Driveshaft stuck

[Marcio Fazzio Martins]

Need help!
Engine mounts broke and engine moved forward.
Since the bearings do not sound good I decided to change the intermediate shaft housing.
I removed the engine to make it easy to change the mounts.
When removing the pump unit, the shaft moved a little bit and got stuck. After hammering around while pulling with an engine lifter attached to a tree it moved another inch and stopped.

Intermediate shaft is also stuck. By looking at the Service Manual, it seems that the only place it could be stuck is the male/female connection between the 2 shafts where the splines either have rust or they were damaged when the engine was running unaligned after the engine mounts gave up.

Any suggestions before considering cutting the shaft?

Would really appreciate some help.

Thanks!!!

 

[ross l]

Try putting the pump back on and removing the intermediate bearing assembly from inside the boat.
Remove the bolts from the intermediate bearing assembly holding it to the transom. When you push the pump back in the intermediate bearing assembly then would move forward.
Maybe then you could remove the intermediate bearing assembly or figure out a way from inside the boat use a puller/wedge system between the bearing and the transom.
Good luck.

 

[ross l]

Spray some penetrating oil on the shaft coupling male/female behind the intermediate bearing when you push the pump back in.

 

[Marcio Fazzio Martins]

Thank you for the reply.
If I push the pump back and pull the intermediate housing forward, how far am I gonna be from where the 2 shafts meet?

 

[ross l]

Based on what you've wrote... I would say an inch or so.

This video will give you a visual on how the pump shaft and intermediate shaft go together.

 

[Scottintexas]

don't cut the shaft unless you have another one ready, they are expensive and hard to find,

we've had members have to attach cable to the impeller and yank out with a jeep it was stuck so hard,

I would suggest locking it all back in and getting some constant pressure pulling on the impeller and tapping,

if not, maybe you could put a bottle jack between the transom and the intermediate bearing to push the bearing away from the shaft ??

 

[dan144k]

Also. Where are you located, maybe someone nearby could assist.
....
I would try and get some "tap magic" inside to allow the metal to slide apart.
I found it works better than penetrating oil on stuck things.
....
Also I would cut a block of wood to length (for job) and use a pry bar for leverage. If there are some pry points. (Idea)
. ...
It should pop off, just keep at it.
And
When you reassemble I would use never-seize.
.....
And yeah you don't want to cut the shaft. Has to me another way.

 

[scokill]

The question to me is how did the engine mounts break?

 

[Marcio Fazzio Martins]

The question to me is how did the engine mounts break?

Time... Rubber with 18 years old! Engines still running great. Boat is in really good conditions

Also. Where are you located, maybe someone nearby could assist.
....
I would try and get some "tap magic" inside to allow the metal to slide apart.
I found it works better than penetrating oil on stuck things.
....
Also I would cut a block of wood to length (for job) and use a pry bar for leverage. If there are some pry points. (Idea)
. ...
It should pop off, just keep at it.
And
When you reassemble I would use never-seize.
.....
And yeah you don't want to cut the shaft. Has to me another way.

Thank you for your advise dan144k

Today I tried again by hitting hard while tied to the tree and it doesn't seem to move at all. Also I pushed back the jet pump and slide forward the bearing housing to see if I could find the point where the 2 shafts join so I could see any separation.
Based on the videos I watched and the service manual specs, the joint should be less than 1" from the housing wall.
There is a line there, but it does not seems to be the join, if it is, they are really not moving at all.
I will attach the picture, if someone could tell me I would appreciate.

 

[Marcio Fazzio Martins]

Based on what you've wrote... I would say an inch or so.

This video will give you a visual on how the pump shaft and intermediate shaft go together.

That is what I figured, about 1 inch.

I slid the bearing housing and I see a line, but I am not sure this is where the shafts join.
Please, check the pictures I posted on the reply on the thread.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

You have the engine out so get a 5 pound slide hammer and connect it to the intermediate bearing housing and use it to pull the housing if the dampener is also still on the shaft you will need to remove that first the same way with the slide hammer, the last one I did the drive shaft goes through the intermediate bearing housing and then into the aluminum vibration dampener , the dampener is also a power take off so one side is attached to the engine and the other one is on the end of the drive shaft and the rubber parts go in between them with the engine out of the way that half stays connected to the back of the engine. So your drive shaft needs the aluminum piece removed first and then if you loosen the intermediate bearing housing you should be able to remove that using the slide hammer. the rubber line is the grease fitting hose that is another story but just pull it off the fitting. The picture on the video shows that part. the drive shaft has splines and the power take off vibration dampener also has splines and actually they just slide together but over time with dissimilar metals they corrode.

 

[Brad_Ct]

Looking at the pictures it appears the intermediate shaft has been pushed partially out of the bearing assembly towards the engine, the separation between the drive and intermediate shafts are inside the bearing assembly now.

 

[Marcio Fazzio Martins]

You have the engine out so get a 5 pound slide hammer and connect it to the intermediate bearing housing and use it to pull the housing if the dampener is also still on the shaft you will need to remove that first the same way with the slide hammer, the last one I did the drive shaft goes through the intermediate bearing housing and then into the aluminum vibration dampener , the dampener is also a power take off so one side is attached to the engine and the other one is on the end of the drive shaft and the rubber parts go in between them with the engine out of the way that half stays connected to the back of the engine. So your drive shaft needs the aluminum piece removed first and then if you loosen the intermediate bearing housing you should be able to remove that using the slide hammer. the rubber line is the grease fitting hose that is another story but just pull it off the fitting. The picture on the video shows that part. the drive shaft has splines and the power take off vibration dampener also has splines and actually they just slide together but over time with dissimilar metals they corrode.

First I want to thank you to make the time to help!
I definitely understand how all these parts are connected, but the biggest issue is not to damage other parts by using too much power or doing it the wrong way.
On your suggestions there are a few things that I could not understand well. For example, you said “if the dampener is also still on the shaft you will need to remove that first the same way with the slide hammer”… I think what you call dampener is the aluminum part (number 35 on the attached image) that is attached to intermediate shaft, right? If so, this part is attached with thread and I dont think it is possible to unscrew it while on the boat. You may be referring to another part.
Since you have dealt with these issues before, I would appreciate if I could contact you by phone so I could clarify a few things.
if not, I am attaching the drawing that you could point out the ones you mentioned.
Also, today I have used a slide hammer, but I do not have attachments so I had to improvise with a nut. Could you show me what kind of attachment you used?
Thank you again!

Looking at the pictures it appears the intermediate shaft has been pushed partially out of the bearing assembly towards the engine, the separation between the drive and intermediate shafts are inside the bearing assembly now.

Yes, and the only way I think this happened was when the engine mounts failed and the engine slid forward while running 9K rpm. And the pressure on the rubber between the flange couplings did not allowed them to disconnect and pulled the intermediate shaft out.
I tried to hammer it back so I could use some PB Blaster where the shafts join, but it did not move.
Hopefully Cobra Jet give me a little more details on how he dealt with similar issue, so I can try.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

The aluminum piece that is on the end of your drive shaft is not screwed on, the driveshaft just slides in and there is a collar that goes in the intermediate bearing with splines that match the drive shaft.
Yes I built special ends to work the pump out , I pulled the pump not the coupler but you have the engine out so I suggested trying it that way also be very careful not to loose any shims that were under the motor mounts and to remember what went where as those shims align the engine
number 2 on the parts diagram is the actual collar for the driveshaft it screws into number 35 the end of the driveshaft is inside number 2 no pun intended, number 2 is pressed into the intermediate bearing housing

 

[Marcio Fazzio Martins]

The aluminum piece that is on the end of your drive shaft is not screwed on, the driveshaft just slides in and there is a collar that goes in the intermediate bearing with splines that match the drive shaft.
Yes I built special ends to work the pump out , I pulled the pump not the coupler but you have the engine out so I suggested trying it that way also be very careful not to loose any shims that were under the motor mounts and to remember what went where as those shims align the engine
number 2 on the parts diagram is the actual collar for the driveshaft it screws into number 35 the end of the driveshaft is inside number 2 no pun intended, number 2 is pressed into the intermediate bearing housing View attachment 183323View attachment 183324

I am sorry for taking your time!

Unfortunately, I am not sure about some of the parts you mentioned on your first reply, that is why I questioned and attached the diagram so you could point them out.

Reading your 2nd reply, it seems that I am not recognizing the parts you are mentioning and the method you are suggesting.

Could you add the number on the diagram on your reply?

You wrote:
The aluminum piece (Part number ?) that is on the end of your drive shaft (Part number ?) is not screwed on, the driveshaft just slides in and there is a collar that goes in the intermediate bearing with splines that match the drive shaft.

number 2 on the parts diagram is the actual collar for the driveshaft it screws into number 35 the end of the driveshaft is inside number 2 no pun intended, number 2 is pressed into the intermediate bearing housing (on this paragraph you confirm what I pointed on my reply, but your 1st paragraph it looks like you are talking about these same parts. “The aluminum piece that is on the…”)

If you have a chance, please call me at (786) 554-1204. I won’t take much of your time, and it would be way easier to identify the parts and what you are suggesting.

Thank you again

 

[Marcio Fazzio Martins]

You have the engine out so get a 5 pound slide hammer and connect it to the intermediate bearing housing and use it to pull the housing if the dampener is also still on the shaft you will need to remove that first the same way with the slide hammer, the last one I did the drive shaft goes through the intermediate bearing housing and then into the aluminum vibration dampener , the dampener is also a power take off so one side is attached to the engine and the other one is on the end of the drive shaft and the rubber parts go in between them with the engine out of the way that half stays connected to the back of the engine. So your drive shaft needs the aluminum piece removed first and then if you loosen the intermediate bearing housing you should be able to remove that using the slide hammer. the rubber line is the grease fitting hose that is another story but just pull it off the fitting. The picture on the video shows that part. the drive shaft has splines and the power take off vibration dampener also has splines and actually they just slide together but over time with dissimilar metals they corrode.

You wrote:

“You have the engine out so get a 5 pound slide hammer and connect it to the intermediate bearing housing and use it to pull the housing if the dampener (What Part# ?) is also still on the shaft you will need to remove that first the same way with the slide hammer” (I do not know what is the “dampener”. I thought you were talking about Part 35, therefore could not be removed with life hammer)

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

2 screws into 35 and it has splines , the drive shaft has splines and it is inside of 2 and it slides off when it is not stuck like yours the only way to get the drive shaft out is PULL it OUY I would do it from the pump when it comes loose the pump and the driveshaft all come out in one piece . you must get the driveshaft spline to release from the splines inside 2.

 

[Marcio Fazzio Martins]

2 screws into 35 and it has splines , the drive shaft has splines and it is inside of 2 and it slides off when it is not stuck like yours the only way to get the drive shaft out is PULL it OUY I would do it from the pump when it comes loose the pump and the driveshaft all come out in one piece . you must get the driveshaft spline to release from the splines inside 2.

This part is very clear from the beginning, I just do not understand what you meant by "dampener" and also "the aluminum piece". That is why I asked you to ad the part number from diagram.

 

[Marcio Fazzio Martins]

2 screws into 35 and it has splines , the drive shaft has splines and it is inside of 2 and it slides off when it is not stuck like yours the only way to get the drive shaft out is PULL it OUY I would do it from the pump when it comes loose the pump and the driveshaft all come out in one piece . you must get the driveshaft spline to release from the splines inside 2.

Sorry brother, I have removed the Jet pump a few times in the past, I know how all the parts are attached. But never faced that frozen slices before and I am trying to figure out the best way not to cause more damage by using pure force.

 

[Marcio Fazzio Martins]

Looking at the pictures it appears the intermediate shaft has been pushed partially out of the bearing assembly towards the engine, the separation between the drive and intermediate shafts are inside the bearing assembly now.

The one thing that I can’t figure out is, if the intermediate shaft has slid out 1” as it appears on the picture, and the end of the drive shaft is somewhere inside the bearing house, how is it possible that This joint point is so much inside the boat if the impeller is still attached and ,of course, the drive shaft cannot simply grow in length.
The only way I can think about is that both shafts are still attached but had already slid out a little bit Inside the bearing housing.
Does it make sense?