Financing When?

[kgower]

Ok I've been on the forum a couple of months waiting on delivery like many of you. Also like many of you in the interim I've bought a lot, read a lot, watched a lot of videos and lined up insurance. We are putting down around 25%. For those who financed, when did you look into financing, ahead of time, after you got the call, just took Yamaha? Should I just take Yamaha for the ease of buying the boat then refinance locally?

 

[Dean P]

I've done that in the past to get a better deal from the dealer. Then, I refinanced to get the best rate. I'd tried to do it close together so your credit doesn't take too much of a hit will all the hard pulls. They say, hard pulls in the same timeframe towards the same possible purchase, kinda get grouped together rather than months apart. So "they" (being banks) say...

 

[kgower]

I've done that in the past to get a better deal from the dealer. Then, I refinanced to get the best rate. I'd tried to do it close together so your credit doesn't take too much of a hit will all the hard pulls. They say, hard pulls in the same timeframe towards the same possible purchase, kinda get grouped together rather than months apart. So "they" (being banks) say...

I have been a mortgage lender since 1995, and yes that is accurate. "Like" pulls within 30 days are treated as one.

 

[portlandbucfan]

I just took Yamaha, once I submitted app online heard back in 15 mins.

 

[HangOutdoors]

Actually, for the most part, multiple inquiries "CODED" the same are considered in certain FICO scoring models as the same. Older versions of FICO scoring were 14 days and some of the newest versions are up to 45 days. Mortgages are 30 days.
1) There are three key things to remember. Some lenders will do a "Soft Pull" to quote/preapprove/approve and some will do a "Hard Pull". The Soft Pulls are not seen by other lenders and don't affect your FICO Score. The Hard Pulls can and do both.
2) From the current 3 bureau's, Equifax Transunion and Experian, you have 25 different credit scores depending on scoring model. Also you scores can be different between them all and they usually are. Lenders use different scores depending. It is always good to ask which scoring model they use, not just the bureau. Some are antiquated but do pop up for use.

1. FICO Bankcard Score 8
2. FICO Bankcard Score 5,4,2
3. FICO Score 3
4. FICO Bankcard Score 9
5. FICO Score 9 (Latest and Greatest some adoption, usually highest score. FICO Score 10 and 10+ is in the works to replace)
6. FICO Auto Score, 5,4,3,8,9 (Usually Auto's and Recreation Vehicles
7. FICO SCORE 5,4,2 (Usually Mortgages)

3) If you have your credit pulled from one bank and it is for "Recreational" Installment, and all other lenders you shop do the same thing with the window period, it will very marginally affect your score and be considered typically as 1. The problem arises that one lender will pull it as a personal loan, another installment, another consumer finance account (Don't even get me started on why Ford Motor Credit codes all their loans this way), etc. etc. If that occurs then they will count as multiple, don't let the lenders tell you otherwise, it is your credit that will take the hit, which is only temporarily of course. MAKE sure that you inquire how the lender you choose will be showing the account on the credit bureau. You don't want it to be a CFA, the models take a bigger hit when this does eventually appear on your credit as a loan.

Please remember the they are always tweaking the scoring models and with COVID there have been underlying changes to risk modeling and patterns.

All of this may be worth something to you or not, figured I would share the info. If you want more in depth knowledge on specific lenders and have credit questions there is only one site to go to, it will have all the information above as well as letting you pull all 25 scores for yourself so you know. Don't be fooled by Credit Karma and all the other free credit sites, A lot of them use Vantage 3.0 Score which is garbage or some proprietary model. The forums on this site are fantastic. It is under Community off the main site.

Home - myFICO® Forums

Your FICO Score, from FICO | myFICO

I was in finance/lending for half my life and now in IT and we maintain/develop software and lending applications and modeling analysis for several our our clients.

 

[Dean P]

Actually, for the most part, multiple inquiries "CODED" the same are considered in certain FICO scoring models as the same. Older versions of FICO scoring were 14 days and some of the newest versions are up to 45 days. Mortgages are 30 days.
1) There are three key things to remember. Some lenders will do a "Soft Pull" to quote/preapprove/approve and some will do a "Hard Pull". The Soft Pulls are not seen by other lenders and don't affect your FICO Score. The Hard Pulls can and do both.
2) From the current 3 bureau's, Equifax Transunion and Experian, you have 25 different credit scores depending on scoring model. Also you scores can be different between them all and they usually are. Lenders use different scores depending. It is always good to ask which scoring model they use, not just the bureau. Some are antiquated but do pop up for use.

1. FICO Bankcard Score 8
2. FICO Bankcard Score 5,4,2
3. FICO Score 3
4. FICO Bankcard Score 9
5. FICO Score 9 (Latest and Greatest some adoption, usually highest score. FICO Score 10 and 10+ is in the works to replace)
6. FICO Auto Score, 5,4,3,8,9 (Usually Auto's and Recreation Vehicles
7. FICO SCORE 5,4,2 (Usually Mortgages)

3) If you have your credit pulled from one bank and it is for "Recreational" Installment, and all other lenders you shop do the same thing with the window period, it will very marginally affect your score and be considered typically as 1. The problem arises that one lender will pull it as a personal loan, another installment, another consumer finance account (Don't even get me started on why Ford Motor Credit codes all their loans this way), etc. etc. If that occurs then they will count as multiple, don't let the lenders tell you otherwise, it is your credit that will take the hit, which is only temporarily of course. MAKE sure that you inquire how the lender you choose will be showing the account on the credit bureau. You don't want it to be a CFA, the models take a bigger hit when this does eventually appear on your credit as a loan.

Please remember the they are always tweaking the scoring models and with COVID there have been underlying changes to risk modeling and patterns.

All of this may be worth something to you or not, figured I would share the info. If you want more in depth knowledge on specific lenders and have credit questions there is only one site to go to, it will have all the information above as well as letting you pull all 25 scores for yourself so you know. Don't be fooled by Credit Karma and all the other free credit sites, A lot of them use Vantage 3.0 Score which is garbage or some proprietary model. The forums on this site are fantastic. It is under Community off the main site.

Home - myFICO® Forums

Your FICO Score, from FICO | myFICO

I was in finance/lending for half my life and now in IT and we maintain/develop software and lending applications and modeling analysis for several our our clients.

Great info; thanks for sharing. Is there a "free website" to obtain good, accurate scores? Which would you recommend?

 

[HangOutdoors]

@Dean P No, I haven't found one that is free and that would give you all the relevant scores. I would personally recommend that you pay just for one three bureau pull to see all of your 25 scores so you can see them. Again most of the free ones, give you one score that really no lender uses, such as Vantage or other. That is why they are free. Credit Card companies will typically show you your score once a month or two, but read the fine print to know which score it is.... FICO 8, FICO 9, etc. You won't be able to tell which flavor though usually.

 

[adrianp89]

You can start your shopping now. I looked at 100s of credit unions/banks nationwide to find the best rate. Dealer did not want to match it, even though I know other Yamaha dealers offered the rate I wanted. Odds are the place with the best rate will remain that way. If it's a CU, open a account and deposit $5 so thats out of the way. Once you know your within 30 days of taking the boat, apply for the loan.

 

[kgower]

You can start your shopping now. I looked at 100s of credit unions/banks nationwide to find the best rate. Dealer did not want to match it, even though I know other Yamaha dealers offered the rate I wanted. Odds are the place with the best rate will remain that way. If it's a CU, open a account and deposit $5 so thats out of the way. Once you know your within 30 days of taking the boat, apply for the loan.

I have looked a couple of times online, won't pull the trigger until needed.

 

[kgower]

Here's one option to at least monitor you credit for errors.

Annual Credit Report.com - Home Page

 

[ifly4fun]

Great info; thanks for sharing. Is there a "free website" to obtain good, accurate scores? Which would you recommend?

Credit Karma and Credit Sesame are free and decent enough.. apps for your phone too and you get daily/weekly updates depending on buereau

 

[2kwik4u]

@Dean P No, I haven't found one that is free. I would personally recommend that you pay just for one three bureau pull to see all of your 25 scores so you can see them. Again most of the free ones, give you one score that really no lender uses, such as Vantage or other. That is why they are free. Credit Card companies will typically show you your score once a month or two, but read the fine print to know which score it is.... FICO 8, FICO 9, etc. You won't be able to tell which flavor though usually.

Just had this with the purchase of the Q7. Capital One, Amex, and Discover all told me I was mid 700's score. So that is what I told the lender during initial talks. When it was time to actually pull I was closer to high 700's, and I was amazed. I have admittedly high credit utilization as compared to limits, and thought I would be lower than the CC's told me. Lender said that being higher was more rare than being lower, and that the CC's score pulling methods are really lousy and inaccurate. Has to tell a couple people a week why they didn't get approved even though their CC says they're good.

In terms of boat financing to answer @kgower question......I went with Yamaha's financing. It was backed by Synchrony at the time, and was a PIA. They didn't offer online for payments for some reason, so I had to send BillPay every month. Not a terrible thing, but really, it's 2017 (at the time) get with the online program. I even have Synchrony for some other financed items, and they're online payment is just fine and super easy. NOW, Yamaha has brought the financing back in house. It's equally a PIA, but has online payments now. The website looks like something my 9yr old could design, but it works, my account gets paid, and it's fairly easy.

If I was buying new again, I would get a loan from a local credit union, or other lendor and show up with a check.

 

[HangOutdoors]

Lender said that being higher was more rare than being lower, and that the CC's score pulling methods are really lousy and inaccurate. Has to tell a couple people a week why they didn't get approved even though their CC says they're good.

Exactly. Here all the time how people are pissed because some credit card company told them they had one score but really it was something else.

Everyone follows their own model and again you have 25 different credit scores. Actually there are others but are rarely used from other Credit Type agencies. They are typically looked at for Employment, Bank Account and Brokerage Account New Accounts.

 

[LakesideLaw]

FYI for those wondering- Yamaha financing was super easy - do it once the boat comes in - 10 minutes to apply and dealer called me tonight from my boat on FaceTime to tell me I was approved at Tier 1 - 3 options to choose. 2.99% @ 60 months; 3.99% at 180 months and 4.99% at 240 months.

they don’t require anything down payment actually but I put 20% down. Pretty low rates for a Rec loan.

local CU best rate was 6.95% for 120 months and 20% down required so Yamaha was quite a bit better.

 

[kgower]

FYI for those wondering- Yamaha financing was super easy - do it once the boat comes in - 10 minutes to apply and dealer called me tonight from my boat on FaceTime to tell me I was approved at Tier 1 - 3 options to choose. 2.99% @ 60 months; 3.99% at 180 months and 4.99% at 240 months.

they don’t require anything down payment actually but I put 20% down. Pretty low rates for a Rec loan.

local CU best rate was 6.95% for 120 months and 20% down required so Yamaha was quite a bit better.

Leaning toward 120. Does Yamaha offer120?

 

[LakesideLaw]

Leaning toward 120. Does Yamaha offer120?

I was not given an option for 120 months but I also did not ask. I do not plan on paying it out for the term no matter what - for me I try to pay anything I buy off in 3 years or less (if I cannot just pay in cash). I am going with the 3.99% at 180 months as it was the best value rate for me - payment was only $42 a month difference between 180 and 240 term and I will never hold the term 180 months but if I get into a jam for a month I only have to worry about covering the low monthly payment.

I suppose if they offer it up to 180 they could just prorate it down to 120 - I would inquire about that during your application process and have them quote that out of the gate.

 

[Quad]

I was not given an option for 120 months but I also did not ask. I do not plan on paying it out for the term no matter what - for me I try to pay anything I buy off in 3 years or less (if I cannot just pay in cash). I am going with the 3.99% at 180 months as it was the best value rate for me - payment was only $42 a month difference between 180 and 240 term and I will never hold the term 180 months but if I get into a jam for a month I only have to worry about covering the low monthly payment.

I suppose if they offer it up to 180 they could just prorate it down to 120 - I would inquire about that during your application process and have them quote that out of the gate.

There’s no penalty for early payments with Yamaha, we typically take longer terms than necessary and pay down as quickly as possible. If some sort of trouble arises and we need cash, we drop to the lowest payment.

 

[LakesideLaw]

There’s no penalty for early payments with Yamaha, we typically take longer terms than necessary and pay down as quickly as possible. If some sort of trouble arises and we need cash, we drop to the lowest payment.

Exactly... my same thoughts.