EV discussion - hate or love?

[Beachbummer]

Says in this video around 1:30, you just pull the release "All the way" if you are stuck inside with a dead battery.

Guessing MachE has a mechanical backup.

I will admit that I don't understand the need or desire to change stuff like this. EVs, in general, trend to change random shit just for the sake of change and I've yet to find good reasons for a lot of it. Electronic door latches, electric vent adjustments (which I loathe in my Rivian), back in)pull up charging straps and no driver display/gauge cluster are examples of this trend. The industry, collectively, spent decades ironing out the general form factor and accepted functionality and for some reason, because it's electric, there exists this need to change.

Maybe I'm more luddite than I think, but I don't get it.

I'm with you. I think it's the desire to justify the increased price. The 2 features I dislike the most from my Model Y are frameless windows (which require the glass to move on every operation. Not the first car ever to do this, but WHY?) and "Too smart to get out of your own way" cruise control. I want the car to drive 75MPH regardless of what's around it' I'll deal with it....not an option, car is always slowing down for perceived traffic making crappy calls, I'm always turning that thing off. The needless electric door latch, I don't understand the reason for, but at least it operates without detriment, like these other ones.

I really like it otherwise, and no gas station and fuel savings along with high torque and power available totally make up for these deficiencies so far.

 

[2kwik4u]

I really like it otherwise, and no gas station and fuel savings along with high torque and power available totally make up for these deficiencies so far.

I've been saying the same thing to people who have been asking. It's the reason Rivian is at the top of the customer satisfaction rankings, while not having great reliability rankings. When it's good, man, it's really good. When it's bad, it's not that bad. So you end up with this weirdly slanted customer state where they love it, despite all the wonky little shortcomings.

In general, the EV powertrain is just so smooth and powerful it makes driving easy. The lack of worry over a transmission (although I do have a clutched rear drive unit in mine), or engine noise and what that might mean is nice. I was really looking for something I could just in and drive without having to worry about. This is really doing that for me.

The Rivian in particular.....I'm going to be on the struggle bus to give up a trunk and gear tunnel when it comes time to turn this lease in. Still have 31 months left on the lease, so I've got some time to figure it out

 

[Coult45]

@Bottom Bracket @Coult45

Interestingly enough, this came across my feed on Reddit this morning.

Woman had a child trapped in a MachE with a dead 12V battery.

https://www.reddit.com/r/MachE/s/Oz01ZETfvl

This post appears to confirm the extra mechanical release inside, however the child couldn't reach or otherwise activate it.

https://www.reddit.com/r/MachE/s/IKy7UNpDFF

Here's a recent follow up. Ford initially didn't do the right thing here, owner put them on blast, now they're working with her.

https://www.reddit.com/r/MachE/s/v1KliwvWp9

Another example of changing some mundane, already solved engineering problem either for some small unknown benefit, or for the sake of change itself; then generating these unintended consequences like trapped kids in cars.

Thanks! I had no idea about that functionality. Great to know, and stupid to need.

 

[BlkGS]

I always assume when companies change dumb stuff for the sake of changing it they do it for IP reasons. They hope that some other company follows suit with them so they can sue them for violating their IP.

Frameless windows, have been a thing on Corvettes since at least the C4. They did it because you could take the roof off and it's look stupid with a door frame hanging out there. There's no good reason to do it on a car with a fixed roof other than to make people think it's advanced because it moves the window down a little to open the doors. It does not seal as well as a framed window does. Modern ones seal well enough, but not as well as a framed door.

I think they also don't to drive in the "we're so different" angle. Like 2k pointed out, they have crap reliability ratings. If a Chevy had the same kind of reliability issues people would be pissed. But by pushing the "we're so different" angle, people are a bit more forgiving I think. IMO, that's why the more mainstream EVs don't have the same levels of good will. Because they're not new and different, people expect them to be polished and if they're not they're not satisfied.

First reviews of the new EV charger came in... They're pretty well all negative. Looks like that's going to be the biggest product flop... Maybe ever? It plays fake burnout sounds. It can't actually do a burnout. Pretty pathetic for a "muscle car".

 

[Bluewater272]

I dunno about people being pissed... they still buy new Stellantis products.

 

[BlkGS]

I dunno about people being pissed... they still buy new Stellantis products.

Not as many as they used to. Sales down like 25% YoY. Who would have guessed that pushing the prices of vehicles that haven't really changed in 7 years to the moon then dropping basically the only valuable brand you have (Hemi) would have been a bad idea?

All that said, by FAR the worst part of the Dodge situation is their dealers. I tried to buy a Durango Hellcat. Their dealers are the absolute worst dumpster fires out there. They won't give you a written quote because "you could take it elsewhere to price shop". They all advertise fake prices that only people who are current leasees, first responders, active Military, students, hurricane victims, and anything else they can throw at you qualify for... plus a few grand in undisclosed dealer junk fees. I was ready to buy a Durango, but out of the like 8 dealers that I contacted who had one, most of which had been sitting for a year, half didn't respond at all, the other half were like "oh you're interested in one of our cars? WE GOT A SUCKER ON THE LINE!". Nuts, I'm honestly surprised their sales hadn't slipped even more.

 

[Bottom Bracket]

I dunno about people being pissed... they still buy new Stellantis products.

She loves her Stellantis! 21' new, low 30's,
22 miles mpg REAR WHEEL DRIVE and a hoot to drive. I get the tickets, she gets them in the mail.
Also, the Stelantis Ramcharger motor generator setup has piqued my interest as a long distance tow vehicle. I believe it has the same motor as her 300.

I can find a windshield wiper motor for the mach e, ford e truck, prius. Can't find real hard parts for Tesla or Rivian, effectively destroying any chance of a local repair shop fixing it.

 

[2kwik4u]

First reviews of the new EV charger came in... They're pretty well all negative. Looks like that's going to be the biggest product flop... Maybe ever? It plays fake burnout sounds. It can't actually do a burnout. Pretty pathetic for a "muscle car".

I watched the Out of Spec review on the new Challenarger Daytona thing. Kyle gave it a pretty harsh review overall. Doesn't look like a great first effort on Dodge's part to get into the EV space.

I can find a windshield wiper motor for the mach e, ford e truck, prius. Can't find real hard parts for Tesla or Rivian, effectively destroying any chance of a local repair shop fixing it.

This is a legit concern I have on long term ownership of a Rivian, Tesla, or any other vehicle that doesn't have a standing dealer network. It's really hard to walk into a parts department to get something, when there is no parts department. I hate/loathe/detest the dealership for purchasing, but I think a robust service department can overshadow the crap experience on the front end.

 

[zpaul]

The biggest concern for me about EV is their relatively small range on 1 charge. When they finally hit the 1000-km mark on 1 charge it will be a gamechanger. I am sure that quite a few people are stopped from buying an EV only because of range. I am one of them.

When you get EV and start driving, you'll see that you charge 99% of the time at home, which is better then visiting gas pump.
And when you go on long trips EV chargers are everywhere at least on east coast and west coast and all major interstates.

 

[2kwik4u]

The biggest concern for me about EV is their relatively small range on 1 charge. When they finally hit the 1000-km mark on 1 charge it will be a gamechanger. I am sure that quite a few people are stopped from buying an EV only because of range. I am one of them.

621mi or 1000km is an absurd goalpost. No idea what you're driving now, but you're talking about being able to drive 9.5hrs without a refill. Average range for an ICE is around 350mi. You want an EV to DOUBLE that?!?

Honest, non judgmental question here; Why is that your goalpost? What road trip or use case do you have that requires that much range?

@BlkGS has thrown some pretty strong road trip claims down, and I suspect even he doesn't think that's necessary

 

[Ribs77]

Yeah, 600+ miles is bonkers and I wouldn't expect to see it ever as a mainstream target. Most people can't drive that far safely anyway without a break.

We drive a good amount, have done road trips of 4,000+ miles, and I'm basically a long-haul trucker at heart, but I won't drive more than 3-4 hours without at least a small break.

I'd want 300 mile range absolute minimum, 350 more like it, and 400 as a slight bonus. That would allow a solid 4 hours of driving at ~70, take a 30-60 minute food break while charging, another 4 hours of driving. That's a solid day right there, covering 560 miles.

Now, the question is, can you get a full charge in 60 mins? I have no idea!

 

[Bottom Bracket]

Unsubstantiated Ai answer to a Google question, "Ramcharger range?"

690 miles

Ram estimates the Ramcharger can go 145 miles on electricity alone, and when combined with a full tank of gas, the PHEV truck claims a combined range of up to 690 miles. That's over 170 miles more than the current farthest-driving EV, the Lucid Air Grand Touring.

 

[Neutron]

Unsubstantiated Ai answer to a Google question, "Ramcharger range?"

690 miles

Ram estimates the Ramcharger can go 145 miles on electricity alone, and when combined with a full tank of gas, the PHEV truck claims a combined range of up to 690 miles. That's over 170 miles more than the current farthest-driving EV, the Lucid Air Grand Touring.

Doubt real world use will get that, probably closer to 500. They also made big claims on their plug in wrangler but real world was very poor

 

[Bottom Bracket]

I gotta stop to pee and run a tennis ball up and down my back on a wall every 250 so there's that.

 

[BigN8]

621mi or 1000km is an absurd goalpost. No idea what you're driving now, but you're talking about being able to drive 9.5hrs without a refill. Average range for an ICE is around 350mi. You want an EV to DOUBLE that?!?

Honest, non judgmental question here; Why is that your goalpost? What road trip or use case do you have that requires that much range?

@BlkGS has thrown some pretty strong road trip claims down, and I suspect even he doesn't think that's necessary

You’re assuming that’s his goal based on not stopping. I take it as being able to drive that far without charging. Like being able to make a 10-12 hour drive without worrying about stopping in conjunction with a charge.

 

[Neutron]

What would be the estimated charge time on a vehicle like the Ramcharger? And i am asking about the quick charging time

 

[Bottom Bracket]

https://www.ramtrucks.com/electric/ram-1500-ramcharger.html

 

[Neutron]

https://www.ramtrucks.com/electric/ram-1500-ramcharger.html

Didn't see anything on charge times in there

 

[2kwik4u]

What would be the estimated charge time on a vehicle like the Ramcharger? And i am asking about the quick charging time

Theoretically, Zero. Like a plug in hybrid, I would have to think it could run fully on fuel and recharge to 100% as needed. Otherwise, it'll be governed by the same tech as other EV's.

Looks like it has a 92kWh battery, and that site says up to 145kW charging. I would assume similar metrics to other EV's with similar sized batteries and charge rates. Likely get 10%-80% in an hour or less, and a full 0%-100% in a 2-3hrs.

I have a 131kWh battery and here's some good examples of road trip charges; adding 60% in about 50min. That top one shows a good session where I added almost 200mi of EPA range in 48min (or 238mph). That bottom one likely didn't "fall off" the top tier of the charging curve with 139mi added in 27min (309mph). That 92kWh battery won't have as "big" of a sweet spot for charging as mine does, and won't come close to touching what the Silverado has. Of course they could pull a move like Audi and have a relatively low peak, but get the curve to be flat as a pancake. Audi's only charge at like 120kW or something, but they'll hold that rate from 5% through 90% I think. So the "sweet spot" for fast charging is much larger, and leads to lower overall time spend at the station.


With the generator, on a road trip, I would suspect you could charge to 100% overnight at home, then drive that full 600-ish miles and not have to charge again. There's a lot of "wonkyness" to the EREV charging strategy really. I was watching the OutOfSpec review on the new Scout Harvester this morning. They discussed route planning difficulties surrounding the EREV configuration.

That is all to say, I'm not sure anyone really knows at this point.

 

[2kwik4u]

I gotta stop to pee and run a tennis ball up and down my back on a wall every 250 so there's that.

This is really the limiting factor for us on a road trip as well. I can sometimes "road warrior" my day, but anything over about 300mi or so, and I'm ready to get the hell out of the car for a few minutes anyway.

Honestly, I'm kind of liking the additional walking I'm getting with EV stops. The chargers are always at the edge of a parking lot, or behind a building or something. So I have to walk a bit to get to the restroom and snacks. It's not enough to keep my waistline from the constant expansion it's found as of late, but it is being nice to me knees and back with that little bit of activity.