Boat buckles...anyone use them?

[Zonie]

I came to the realization I need to get these buckles over the weekend. My standard straps don't ratchet tight enough to hold the boat snug on the trailer.

How are you guys mounting these things on your trailer? I'd see they make some brackets that bolt through the normal strap holes, but that doesn't look very sturdy. Are you guys drilling holes in your trailer frame and sending a bolt all the way through the frame?

Not sure where the factory straps attach on your trailer but I was able to bend my existing tabs slightly and they fit perfectly. If you trailer at all, BB are definitely worth it!

 

[txav8r]

What @maboat is saying, is that doing the 5mph stops as your primary means of securing the boat, will cause premature wear and tear. And it is harder on the boards than correctly loading the first time. It is what you do if you don't get it loaded right and have already left the ramp. But is far better to NOT make that your primary technique, instead, getting the bow stop bolt seated up and against the bow stop roller when you lose ad in the first place. If you do get the bolt snug against the roller, and tighten the winch strap securely, you won't have to retighten everything a second time after the transom straps are first tightened when you pull from the water. Consider this, when the boat is floating partially and you power load, there is less weight and the bunks are very wet. Once you pull from the water, the water is forced off of them and the full weight of the boat is on them. Doing 5 mph stops to fully seat the boat is not only abrasive to the hull, but you have 3700 full pounds of boat your trying to slide forward vs much less when still in the water. It works, but at a cost. Physics is a bitch at times. Have I done it? Of course. But my goal was to load correctly in the water so I wouldn't have to. Doesn't always work, but it should still be the goal. That is what the comment was about.

 

[GoVols01]

I snug the bow up the roller each time before I pull the boat out of the water, but it typically has a couple inches gap by the time I pull the boat out of the water. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. The ramp angles I'm loading the boat at are pretty steep and that tends to be the culprit behind the gap. It's not as easy getting it on the trailer against the bump stop as one thinks it is. I try avoid scooting the boat forward on the trailer with a sudden brake maneuver, but sometimes I have to. I agree, it can't be good for the boat or trailer, but it seemingly isn't too harmful at the same time. Just don't nail the brakes at 20mph to make the boat slam into the bump stop. I'm sure even the winch post has its limits.

 

[Ronnie]

The MFI trailers suffered from a bow stop that would move forward and backward which caused the boat to seeming slide away from it. Many have had the stop welded in place or bolted in place to address the issue. I thought the shorelander trailers that come with the newer yamahas did not suffer from this problem but I could be wrong.

One way to always be sure that your boat is tight against the bow stop is to use a boat buddy ii or the appropriate ramp n clamp model. Both lock onto the bow eye when used correctly. Come to think of it, I have not had to use the brake method to get my boat closer to the bow stop for several years because of these devices (when I use the, properly). If I have to use the brake method in the future I would consider it a rookie move on my part in that it would remind me of the days when using the brake method was common practice for me since I hadn't spent the time and money to make trialering the boat better (easier, safer, faster) yet.

 

[swatski]

If you do get the bolt snug against the roller, and tighten the winch strap securely, you won't have to retighten everything a second time after the transom straps are first tightened when you pull from the water.

I believe that is simply not the case. I wish it were. But - no matter how snug you will have it in the water/ramp, the boat will move and the stern tie downs will loosen up after even a short tow.

I do tend to winch the bow up against the roller pretty snug and tight (when pulling out/while it floats). But you can rip the bow eye off and your tie downs will still slack upon a tow, there is just enough flex in the trailer frame. The ONLY thing I know of that prevents that is a dedicated short stop.

I would like to see someone show me how they load the boat, do NOT tuck it with a short stop, AND have no slack on stern tie downs after some towing. My guess is - it is not going to happen.

So, no I don't agree at all. In my experience a dedicated, deliberate stop is the best trailer saving maneuver. Of course you do not want to take it too far, it needs to be done with some sense of touch.

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[maboat]

I'm confused. How would that be different from a boat moving on a trailer - out at speed, on a highway...?

I try to avoid sharp hard breaking whether it be in the parking lot or on the highway. Sometimes its unavoidable, but that doesn't mean its a good idea to force it every time. Wherever or whenever you force the boat to slide against the friction of the bunks its pulling the threads of the lag bolts through the wood (or plastic) fibers of the bunks. It also enlarges the holes, so you can't just re-tighten the bolts and be done with it.

Boat will move and straps will loosen up no matter where you do your breaking....

Its better to set the boat properly on the bunks while the trailer is still in the water rather than forcing it up the bunks by hard braking in the parking lot or on the highway.

I'm not saying I've never done it, but I am saying I wouldn't make that my standard procedure. Its a trick that can be used in a pinch but the normal procedure should be to get it loaded correctly while still in the water. A slam-the-brakes-to-fix-it maneuver should never be standard procedure. A better practice to to plan a road-side check 10-20 miles after leaving the ramp and check all straps then (I also check the bearing buddies, cables, hitch, etc.) Same thing at every fuel stop on longer trips. This is just plain good practice regarless of how well or poorly the ramp retrieval goes.

What @maboat is saying, is that doing the 5mph stops as your primary means of securing the boat, will cause premature wear and tear. And it is harder on the boards than correctly loading the first time. It is what you do if you don't get it loaded right and have already left the ramp. But is far better to NOT make that your primary technique, instead, getting the bow stop bolt seated up and against the bow stop roller when you lose ad in the first place. If you do get the bolt snug against the roller, and tighten the winch strap securely, you won't have to retighten everything a second time after the transom straps are first tightened when you pull from the water. Consider this, when the boat is floating partially and you power load, there is less weight and the bunks are very wet. Once you pull from the water, the water is forced off of them and the full weight of the boat is on them. Doing 5 mph stops to fully seat the boat is not only abrasive to the hull, but you have 3700 full pounds of boat your trying to slide forward vs much less when still in the water. It works, but at a cost. Physics is a bitch at times. Have I done it? Of course. But my goal was to load correctly in the water so I wouldn't have to. Doesn't always work, but it should still be the goal. That is what the comment was about.

EXACTLY!

I believe that is simply not the case. I wish it were...The ONLY thing I know of that prevents that is a dedicated short stop.

Don't know what to tall ya but its very rare that I ever NEEDED to do a slam-the-brakes maneuver and I have retrieved my boat hundreds and hundreds of times. The goal should be to load it properly on the ramp with water, not in the parking lot with brakes. When I'm pulling out of the water, I stop (gentle slow stop) while still on the ramp to check the boat's position on the bunks. If its not seated properly I will back down into the water and get it right before resorting to a slam-the-brakes trick.

So, no I don't agree at all. In my experience a dedicated, deliberate stop is the best trailer saving maneuver.

And I don't agree that an intentional slam-the-brakes procedure should ever be considered "the best" maneuver. It should be a "last resort" maneuver. Of course, its your boat so do it the way you want. But if this is your standard practice, don't be surprised when you see a bunk floating away at launch time. Or even worse, you get home and find a bunk completely missing and your hull bouncing on the metal bunk mounts

 

[txav8r]

I believe that is simply not the case. I wish it were. But - no matter how snug you will have it in the water/ramp, the boat will move and the stern tie downs will loosen up after even a short tow.

I do tend to winch the bow up against the roller pretty snug and tight (when pulling out/while it floats). But you can rip the bow eye off and your tie downs will still slack upon a tow, there is just enough flex in the trailer frame. The ONLY thing I know of that prevents that is a dedicated short stop.

I would like to see someone show me how they load the boat, do NOT tuck it with a short stop, AND have no slack on stern tie downs after some towing. My guess is - it is not going to happen.

So, no I don't agree at all. In my experience a dedicated, deliberate stop is the best trailer saving maneuver. Of course you do not want to take it too far, it needs to be done with some sense of touch.

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@swatski , it is possible to avoid doing your "stop to load" most of the time. It should not be the norm. If it is, your trailer isn't set up correctly. As mentioned, the MFI had a weak bow post and had to be bolted or welded to stop this behavior. The Shorelandr can be loose at the base of the post too. Mine was. I showed Phil Dill Boats when I bought it, as I knew about the previous trailer issues. All I did to show them was loosen the winch and rock the post and it moved. They took an 1/8" piece of steel and wedged it under the bow stop post while the mounting bolts were loose, and retightened. Problem solved. If you check your post when you launch the boat, I suspect you will find something similar. It can be modified to fix it pretty darn cheap and will save the bottom of your boat, your bunks, and your technique won't be required all the time...at least it will extend the life of said items. You will still have to do your slam stop occasionally, but it won't be the norm. And you say above, that you "tend to winch the bow up against the roller pretty snug"...it is either snug or its not. And I don't mean it to sound arrogant or corrective, just educational. When you load, the bow stop bolt needs to be wedged completely under and against the bow stop roller and I mean completely. And that is possible either power loading, or by winching if you replace the weak winch that came with the trailer...it is too light to winch the boat all the way up. The Fulton F2 winch gives twice the pull force of the stock winch. Those that always winch should make this mod or an equivalent...if you can't pcowerload. On the subject of power loading...if you idle the engines or shut them off after fully loading but before you fasten and winch the strap tight, it will back off when you pull up the ramp. If power loading, you MUST keep the power up and the bow stop bolt up under and fully against the roller until the strap is tight, then you idle and the boat should not back off even a little bit. If it does, you need to fix the problem. And in addition to the bow stop post movement, your strap could be stretching and you may need to roll it out and retighten it. Hope this helps eliminate or reduce procedures that should not be common practice. As you can see, I am in the two schools of thought here...either accept that the boat moves on the trailer, or fix it so it doesn't. And to keep on topic, the boat buckles also are a corrective action to the mentioned movement. They allow you to ratchet the boat more than the plain transom straps.

 

[swatski]

an intentional slam-the-brakes procedure should ever be considered "the best" maneuver

I believe I used a term"deliberate stop" to be performed with a "sense of touch". I would appreciate if you please do not put words in my mouth.

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[txav8r]

I wanted to say one more thing on the 100% certainties...they don't exist. When I was new to these boats, it was trial by fire...but I soon learned from my friends here, that some of my notions were just not correct and there were reasons for it. This is a perfect example of it, because I did not agree at first that the stinking bow stop post was the issue. I felt certain that Yamaha would put out a better trailer or at least spec a better one. I think they did, but that was not what was delivered. We have seen brand new trailers with failed or rotten bunks, post movement, incorrect loading for rated tires, bow stop rollers that scratch the hull, winches that break, surge brake units that don't work right off the showroom floor, and more. They are not the norm, but some are more normal than others. And the Shorelandr was a big improvement, but its not perfect, and neither are any of us! We have the membership here and their "gone down that road before" wisdom. Their thoughts are worth consideration and their desire is to share with the community, not dictate to it, we are a combined wisdom and no single one of us is worth the weight of that.

 

[swatski]

@swatski , it is possible to avoid doing your "stop to load" most of the time. It should not be the norm. If it is, your trailer isn't set up correctly. As mentioned, the MFI had a weak bow post and had to be bolted or welded to stop this behavior. The Shorelandr can be loose at the base of the post too. Mine was. I showed Phil Dill Boats when I bought it, as I knew about the previous trailer issues. All I did to show them was loosen the winch and rock the post and it moved. They took an 1/8" piece of steel and wedged it under the bow stop post while the mounting bolts were loose, and retightened. Problem solved. If you check your post when you launch the boat, I suspect you will find something similar. It can be modified to fix it pretty darn cheap and will save the bottom of your boat, your bunks, and your technique won't be required all the time...at least it will extend the life of said items. You will still have to do your slam stop occasionally, but it won't be the norm. And you say above, that you "tend to winch the bow up against the roller pretty snug"...it is either snug or its not. And I don't mean it to sound arrogant or corrective, just educational. When you load, the bow stop bolt needs to be wedged completely under and against the bow stop roller and I mean completely. And that is possible either power loading, or by winching if you replace the weak winch that came with the trailer...it is too light to winch the boat all the way up. The Fulton F2 winch gives twice the pull force of the stock winch. Those that always winch should make this mod or an equivalent...if you can't pcowerload. On the subject of power loading...if you idle the engines or shut them off after fully loading but before you fasten and winch the strap tight, it will back off when you pull up the ramp. If power loading, you MUST keep the power up and the bow stop bolt up under and fully against the roller until the strap is tight, then you idle and the boat should not back off even a little bit. If it does, you need to fix the problem. And in addition to the bow stop post movement, your strap could be stretching and you may need to roll it out and retighten it. Hope this helps eliminate or reduce procedures that should not be common practice. As you can see, I am in the two schools of thought here...either accept that the boat moves on the trailer, or fix it so it doesn't. And to keep on topic, the boat buckles also are a corrective action to the mentioned movement. They allow you to ratchet the boat more than the plain transom straps.

I don't know where do you guys do you trailering. Maybe it's the roads?

I doubt my trailer is much different from your average Shorland'r, those trailers have quite a bit of flex. I like my boat snug between the bow stop and the stern tie downs. Pretty much the best way (that I know of) to ascertain that is to perform the short stop maneuver, after I'm off the ramp. Works for every trailer, but those Yammies are special.

YMMV. As far as I am concerned, the last think I want to worry about is having slack on tie downs. No safe.

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[txav8r]

Just to be clear @swatski , my boat was always snug and without movement...even after 1000 mile trip. I don't worry about slack, but it is a trust but verify situation, so I trust it, but I also verify just a few minutes after leaving the ramp and again at each fuel stop on a long tow. It doesn't have to do with roads or ramps. It is the trailer setup that needs attention or the way it is loaded in the first place. That is the best way to ascertain that the boat is snug on the trailer. Your way works, its just not the best way.

It is ironic that this conversation is taking place because in talking to @Betik , he mentioned he is seeing this and I never did with that boat after shimming the bow stop post. He looked, and the shim has apparently fallen out since he bought my boat. He intends to get it reshimmed because he is seeing movement now. It is a simple fix and will stop many guys movement and need for heroics to seat the boat snug. And I completely agree with you that if your straps are loose it is not safe, and it isn't something you want to have to worry about.

 

[maboat]

I believe I used a term"deliberate stop" to be performed with a "sense of touch". I would appreciate if you please do not put words in my mouth.

I believe my original comment was to Kahuna's words of "sharp hard breaking". And I believe he was referring to your words of "quick 10mph hard stop".

Whichever word you choose "sharp", "hard", "quick", or "deliberate", the principle is the same. Your suggestion is to use enough forward momentum and then brake hard enough to force the boat to slide up on the bunks a few inches or even more. Doesn't matter how much "sense of touch" you have, it still inflicts a significant amount of force between the bunks and the lag bolts and that attachment is not made for those kinds of forces. I'm suggesting that process is not a wise procedure to do every time.

I also said "your boat so do it the way you want". But if you're going to tell others this is "the best" method then don't be surprised to see some alternate advice offered

 

[swatski]

But if you're going to tell others this is "the best" method then don't be surprised to see some alternate advice offered

Fair enough.

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[Betik]

I don't know when my post moved. I think during the long tow. But the transom start were very snag even the 1200 miles to Orlando.

 

[Brian Filas]

Put on some Boat Buckles this weekend. Here is my no-drill approach.

 

[jdonalds]

My trailer had simple non-ratcheting straps when I bought it. I installed the Boat Buckles which made a night/day difference. our launch and retrieval times dropped by minutes.

I consider the Boat Buckles the best money I've ever spent on and accessory for the boat. Mine are about 6 years old and have shown no signs of wear (fresh water only).

 

[Honey Badger]

I just put on boat buckles using the universal adapters



And they still provide horrible hardware for install, but if you email them about it they will 2-day real hardware and a hat to you. Haha

 

[jdonalds]

BoatBuckles are perhaps the single best option I've purchased for the boat and trailer. They cut our launch and retrieval time at the boat ramp from minutes to seconds. Our BoatBuckles are about six years old and have performed perfectly (fresh water).

 

[MidnightRider]

I’ve been boating all my life and the angle of the ramp makes a huge difference in how snug the bow hook is to the roller after you pull out. If you just think through the geometry it’s easy to see why. If the ramp is a steep angle the bow will hit the roller and can be tight but the back of the boat can still be very high off the trailer. As the trailer levels up going up and out of the ramp the back of the boat “roll” down causing the front of the boat to roll away. The amount depends on the steepness if the ramp and how far the back is off the trailer at sintch up time. With lighter boats you can usually just crank it up again after the boat is out with heavier boats you basically have 3 options. 1. Crank the boat tight, pull up the ramp a bit and crank again and repeat as needed (annoying if the ramp is busy). 2. Swaski move, just be gentle. Use a few gentle stops instead of one harsh one. 3. Just stop and recheck/re-tighten stern straps as needed on trip away from the ramp. Where I used to live we had one steep ramp and a shallow ramp on the other side of the lake - shallow ramp no gap ever, steep ramp 1” gap every time. No difference in loading routine.

 

[Jason A. Bolt]

Was reading this forum, so I walked out in the garage to re-look at the 210 FSH trailer and boat buckles. I grabbed a large rubber mallet and bent the existing tie down bracket towards the outside trailer rails and they bolted right up.