Reverse Steering Yamaha vs Seadoo

[billkaos]

I own a Seadoo challenger so I am familiar with how reverse steering works with it (ie: what direction the stern moves in reverse). I also know that the way Seadoo (or any rotax) set up works is the opposite of a prop driven boat in reverse. My question is two part-(a) is yamaha reverse steering the same as a prop driven boat with respect to how the boat turns or is it the same as a Seadoo (rotax)? (B)- do lateral thrusters change or enhance the movement in reverse on a yamaha boat? If so in what way. I have thrust vectors on my Seadoo so I already know about them.

 

[Sidarousmg]

I own a Seadoo challenger so I am familiar with how reverse steering works with it (ie: what direction the stern moves in reverse). I also know that the way Seadoo (or any rotax) set up works is the opposite of a prop driven boat in reverse. My question is two part-(a) is yamaha reverse steering the same as a prop driven boat with respect to how the boat turns or is it the same as a Seadoo (rotax)? (B)- do lateral thrusters change or enhance the movement in reverse on a yamaha boat? If so in what way. I have thrust vectors on my Seadoo so I already know about them.

Yamahas steer the same as a prop boat, Unlike the Seadoos (where the bow of the boat moves in the same direction as the steering wheel, regardless if you are in forward or reverse). As I understand it, the lateral thrusters do not alter the direction the bow moves, but they add more "lateral thrust" when in reverse.

 

[biffdotorg]

Yamahas steer the same as a prop boat, Unlike the Seadoos (where the bow of the boat moves in the same direction as the steering wheel, regardless if you are in forward or reverse). As I understand it, the lateral thrusters do not alter the direction the bow moves, but they add more "lateral thrust" when in reverse.

After owning both a SeaDoo and a Yamaha, and 5 waverunners, I have no idea what you just tried to explain. Other than your last line about LT's is accurate and answers the question.

Seadoo and Yamaha boats both use jet thrust to move the stern of the boat. And in reverse, use a cup over the jet nozzle to direct thrust under the boat. That being said, the mechanics are the same. Albeit, SeaDoo has done a much better job of it over the years. Even the SeaDoos that were powered by Mercury SportJets were better steering than most Yamahas.

Neither are as solid steering as an outdrive or outboard. They all just take getting used to. The difference is the prop boats are pulling in reverse where a jet is pushing water under the boat in reverse. So you are literally pushing the stern.

As far as the comment of a Seadoo pushing the bow, without a thruster up front, no, you are still pushing the stern in forward, causing the bow to cut right or left on both brands. It's boat physics that some folks just never figure out till they have smacked a few docks and realize, they cannot move the bow sideways. They can move the stern to make the bow point where they want.

 

[Sidarousmg]

After owning both a SeaDoo and a Yamaha, and 5 waverunners, I have no idea what you just tried to explain. Other than your last line about LT's is accurate and answers the question.

Seadoo and Yamaha boats both use jet thrust to move the stern of the boat. And in reverse, use a cup over the jet nozzle to direct thrust under the boat. That being said, the mechanics are the same. Albeit, SeaDoo has done a much better job of it over the years. Even the SeaDoos that were powered by Mercury SportJets were better steering than most Yamahas.

Neither are as solid steering as an outdrive or outboard. They all just take getting used to. The difference is the prop boats are pulling in reverse where a jet is pushing water under the boat in reverse. So you are literally pushing the stern.

As far as the comment of a Seadoo pushing the bow, without a thruster up front, no, you are still pushing the stern in forward, causing the bow to cut right or left on both brands. It's boat physics that some folks just never figure out till they have smacked a few docks and realize, they cannot move the bow sideways. They can move the stern to make the bow point where they want.

on the seadoo boats, regardless of the direction of the boat movement (forward or reverse), the bow of the boat follows the steering wheel (not that the bow is actually moving, but that is the direction the bow "gets" moved). so turn the steering wheel to the right, and the front of the boat will swivel to the right, regardless if i'm in forward or reverse. on a Yamaha (or any outboard), the same is true when moving forward (turn steering wheel to the right, the bow of the boat turns in the same direction) but when moving in reverse, the bow of the boat moves in the opposite direction of the steering wheel. i believe this is what the OP was inquiring about.

 

[biffdotorg]

Seadoo and Yamaha are exactly the same as far as direction of the wheel in regards to direction of thrust. This applies to forward or reverse.

 

[Sidarousmg]

Seadoo and Yamaha are exactly the same as far as direction of the wheel in regards to direction of thrust. This applies to forward or reverse.

this has not been my experience with the Yamahas I have driven (190 and 212). in the Yamaha, put in reverse: turn steering wheel to the right, the stern of the boat moves to the right, causing the bow to push in the opposite direction (left). in a seadoo, put in reverse: turn steering wheel to the right, the stern moves to the left, pushing the bow of the boat to the right.

 

[billkaos]

Thanks so far for the responses. I certainly already understand that my jet boat is always applying forward thrust regardless of the position of the reverse bucket, that wasn't my question. I wanted to ask if Yamaha and Seadoo's behaved differently in reverse and it seems from the responses here that they do. This is what I thought given the differences in their jet venturi designs but I have never driven or been in a Yamaha and there is surprisingly few youtube videos that talk about this particular question which is weird given how many videos about these boats that there are. Anyhow, thank you

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

The steering wheel turns the same way a car or regular boats turn when backing unlike a sea doo where the steering wheel must be turned the direction you want the front of the boat to go when backing and the Yamaha requires the wheel to turn the way you want the back of the boat to turn Yamaha wave runners do what sea doo boats do and have reverse direction as for messing with the new 2019 Yamaha jet boat nozzle design my advice is don't mess with it or change the direction of the water exiting under it. The new nozzles work very well when the nozzle is turned in either direction one jet shoots out toward the front of the boat creating reverse thrust and the other pushes out to the side creating side thrust working together not opposing each other .

 

[MidnightRider]

Yep Yamaha will backup the way you would intuitively expect per steering wheel input (like a prop boat) - Seadoo, Scarab, Glastron jet boats backup opposite of that.

Lateral thrusters were by far the best mod I ever had on my '17 212x IMO. They take 30% of the reverse thrust and shoot it out laterally giving significantly more control for reverse steering. This is only true up through model year 2018. In 2019 Yamaha released a new nozzle that has some lateral thrust already built into the nozzle. I don't have any personal experience with the new nozzles, but I've heard that these new nozzles work much in line performance wise to the old nozzles + LTs.

I know there was a new version of LTs released for the new nozzles but not sure how much more benefit they give you, way less benefit then they had on the old nozzles though I'm sure.

 

[Southernerd]

I own a Seadoo challenger so I am familiar with how reverse steering works with it (ie: what direction the stern moves in reverse). I also know that the way Seadoo (or any rotax) set up works is the opposite of a prop driven boat in reverse. My question is two part-(a) is yamaha reverse steering the same as a prop driven boat with respect to how the boat turns or is it the same as a Seadoo (rotax)? (B)- do lateral thrusters change or enhance the movement in reverse on a yamaha boat? If so in what way. I have thrust vectors on my Seadoo so I already know about them.

I grew up driving a berkeley jet drive and I'm constantly turning the wrong way in reverse in my AR190. The other thing I can't seem to get used to is having the throttle and gate on the same lever. It confuses my brain.

 

[dshscarab]

I have a 2019 AR 195. Prior, I had a Scarab 165 ID. I can confirm that the steering input is opposite in reverse on Yamaha then Seadoo as stated above. I also have Cobra Jet and LT 2.0. As far as the LT 2.0 version. It does help with slow speed reverse maneuverability. Yamaha still not as good as Seadoo on that aspect. Just FYI, I have not noticed in loss in reverse thrust even with the LT 2.0.

 

[84rzv500r]

i have both a seadoo sportster and a AR210... no real comparison the twin yamaha is WAY better in all modes... the seadoo handles like and egg but with practice fun in close quarters... it likes to spin in circles the best.. the yamaha likes to stretch its legs... cruising comfortably at the seadoos TOP speed... just a little down tab and push the throttles forward... cant wait to get these MR-1's going...