2004 sr230 Fuel in oil, been reading, have yds but gives error.

[84rzv500r]

So I've been reading for hours and thanks to all who have contributed. I have a 2004 sr230, less than 170hrs on each engine, original engines. Port has fuel in oil. Been reading, seem it's the injector or the ecu, or the ecu BECAUSE of a bad injector. I ran YDS. All good on starboard side, it ran the injector test just fine. BUT on the port engine, I get the following error:

Engine is running or the throttle is too open.Test again after turning engine off or closing valve.

BUT, the engine IS off. I don't know what valve they mean but all throttle body valves are closed. I tried and tried moving the throttle and the valves but nothing helped. So because if this I can't test the injectors with YDS.

I am assuming this means a bad ECU, which means, according to what I've read, i need to send it off to Chico , CA.

I still need to pull the ECU and check it out for water etc., and I will pull the fuel rail and test the injectors, maybe this weekend. But I was just wondering if anyone has experienced this error in YDS.

Thanks everyone.
Roy

Bad or failing TPS Keeps the static and dynamic tests from running... i think the TPS voltage need to be very close to 7.47V. I had one that that just wouldn't adjust into the range and I got the same errors in YDS... TPS Voltage is on the engine monitor screen

 

[Beachbummer]

Connect Orange and Black/Orange cables to Ohm-meter, and check for function. You have learned quite a bit, and you know it's not the ECU! That's a pretty good place to be from where I'm looking.

 

[Cambo]

How does the oil look?

 

[Bluejuice]

It looks greenish, smells like fuel and ignites imediately with a flame.

 

[Bluejuice]

View attachment 180313

Connect Orange and Black/Orange cables to Ohm-meter, and check for function. You have learned quite a bit, and you know it's not the ECU! That's a pretty good place to be from where I'm looking.

Thanks, I'll get to it after work.

 

[Bluejuice]

Ok guys I have some new info.

1: TPS Sensor

Pulled Port Engine (BAD) TPS sensor and tested it to see if it failed mechanically, to see if it was getting stuck open. It worked just fine, not sticky at all. Don't know how to test if it failed electronically yet, still learning/reading.

2: Pulled both fuel rails.

Port Engine (BAD):...................Injector OHMS bow to stern: 16.6 ohms, 16.6 ohms, 16.8 ohms, 16.8 ohms @ 72.5 degrees F.
Starboard Engine (GOOD): Injector OHMS bow to stern: 15.5 ohms, 15.5 ohms, 15.5 ohms, 15.5 ohms @ 73.1 degrees F.

Injector should be at 11.5 ohms to 12.5 ohms at 68 degrees F. I don't know how much the temperature effects them but apparently all of mine are bad, except the port engine runs great, purrs lie a kitten. so.....I don't know....anyone got real world injector ohm reading to share?

3: Pulled ECUs.

Installed ECU from BAD engine into GOOD engine and ran YDS. Functioned properly and performed injector test just fine. So the ECU is ok.
Installed ECU from GOOD into BAD engine and got the same error I got before swapping:

Engine is running or the throttle is too open.Test again after turning engine off or closing valve.

My conclusion is that it is NOT the ECU, they were dry as a bone, looked factory new, not one bit of moisture or evidence of water intrusion. The problem did NOT follow the ECU to the good engine.

So can you help me out

What would make YDS think the engine is running? Any theories?

What valve is it talking about? Throttle bodies?

Can a bad TPS cause fuel in oil?

How bad are the injector numbers I posted?

Any real world injector numbers out there?

Been a long day out in the rain, just to end up right where I started. Thanks for your time everyone.

I was wrong about the ohm specs. Should be 14-15ohms

 

[84rzv500r]

Heed the note about checking the TPS voltage in Chapter 4... its not enough to check the resistance in the TPS it has to be calibrated for the ECU to be happy. I will also submit that there is another path by which fuel can enter the oil... a fault in teh Fuel rail, such as a crack or a bad O-ring on an injector can also cause the fuel to pool in the airbox and drain down through the crankcase ventilation system into the breather catch can and drain directly into the engine sump...

 

[84rzv500r]

What would make YDS think the engine is running? Any theories? - Out of spec TPS adjustment - and possibly corroded or otherwise compromised wiring to the ECU from the sensor

What valve is it talking about? Throttle bodies? - the Idle Air Servo valve this valve has the four lines that go to each throttle body after the throttle plates to boost RPM's for the off throttle steering and no wake mode... The MR-1's are mechanical (no servo on the throttles) so this servo provides small amounts of air along with fuel controlled by the ECU to control engine RPM

Can a bad TPS cause fuel in oil? - as far as I know a BAD TPS won't stop the injectors from firing it will however keep the ECU from supplying SPARK if it sees too much voltage on the TPS line when starting (as I posted that is usually the cause of the whiney YDS errors) QED

How bad are the injector numbers I posted? IDK

Any real world injector numbers out there? IDK

 

[Bluejuice]

Heed the note about checking the TPS voltage in Chapter 4... its not enough to check the resistance in the TPS it has to be calibrated for the ECU to be happy. I will also submit that there is another path by which fuel can enter the oil... a fault in teh Fuel rail, such as a crack or a bad O-ring on an injector can also cause the fuel to pool in the airbox and drain down through the crankcase ventilation system into the breather catch can and drain directly into the engine sump...

I will pay attention to all notes in chapter 4 related to the tps, and inspect the fuel rail visually and monitor it while running. Thank you.

 

[Bluejuice]

So I did an Ohm test per Beachbummers post and both TPS sensors were in spec and identical to each other.

I did an output voltage test, on both sensors, good engine is at 0.86v bad at 0.87v. In spec is 0.8 +/- 0.1v, so they both check ok.

Also, when advancing the throttle bodies, volts increase accordingly with no dead spots.

Then I ran both engines on YDS, the bad engine, on the hose at idle, has a TPS voltage 0.835v, the good engine is at 0.747v

84rzv500r mentioned the TPS should be at 7.47....i'm at .747v. Is that something or a coincidence? Decimal in the wrong spot.

I checked the oil in the bad engine, ran it for a while, and made oil. So I am right where I started.

Also, while I had the fuel rail off, I cranked the engine over, fuel sprayed from all injectors in an alternating pattern, not continuously from any.

The bad engine stayed locked in with that TPS voltage of 0.835 despite fluctuating RPMs, I didn't think to check the good engine to see if it's TPS voltage fluctuated. I doubt it did, but can try tomorrow.

YDS still will not work on bad engine, same warning as before, valve open, or thinks engine is running.

Any ideas? What am I missing? Thoughts on TPS volts at Idle?

 

[84rzv500r]

if you cant adjust the TPS down to 0.747 plus or minus the tolerance its bad.. I had exactly the same problem... you can read the TPS voltage with the engine off in the YDS monitor screen.. you can see the TPS resistance change as you move the butterflys/// it need to be in the specified range when the throttle is closed or the ECU WONT supply SPARK and you keep pumping GAS into the engine. there can be other issues but it wont try to start until you fix that one... the TPS out of range causes the ECU to report the error to YDS

you can loosen the security torx screws and rotate the TPS sensor it it reads .xxx and you rotate it counter clock wise it will go up and clock wise it will go down,,, IF the TPS is good... Good means the resistance is in spec and the Sensed voltage can be adjusted in tolerance

be careful tightening down the screws on the TPS as it can move it as you tighten... monitor the YDS screen to ensure the values are what is needed...

you can skim through the Build link in my signature and read all about it... its not really well documented in the boat service manual but it is a little better in the waverunner manual

 

[84rzv500r]

if the motor runs then just adjust the TPS and move on. if the motor wont start adjust the TPS to SPEC and start... if the TPS won't adjust into spec replace the TPS and recalibrate you should then start and be able to run the servo test as well..

 

[Bluejuice]

84rzv500r- read through your build thread, very impressive!

I'll adjust the TPS after real work tonight and report back.

Just want to note that the engine does start and run currently, despite the TPS being off.

 

[buckbuck]

Here are readings from injectors I had serviced.

 

[Bluejuice]

Interesting Buckbuck. Manual says mine should be 14-15 Ohms and they are 15.5 on good engine and over 16 on bad.

So maybe they are overspraying? Gotta run it tonight and check plugs again.

Would you recommend that company if I need to send them out? Turnaround time?

Thanks!

 

[84rzv500r]

ok so you said TPS was 0.835 and the spec is 0.756 +-0.016 => the TPS at idle need to be in the range of 0.740 to 0.772 so while it runs it is clearly out of range and will trigger the Engine is running or the throttle is too open.Test again after turning engine off or closing valve. error. in this case the valve they are talking about is throttle valve.

 

[Bluejuice]

Yes I need to adjust TPS into spec, if I can. Replace if I can't.

Would like to understand how/if this would cause fuel in oil.

I might drill holes so i can adjust TPS without removing the fuel rail and throttle bodies for the millionth time.

 

[Beachbummer]

Maybe too much tps means large influx of fuel beyond engine need? Running so rich the fuel falls into the oil sump? Wild speculation.

 

[Bluejuice]

Thats what I'm hoping Beachbummer.

 

[Bluejuice]

OK. So I set the TPS to .747 EXACTLY (Thanks 84rzv500r)

This immediately allowed YDS to connect AND to perform the injector test. All clicked, and at the same volume.

Checked and noted the oil level.

Ran the boat for a long time.

made NO new oil.

Ran boat again, no new oil.

Now I will tidy everything up ( I drilled hole to adjust the TPS because and will need to fill those with some rtv) and change the oil and filter twice, maybe three times?? to get all the gas out. Next will be to run it on the water and monitor the oil CLOSELY. If this solved the problem, I am both ecstatic that it is resolved, and feeling foolish that I did all that work in order to just move that stupid sensor by the tiniest little bit. I just didn't know. Two stupid screws, ugh. Learned a lot though. Beachbummer, the only thing I come up with is what you said, ECU saw the throttle as open so supplied more gas than it need, ran so rich it got in the oil. I don't want to get to excited, we'll see how she is after a run on the water. I will 100% follow up. Thank you to everyone who took time out of there life to help me out.

PS While I have the clean out try removed, is there anything I should do so I don't have to take it off again?

Everything looks good in there. I will spray it all with anti-corrosive spray before I close it up.

Thanks again , I'll follow up once I've been out on the water.