lbs of food and gear towing my 2016 242 ls. I have my boat and trailer “balanced” to 7 percent tongue weight using a precision machined aluminum pneumatic pancake cylinder with calibated digital pressure gauge that I built (super accurate overkill geek method for a tonuge scale). The Durango did the job just as the math would indicate being under the rating but even it felt a bit hairy at times with crosswinds or when passing tractor trailers. I choose it over my half ton truck for passenger comfort for the long hual and found myself wishing I had taken the truck. No way I will ever use a lesser rated tow vehicle to tow my 242 LS.

 

[Jimxo]

I'm thinking of finding an old truck or upgrading to full size Yukon or Expedition.

 

[Betik]

@Mainah has a scary memory. My "first" post on the forum was about towing with a Pilot ( see below link). That pilot was 3 months old when I had to trade it for an F150.

Knowing what I know today, I am glad to trade it in for the truck and in my opinion should keep the following in mind.

1. You are most definitely going to be over 5,000 with the boat and that 5K limit is for 2 people at 160lbs each.
2. When returning from Bimini in 2017 and while driving on a work zone on I-10, I had sway and floor it to avoid a bad situation. The boat followed the truck and within seconds I went from ~70mph to 90+mph. From that moment on, I have zero regrets for towing with a truck vs SUV
3. I assume your MDX is the 4 wheel drive right ( if not just forget about it PERIOD) ? How steep is your ramp? Do you think you will have enough juice to get the boat off the water and up the ramp?
4. My house to my preferred lake is 27 miles, with 60mph speed limit. Had this been my only destination I might have kept the Pilot. But with Florida in play it just was out of the question. So do you really want to limit your self to that one lake and having to rent pick up truck at $1500 a week for long trips?
5. Even if you were to be super careful on that 1 to 2 hours drive, your transmission will go fast ( the cooler will prolonged its death but dont be fooled, that transmission is not made for towing 5,000lbs). Needless to say that Honda's are not know for their long lasting automatic transmissions. So the question is how long you are planing on keeping MDX? If you are in a position to trash it when the transmission dies or simply trade it in for say a new Tundra Hybrid in a couple of years, then I would not even bother with the cooler.
6. Unless you are going to drive no more than 30 mph while towing, I would not put kids in the MDX. Only consenting adults. It is all good until something beyond your control happens and I would not want to risk a $70,000 + a kid's well being.
7. At the end of the day boat is supposed to be fun and having to worry what will happen if boat end up telling your Vehicle where to go, is nto something I would want to think while going for boat ride.

My dream was Pilot + AR190 and would have been a happy Betik, so when I found 240 with 26 hours for lower price that the new AR190 then something had to give. And in my case the Pilot had to go.


https://jetboaters.net/threads/can-a-honda-pilot-tow-a-240-for-long-distances.11743/

 

[2kwik4u]

I'm thinking of finding an old truck or upgrading to full size Yukon or Expedition.

Honestly this is a great option.

I'm really glad to see you made it back and we didn't scare you off

I have some friends on another forum that have been finding used Suburbans and Yukons with high mileage, and some Active Fuel Management issues. They are gearheads, so they're fixing them in the garage with minor engine teardowns. The most recent story involves a guy finding a 2wd Suburban for $1,500, and putting less than $300 into the motor to get it back to healthy. The vehicle is in otherwise excellent condition, and was |..| that close to being traded in by a family member to the dealership for "scrap price". While I think this might be an extreme example, the deals are out there to get into a very capable/comfy tow vehicle that can otherwise "sit and wait" until boating season.

Also, if you'll always be on the same water, the idea of renting a 1500 pickup for a couple weekends a year and getting a slip might be a very viable financial option.

 

[2kwik4u]

LOL Damn dude what's the story on sinking a truck/boat? WTF were you towing?

This was when I was 17 or so. I was too dumb to know any better, and was borrowing less than ideal equipment.

Step dad had a '67 Chevy pickup with a high powered 327 and a 4spd manual in a regular cab/short bed/rwd configuration. Coupled to the back of that was a completely worn out '67 Caravelle runabout. I think it might have been a 19-20ft or so. Very pretty, and chalky, baby blue color. I took it to the local small lake with a few friends and had a great day on the water. Attempting to retrieve the boat, I didn't have anyone to help as my buddies were all "scared" of it, I did the task myself. Got the truck backed down the ramp, but couldn't shut it off because it would die on an incline. So I tied a large block of a railroad tie in the bed the we used as the "parking brake" to the mirror, and back down. Tossed the block of tie under the front wheel to hold in place, and left the truck idling. Go get the boat, bring it around, and I came in to the trailer a little hot, ok maybe a LOT hot. Anyway, the truck rocked forward, and the water rushed up near the front tire and my "parking brake" floated away. Now I'm in the boat, my buddy is standing behind the truck latching the boat to the trailer, and the whole freaking setup starts rolling backwards. I manage to superman style jump/fly from the boat into the bed, and head first through the sliding back door to get my hand onto the brake pedal. At this point my hand is underwater. I manage to get myself right side up and into driving position, but I've now got the boat eye hooked to the trailer and floating about 90deg to the trailer, and I'm mostly underwater. Engine still idling as I'm pseudo calming down trying to figure out WTF I'm going to do now.

I'm 17......"When in doubt, Power Out" right?!?!.....NOPE, slid the truck/trailer/boat combo back another 3-4ft in these attempts. I'm now sitting in the water in the cab, boat has run out of strap length and is nose down into the water and is starting to take small water over the bow. By the time I get all this squared away in my head and realize I need help, someone nearby watching strolls over and asks "need a hand".......Yeap, sure do.

Guy comes back 10 minutes later with a large tractor with a boom on the 3-point hitch behind it. Proceeds to chain the boom to the front cross member of the truck and drag the whole setup up the ramp. Boat was being drug about 3/4 full of water up the ramp, just to the side of the trailer. Apparently the new winch strap we installed the week before was the only real piece of equipment we had.

SO, once at the top of the ramp, we pull the plug on the boat and let all the water out. Use the boom and a couple large chains to get the boat back on the trailer and secured, and I was less than politely told to "keep that piece of shit away from this ramp from now on". We sold the whole boat the next week and the new owner sunk it at the same lake 3 days later. Came back and told us it was a "defective boat" and wanted his $600 back. Sorry buddy, you knew what you were buying at that price.

 

[PJ73]

You might want to repost this up in the Tow Rig forum. Probably will get more looks.

My $.02 is that it's less about the maximum tow weight in your situation than it is about the wheelbase of your Acura MDX. You've got about 26 feet of boat and trailer hanging off a, what, 17 foot vehicle? Once it starts oscillating it could be difficult to bring under control, I'd think. And coupled with the towed weight closing in on the weight of the tow vehicle plus load, it could really be a handful. You can try it out, without the family first, and see how it feels, but pay close attention to whether the boat and trailer is more in charge of what your rig is doing than you are.

Jeff

Jeff is right, if the bad boy gets squirrelly, it’s gonna take that MDX wherever the boat wants to go. Had a blow out last summer with my old 18 ft sea ray (3200 lbs) towed with my tundra (close to 6000 lbs) and that boat almost took my truck with it. Thank god for the weight of my truck and (cough) super human driving skills.

 

[Stevepro172]

Anyone tow a Yamaha 242 with mid size SUV?

I have a 2014 Acura MDX AWD rated at 5,000 pounds, hoping it can hall family of four plus boat on short trips 1-2 hours.

Dealer wants $1700 for hitch and trans cooler.

TIA

I like to deal in facts. This is a snap shot of a 2016 MDX. You have the information.

 

[2kwik4u]

@Stevepro172 That is easily the best laid out towing section I've seen in a manual to date. Excellent information.

Interesting to see that Acura derates the trailer weight by 250lbs, and 25lbs of tongue weight are dropped per 165lb occupant. There's that 10% tongue weight rule again.

Also interesting that Acura recommends an "accessory front towing grill"......not something I've heard of before.

 

[suke]

@Stevepro172 That is easily the best laid out towing section I've seen in a manual to date. Excellent information.

Interesting to see that Acura derates the trailer weight by 250lbs, and 25lbs of tongue weight are dropped per 165lb occupant. There's that 10% tongue weight rule again.

Also interesting that Acura recommends an "accessory front towing grill"......not something I've heard of before.

I'm gonna guess that includes the tranny cooler.

 

[suke]

This was when I was 17 or so. I was too dumb to know any better, and was borrowing less than ideal equipment.

Step dad had a '67 Chevy pickup with a high powered 327 and a 4spd manual in a regular cab/short bed/rwd configuration. Coupled to the back of that was a completely worn out '67 Caravelle runabout. I think it might have been a 19-20ft or so. Very pretty, and chalky, baby blue color. I took it to the local small lake with a few friends and had a great day on the water. Attempting to retrieve the boat, I didn't have anyone to help as my buddies were all "scared" of it, I did the task myself. Got the truck backed down the ramp, but couldn't shut it off because it would die on an incline. So I tied a large block of a railroad tie in the bed the we used as the "parking brake" to the mirror, and back down. Tossed the block of tie under the front wheel to hold in place, and left the truck idling. Go get the boat, bring it around, and I came in to the trailer a little hot, ok maybe a LOT hot. Anyway, the truck rocked forward, and the water rushed up near the front tire and my "parking brake" floated away. Now I'm in the boat, my buddy is standing behind the truck latching the boat to the trailer, and the whole freaking setup starts rolling backwards. I manage to superman style jump/fly from the boat into the bed, and head first through the sliding back door to get my hand onto the brake pedal. At this point my hand is underwater. I manage to get myself right side up and into driving position, but I've now got the boat eye hooked to the trailer and floating about 90deg to the trailer, and I'm mostly underwater. Engine still idling as I'm pseudo calming down trying to figure out WTF I'm going to do now.

I'm 17......"When in doubt, Power Out" right?!?!.....NOPE, slid the truck/trailer/boat combo back another 3-4ft in these attempts. I'm now sitting in the water in the cab, boat has run out of strap length and is nose down into the water and is starting to take small water over the bow. By the time I get all this squared away in my head and realize I need help, someone nearby watching strolls over and asks "need a hand".......Yeap, sure do.

Guy comes back 10 minutes later with a large tractor with a boom on the 3-point hitch behind it. Proceeds to chain the boom to the front cross member of the truck and drag the whole setup up the ramp. Boat was being drug about 3/4 full of water up the ramp, just to the side of the trailer. Apparently the new winch strap we installed the week before was the only real piece of equipment we had.

SO, once at the top of the ramp, we pull the plug on the boat and let all the water out. Use the boom and a couple large chains to get the boat back on the trailer and secured, and I was less than politely told to "keep that piece of shit away from this ramp from now on". We sold the whole boat the next week and the new owner sunk it at the same lake 3 days later. Came back and told us it was a "defective boat" and wanted his $600 back. Sorry buddy, you knew what you were buying at that price.

Ouch! I remember towing with my dads 5 sp 2wd nissan pick up truck in high school. Now that thing was sketchy to tow almost anything with. Fortunately the e-brake worked. HAH!

 

[AJack]

@Jimxo I know you may be thinking that we are beating you up a little bit. Being on camper forums those people are brutal when talking about towing capacity and if you have the right size truck. Of course we are talking about 3/4 to full ton and above SRW and DRW trucks.

I wouldn't even think about putting that boat behind your vehicle. Not enough weight or over sized brake power to stop it. Adding in the factor of the family in the vehicle and supplies for a day outing just makes it worse.

We are just trying to keep you and your family safe and enjoy that beautiful new boat of yours.

I am attaching a pic of what my boat looks like behind my dually. The truck doesn't make the boat look small. Just imagine what it would look like behind your MDX.

I too tow the 24' with a dually. With the dually, I easily "feel" the boat behind the truck, but luckily the truck has the oomph to control it. There are a few threads about the tongue weight being high, which is what I thought an earlier post was mentioning.

 

[suke]

I too tow the 24' with a dually. With the dually, I easily "feel" the boat behind the truck, but luckily the truck has the oomph to control it. There are a few threads about the tongue weight being high, which is what I thought an earlier post was mentioning.

better high, than low.

 

[2kwik4u]

better high, than low.

Agreed. My 190 was around 325lbs tongue weight. Far more than it needs to be. However since it's under the limits of the truck, I just left it.

Out of curiosity has anyone lifted the tongue of a 20+ft boat by sitting on the swim platform?

I've picked the tongue of my 19ft'er off the ground twice now with people sitting on the swim platform in the garage. Luckily I had the wheels chocked each time, but it still was a bit unsettling. Get (3) 200+lb guys sitting around shooting the breeze and just hanging out on the platform without it attached to a vehicle and it'll come right up.

 

[jcyamaharider]

I too tow the 24' with a dually. With the dually, I easily "feel" the boat behind the truck, but luckily the truck has the oomph to control it. There are a few threads about the tongue weight being high, which is what I thought an earlier post was mentioning.

I usually don't tow with my dually, we also have a 3/4 ton Ford 6.4 diesel that we normally tow the boat with. I drive the dually and the fifth wheel and the wife drives the truck pulling the boat.

One thing I did do to my boat is move it back on the trailer 6" which made a world of difference even when we tow with our 1/2 ton truck. ( still has close to a 8000 pound towing capacity )

 

[PJ73]

I usually don't tow with my dually, we also have a 3/4 ton Ford 6.4 diesel that we normally tow the boat with. I drive the dually and the fifth wheel and the wife drives the truck pulling the boat.

One thing I did do to my boat is move it back on the trailer 6" which made a world of difference even when we tow with our 1/2 ton truck. ( still has close to a 8000 pound towing capacity )

Why does it make a difference 6" back with a half ton? If you're setting the bulk of the weight further from the pivot, it's not as stable at speed. For example...

 

[2kwik4u]

That video shows an extreme example where the tongue weight goes "negative" and actually pulls up on the rear. The stability of the system will remain so long as the tongue weight remains "positive" and downward. Relaxing the weight on the hitch relieves some stress on the rear axle, and maintains are more consistent balance of front/rear weight distribution while driving. Basically it just rides better with less tongue weight, while some level of safety factor in terms of stability has been diminished. So long as the tongue weight remains positive, you'll be in fine shape.

Someone posted a really good read on how tongue weight shifts effect stability awhile back. Let me see if I can find it.

*edit*....unsure if this was posted elsewhere here, but it's a good read either way

https://www.outbacktravelaustralia.com.au/driving-towing-towing/towball-weight-and-trailer-stability

 

[jcyamaharider]

Why does it make a difference 6" back with a half ton? If you're setting the bulk of the weight further from the pivot, it's not as stable at speed. For example...

Because from the factory the the boat was loaded with more the 10% tongue weight. It isn't balanced and that means on a tandem trailer the front axle is doing all of the work and the rear axle is just there just incase. The trailer needs to be balanced with equal weight to be on both axles for the trailer to do it job properly.

 

[PJ73]

That video shows an extreme example where the tongue weight goes "negative" and actually pulls up on the rear. The stability of the system will remain so long as the tongue weight remains "positive" and downward. Relaxing the weight on the hitch relieves some stress on the rear axle, and maintains are more consistent balance of front/rear weight distribution while driving. Basically it just rides better with less tongue weight, while some level of safety factor in terms of stability has been diminished. So long as the tongue weight remains positive, you'll be in fine shape.

Someone posted a really good read on how tongue weight shifts effect stability awhile back. Let me see if I can find it.

Ah, so on a 212X (about 4000 lbs with fuel and other stuff) I can set it back 6" with my Tundra Crew max and it should ride a bit smoother?

 

[jcyamaharider]

Ah, so on a 212X (about 4000 lbs with fuel and other stuff) I can set it back 6" with my Tundra Crew max and it should ride a bit smoother?

There was a big discussion on the 212X versus the 242X, I will try and find it and tag you, The 242X came from the factory with full contact on the bunk board, 212X already had overhang. So some owners moved their axles back ( easier then it sounds ) But yes you would even gain if your weight ratio is off.

 

[2kwik4u]

@PJ73 I can't advise on how far to move your stop back. I will say that @Betik has very generously allowed his super awesome tongue scale to travel the country. I would advice that you get on the list to borrow that device, measure your actual tongue weight, and then adjust and remeasure until you are in the 5-7% range. Don't guess on the weight either, take it to the nearest truck stop (or stop in one on your next boat trip), and get some actual weights of the boat/truck combo.