2015 AR240 - Proper way to run power/ground to aftermarket accessories behind helm

[Stevenpigsooie]

@Mainah and @zipper can these runs be routed through the DVSR switch so all power is turned off together.

 

[Mainah]

If you have a correctly sized fuse between the battery and the switch you will be fine.

 

[ralphsmithiii]

Also just got off the phone with one of the companies I'm looking to pick up some more audio gear from and he stated that the M800/8 and M400/4 at a minimum takes a 10awg wire and should not see more than 40 ohms

There can be such tremendous variation in quality - within the same AWG specs, I find.
I am 100% non-expert, just try to follow advice here. In that vein, I used the KnuKonceptz 4awg OFC wire that has a feel of a high quality welder cable, lol. Crazy good stuff.


I have it all nicely bundled inside conduits and protected with foam noodle
View attachment 91531


Common path ground is the key!

@swatski The more I look at this, the more I like this approach. If I have to run new cables, I think I may go this route as it appears be shorter and I wont have to rig my power/ground cables in the rear compartment in terms of having to try and hide them.

Couple of questions:

When you say you're using conduit, are we talking the plastic conduit you get at a local hardware store like Lowes or Home Depot? And if so, are you just using it through this space in the fuel tank area? Then you're adding the pool noodle over it to "cushion" it?

Also in your pic, where do the wires actually run into on the left side/towards the helm? Is it a straight shot into an open space if I run a snake through there? I can see the other 3 or so black lines which I believe I also saw behind the helm somewhere when I did my install a few months back but wanted to see what you and knew.

 

[Mainah]

10awg? No idea who you are talking to but 10 awg is asking for trouble. From the JL m800/8v2 manual: “Run 4 AWG power wire from the battery location to the amplifier mounting location, taking care to route it in such a way that it will not be damaged and will not interfere with vessel operation. Use 2 AWG or larger power wire and a power distribution block if additional amplifiers are being installed with the M800/8v2.”

I used household sump pump hose I had laying around for the conduit.

 

[swatski]

Also just got off the phone with one of the companies I'm looking to pick up some more audio gear from and he stated that the M800/8 and M400/4 at a minimum takes a 10awg wire and should not see more than 40 ohms

@swatski The more I look at this, the more I like this approach. If I have to run new cables, I think I may go this route as it appears be shorter and I wont have to rig my power/ground cables in the rear compartment in terms of having to try and hide them.

Couple of questions:

When you say you're using conduit, are we talking the plastic conduit you get at a local hardware store like Lowes or Home Depot? And if so, are you just using it through this space in the fuel tank area? Then you're adding the pool noodle over it to "cushion" it?

Also in your pic, where do the wires actually run into on the left side/towards the helm? Is it a straight shot into an open space if I run a snake through there? I can see the other 3 or so black lines which I believe I also saw behind the helm somewhere when I did my install a few months back but wanted to see what you and knew.

The wire follows steering cables into the space behind the helm, it’s a nice path. The noodle and flexible plastic shielding is just to prevent chafing.

—

 

[swatski]

I do not know how one exceeds 4 gauge KnuKonceptz OFC wire capacity while powering a couple of boat amps, properly fused and not exceeding 20-25 ft, I just don’t see how would that wire become rate limiting.

—

 

[ralphsmithiii]

10awg? No idea who you are talking to but 10 awg is asking for trouble. From the JL m800/8v2 manual: “Run 4 AWG power wire from the battery location to the amplifier mounting location, taking care to route it in such a way that it will not be damaged and will not interfere with vessel operation. Use 2 AWG or larger power wire and a power distribution block if additional amplifiers are being installed with the M800/8v2.”

I used household sump pump hose I had laying around for the conduit.

Lol sorry that got posted wrong. It should of never said 10awg meant to correct it to 4awg for the 400 as its minimum gauge.

 

[ralphsmithiii]

Odin recommended 2awg split off to 4awg to the amps unless more amps would be installed down the line. If I added towers (m880's) I'm thinking and hoping other than the 2nd amp (m400/4) I wouldn't need to add more to the system. MAYBE 1 more 10" IB sub but not sure if that'll be needed with the 8.8 towers. Unless it really helps "even" out the sound having two subs firing across from each other in the rear.

 

[Mainah]

Odin is great and knows his stuff. The m880s do add some bass. If you are a bass head you will want another sub. An open air boat is a lot harder than a car/truck to get good bass in. I like a good amount of bass and am finally happy with two 10 inch sealed subs and the m880s. Subs need a lot of power and you have a long run. Quality 2 awg would possibly still handle it with a third high efficiency amp like JL, but if spending the money and time now why not future proof for a few bucks more with 0 awg is my thinking.

Again Odin is great.

 

[ralphsmithiii]

Odin is great and knows his stuff. The m880s do add some bass. If you are a bass head you will want another sub. An open air boat is a lot harder than a car/truck to get good bass in. I like a good amount of bass and am finally happy with two 10 inch sealed subs and the m880s. Subs need a lot of power and you have a long run. Quality 2 awg would possibly still handle it with a third high efficiency amp like JL, but if spending the money and time now why not future proof for a few bucks more with 0 awg is my thinking.

Again Odin is great.

Makes 100% sense no doubt. If anything I would add one more sub and call it a day but now have to rethink amps. If I add a mx400/4 for just the towers of need something else just for one more sub. My current sub runs off of channel 7+8 on the he m800/8 now. I'm Ok with rocking the mx400/4 for the towers the time being then adding a 3rd amp for the additional sub but that doesn't seem very logical to me. Maybe run two m800/8 for the entire system? Second m800 bridged could support the towers plus two subs alone but then I have two channels on the first m800 not being used. Transoms speakers at that point, lol?. Should draw this out when I get home, see it on paper.

 

[swatski]

the m880s

If I have one regret about my stereo mods it’s about not going with the M880s for the tower over ICON8s that I chose instead (based pretty much on their looks).

I keep going back to @lashburn1 (who has tested it all in his 20 boats) and it’s pretty clear he likes those, a lot. I guess I’ll never know, lol.

—

 

[ralphsmithiii]

There can be such tremendous variation in quality - within the same AWG specs, I find.
I am 100% non-expert, just try to follow advice here. In that vein, I used the KnuKonceptz 4awg OFC wire that has a feel of a high quality welder cable, lol. Crazy good stuff.


I have it all nicely bundled inside conduits and protected with foam noodle
View attachment 91531


Common path ground is the key!

@swatski Any chance you know how many feet your power/ground wire run was here? I think I purchased 25ft of each for my first 4awg run but if I'm going to swap to 0 or 2awg, I think I want to run it this way which appears to be shorter (and more expensive). I'm thinking 20ft is enough but I'd hate to buy it too short, yet, dont' need to buy way more than I need at $3.50-5/foot.

 

[swatski]

@swatski Any chance you know how many feet your power/ground wire run was here? I think I purchased 25ft of each for my first 4awg run but if I'm going to swap to 0 or 2awg, I think I want to run it this way which appears to be shorter (and more expensive). I'm thinking 20ft is enough but I'd hate to buy it too short, yet, dont' need to buy way more than I need at $3.50-5/foot.

Looks like I used 15’, fused within inches of terminal in bat comp

If I may make a recommendation, the KnuKonceptz OFC wires that @Mainah recommends are FANTASTIC. Here is the 4awg variety. That would be more than enough for what you need. I used 15' each.


You could run those across the fuel compartment following the steering cables into the helm. Fuse with a breaker like a big Bussman mounted by the battery.


A distribution block is convenient if you can find what you want. I started making those on my own, I can fit what I want and how I want it. Just plug and play into the amp board. Here I'm putting together one for ballast pumps

Absolutely. This would also alleviate a chance of creating any ground loops and some such. Keep in mind, 4awg from knukonceptz is bigger than many 1/0 from some car "amp kits", easily, that wire is SOOO good. I used 15' and had little to spare, if your batteries are pushed deep in the bat comp or whatever, you may want to get some extra.
The fuel hatch pops right up with 4 allen bolts, just don't drop it on your toes, lol.
I ran mine in a loom, but then also did this thing with a pool noodle, to protect the cables inside, probably overkill
View attachment 55741

--

 

[ralphsmithiii]

Looks like I used 15’, fused within inches of terminal in bat comp

@swatski I'm taking your word on this, lol! I'm going to change my order to 20ft just to give me some extra room. I'm buying everything from Odin so it'll be JL Audio power and ground wire, 2AWG. It's listed as more expensive than the Kruconceptz, which I'm not opposed to at all, but I believe he's giving me a packaged deal with good discounts so I'll go that route.

 

[Mainah]

I ordered 20 feet and had some left over but but not so much that I felt I ordered too much.

 

[ralphsmithiii]

I ordered 20 feet and had some left over but but not so much that I felt I ordered too much.

Awesome. 25ft would be too much then and an extra $$ for a few feet I'll probably never use again. 20ft it is! I also originally said I wanted 50ft of 14awg for the towers since speaker wire is usually pretty cheap but 30ft is probably plenty if I'm going to run it down the starboard side via the front tube then behind the helm.

 

[Mainah]

Awesome. 25ft would be too much then and an extra $$ for a few feet I'll probably never use again. 20ft it is! I also originally said I wanted 50ft of 14awg for the towers since speaker wire is usually pretty cheap but 30ft is probably plenty if I'm going to run it down the starboard side via the front tube then behind the helm.

No idea on speaker wire as I ran new wire to everything and ordered a whole bunch. The stock wire is likely fine but bigger wire does not hurt and the stuff I ordered is twisted with a thick outer jacket which helps reduce noise picked up from other stuff. I ran 14awg to the cabin and towers and 12 awg to the subs.

I used the back tower tube for my m880s. When testing placement I determined it was possible to hit the back of my head on the front of the 880s if seat all the way back and standing like I was operating if I threw my head back (simulating rough conditions). The back tube gave me much more clearance for the back of my head where I felt would be nearly impossible. I have a 2016 242 LS so this may be different with other boats/towers. This does make it possible (someone would need to be moving too quick or very tall) to hit ones head when accessing the under seat storage but I felt that to be better trade off vs. the operator. I really should take a photo of where I mounted mine as it also gives a good path down the center without much likelihood of a head bang. Cosmetically, which was least of my considerations also looks really good to me too.

 

[ralphsmithiii]

No idea on speaker wire as I ran new wire to everything and ordered a whole bunch. The stock wire is likely fine but bigger wire does not hurt and the stuff I ordered is twisted with a thick outer jacket which helps reduce noise picked up from other stuff. I ran 14awg to the cabin and towers and 12 awg to the subs.

I used the back tower tube for my m880s. When testing placement I determined it was possible to hit the back of my head on the front of the 880s if seat all the way back and standing like I was operating if I threw my head back (simulating rough conditions). The back tube gave me much more clearance for the back of my head where I felt would be nearly impossible. I have a 2016 242 LS so this may be different with other boats/towers. This does make it possible (someone would need to be moving too quick or very tall) to hit ones head when accessing the under seat storage but I felt that to be better trade off vs. the operator. I really should take a photo of where I mounted mine as it also gives a good path down the center without much likelihood of a head bang. Cosmetically, which was least of my considerations also looks really good to me too.

Please do take a couple of pics as I am sure to smack my head quite a bit until I get used to them being there. I'm 6'4 and as of right now when I'm driving the boat I'm almost always sitting or if standing, it's in the middle navigating in a wake zone or anywhere its <25 mph and calm. However, I've smacked my head a few times already with the bimini top being deployed coming into the boat without thinking about it. I was planning on mounting them as far out as I could but I do like some fashion but as you stated more so function.

 

[Mainah]

Please do take a couple of pics as I am sure to smack my head quite a bit until I get used to them being there. I'm 6'4 and as of right now when I'm driving the boat I'm almost always sitting or if standing, it's in the middle navigating in a wake zone or anywhere its <25 mph and calm. However, I've smacked my head a few times already with the bimini top being deployed coming into the boat without thinking about it. I was planning on mounting them as far out as I could but I do like some fashion but as you stated more so function.

I will do that but given you have an AR I would search here for photos others have posted. At 6’4” I would still recommend mocking up using electrical tape to protect the tower finish to see what works for me (I am only 5’10”). Mine did end up almost as far out as the start of the bend would allow.

 

[orexismd]

The thoughts around a seperate run for the other accessories to eliminate interference is a good one. In that case run audio gear off of house and everything else off of start. If just one from house and the ground wire is big enough it will help dissipate the noise when everything is on the same trunk line. More than anything all audio equipment should have the same path to ground. There are also other ways to deal with noise. My setup and recent challenges with noise is a great example. The DSP I used was picking up a bunch of HF and inductive load noise. A ceramic capacitor was the fix.

Here is what my helm setup looks like (old photo that does not include my recent additions of another amp and the dsp but still relevant). I have 0 awg from house going into the distribution block (middle of photo) and then 4 awg feeding amps and the accessory fuse panel/ground bus bar from the distribution block.

Amp Board 2.0 front

• Mainah
• Apr 1, 2018
• 2

If only the one amp and some low draw accessories then 4awg is enough and just need a distribution block to split off to a fuse panel for the accessories.

@Mainah can you tell me or send a link for that distribution block you used?