Back to the future: considering a mint 2009 232 Limited S vs a new 2016 AR240 - am I crazy?

[swatski]

I have to admit that I find an idea of buying a new 24ft Yamaha incredibly enticing, the new AR240s are pretty awesome. And I have a pretty sweet deal on the table, too.

But, I'm struggling with the decision. Per my family, we will get a bigger (more sea worthy) boat to replace my 190. But I really have mixed feelings about some of the new 240s features. For example, the design of the aft cockpit seating is making me want to go back (in time).

Here is the way I look at it - the back seats/gunnels seem to have gotten increasingly more shallow over the model years:

2015-16 240


2010-14 240


2009 232 Limited S


My kids generally like to sit in the bow, but in any kind of weather conditions I like everyone in the back in these boats. Here, the 232 Limited has that plush, cushy feel which I just do not find in the new 24s. Longer, taller freeboard and the keel of the 2016 24s makes them amazingly capable in rough water though, no doubt.

Another thing is, and I hope that one is not wrong or weird, I wouldn't mind to own a boat with MR1 HOs. Never had them, but find them to be just marvels of technology. These things are tuned to the max stock from factory, and run on such high quality components that I suspect the production costs might have had something to do with MR1 HOs production being discontinued. By comparison, I find 1.8l N/As not particularly impressive, in my experience. Certainly capable, but they just don't seem very refined. SVHOs, timing chain issues notwithstanding, are a different story but that does not apply to boats, yet.

Anyhow. Let say - given a choice - am I the only person on the planet to wonder about such things?

EDIT: these pictures are crappy but that is just for crude reference.
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[Scottintexas]

The only reason I would choose the newer boat would be for the sound level otherwise I wouldn't need anything else a new boat has to offer,

 

[swatski]

Nostalgia has no price (I'm just messing around BTW)

You must know me! Hehehe.

 

[swatski]

The only reason I would choose the newer boat would be for the sound level otherwise I wouldn't need anything else a new boat has to offer,

These are actually my words when wife and I discuss it. And that IS a biggie. Other than that a 2009 in even the best condition would likely need some new cables and some such, but that's what the FAQ section here is for, LOL.
Thanks, I feel a bit better, actually.

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[billyb]

When did you get rid of your boat?

 

[Mainah]

@swatski You may be aware but they made the timing chains wider and changed the other needed parts as well for that change with the 2016 model year 1.8l. Time will tell if that did the the trick to resolve that particular issue. The angle of the photo makes thing a bit deceiving but perhaps you have seen them in person. I certainly recommend sitting in them in person to get a feel for it. Another consideration may be noise level twin mr1s do not hold a candle to the 2015+ 1.8l 242s in this area.
I just went from a 1997 Seadoo Challenger 1800 (18ft twin engine) to my 2016 242. What do I miss? Only one thing. Running WOT dropping the throttles turning hard over and giving it WOT again really quickly causing the boat to do a surface 360. Surface 90 in that fashion is not even possible with these new 242s. It operates like a much bigger boat which is both good and bad. I could take or leave the touch screen but I do love the joystick control. The second captains chair was a must for the admiral and the noise reduction was a must for me. Not having to fix stuff all the time was a must for the admiral but well lets just say she is still not happy with all of my mod and maintance time. One more thing to consider in fuel efficiency. Yes I know we are talking about a boat and gas prices are low right now but what happens when fuel goes over 4 bucks a gallon again? Twenty percent better fuel economy will be a big deal (i do not what the difference is between the two models but my guess is that there is one). At over 5 bucks a gallon some members might even start finding ways to wake surf behind a sailboat

I do not know a bunch about the 232 model to compare more but hopefully that helps you in some fashion.

 

[Matt Phillips]

hhhmmmm...interesting dilemma there as I have a 232 Limited S in great shape that I've been thinking about upgrading to a 242x E-Series. I love the 232 and it's a great all around boat and after 5 seasons, I think I have it about updated to where I want it.

The main reason I'm looking to go with a 242x is that we've gotten into wake boarding more in the past few years and the integrated keel is something that just can't be added to the older boats. That and the fact that ballast bags are built-in would make a bigger wake much easier to taylor-fit.

 

[swatski]

When did you get rid of your boat?

(EDIT: I thought you said "why". Sorry. When: last week. It was on the market for like 6hrs. )

Going to/from Bimini this year I received a (direct) hint from wife to the tune of "Honey - if we are going to do this again, we are gonna need a bigger boat".

Honestly - I hated selling my 190. Had everything I wanted, pretty much. But, didn't want to be that idiot who refuses a (once-in-a-lifetime-chance?) of getting a new 24fter...

 

[Bruce]

One more thing to consider in fuel efficiency. Yes I know we are talking about a boat and gas prices are low right now but what happens when fuel goes over 4 bucks a gallon again? Twenty percent better fuel economy will be a big deal (i do not what the difference is between the two models but my guess is that there is one).

Both the 2015 242 and the 232 peak in fuel efficiency around 28 MPH. According to Boattest.con the 242 peaks at 3 MPG while the 232 peaks at 3.8.

 

[Bruce]

@swatski have you read this review? http://www.boattest.com/oem/403/boats/1745/0/on/640x360

 

[swatski]

@swatski You may be aware but they made the timing chains wider and changed the other needed parts as well for that change with the 2016 model year 1.8l. Time will tell if that did the the trick to resolve that particular issue. The angle of the photo makes thing a bit deceiving but perhaps you have seen them in person. I certainly recommend sitting in them in person to get a feel for it. Another consideration may be noise level twin mr1s do not hold a candle to the 2015+ 1.8l 242s in this area.
I just went from a 1997 Seadoo Challenger 1800 (18ft twin engine) to my 2016 242. What do I miss? Only one thing. Running WOT dropping the throttles turning hard over and giving it WOT again really quickly causing the boat to do a surface 360. Surface 90 in that fashion is not even possible with these new 242s. It operates like a much bigger boat which is both good and bad. I could take or leave the touch screen but I do love the joystick control. The second captains chair was a must for the admiral and the noise reduction was a must for me. Not having to fix stuff all the time was a must for the admiral but well lets just say she is still not happy with all of my mod and maintance time. One more thing to consider in fuel efficiency. Yes I know we are talking about a boat and gas prices are low right now but what happens when fuel goes over 4 bucks a gallon again? Twenty percent better fuel economy will be a big deal (i do not what the difference is between the two models but my guess is that there is one). At over 5 bucks a gallon some members might even start finding ways to wake surf behind a sailboat

I do not know a bunch about the 232 model to compare more but hopefully that helps you in some fashion.

Thank you, very helpful, actually. I did not consider fuel usage. Does anyone know if a twin MR1 HOs burn more or less than 1.8l n/as under similar usage conditions? Based on my observations during the Bimini crossing, which is where these things matter most, I was under the impression that there was not a significant difference but if anything the MR1s would have an edge in economy.

The new hulls are simply fantastic for sea crossing, as well as watersports, which is huge. But, I am really not a huge fan of how flexible these new hulls are. It makes me uncomfortable, the amount of flex you see even with the flexing between water and the trailer. These seem more and more plasticized, lighter - which is good, but boy - are they soft...

Timing chain issues are not a major concern for me, for the reasons you mention, and also because it has been primarily SHO/SVHO issue up to 2015. And these are not offered in 24 boats, yet.

The pictures I posted are crappy and rushed, sorry, but that is totally immaterial; the feeling that I have stems from actually sitting in these boats, which I have done over an over. I have to say I like the older style cockpit more, always have. It is deeper and seems more "cozy". The premium cushions of a 2009 Limited don't hurt either.

Noise level is huge in my book, and that is probably a deal breaker actually. I hated it in my 190, and spent thousands of dollars and long hours to furnish it with some 250lbs of expensive soundproofing, but even then it was just okay. 232 with MR1s would be worse because of higher pitch. Not looking to take on a project like that again, really.

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[swatski]

BTW - my dilemma is, at least in part, @Bruce's fault. LOL. First, wife fell in love with his pimped-out 230. Go figure. Then, when I sought his opinion he very graciously shared a couple of totally awesome leads with me, which was kind of eye-opening.

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[Bruce]

I wish we had taken a ride in my boat in Bimini. You are very welcome to drive down and take her for a spin and perhaps go diving on Ouachita.

You saw my engine compartment. I made two changes to reduce noise levels. One was that I removed the side panels in the engine compartment and added 1/2" plywood bulkheads with dynamat on the engine side and carpet on the inside. The second was to add dynamat under the fuel tank cover. My family feels like this made a big difference in noise levels.

 

[Bruce]

@swakski, what are you going to tow with?

 

[swatski]

I wish we had taken a ride in my boat in Bimini. You are very welcome to drive down and take her for a spin and perhaps go diving on Ouachita.

You saw my engine compartment. I made two changes to reduce noise levels. One was that I removed the side panels in the engine compartment and added 1/2" plywood bulkheads with dynamat on the engine side and carpet on the inside. The second was to add dynamat under the fuel tank cover. My family feels like this made a big difference in noise levels.

Very good points, it could be done, albeit it is A LOT of work. I was also a bit encouraged reading @ridinpropless postings:
https://jetboaters.net/threads/i-think-i-finally-quieted-my-yamaha.10022/#post-172399

 

[swatski]

@swakski, what are you going to tow with?

Looking at some used excursion diesel monstrosities, LOL. Or, another monstrosity called sequoia. I know...
We also have a truck, but it is older and has a regular cabin, so not good for family trips.

 

[swatski]

hhhmmmm...interesting dilemma there as I have a 232 Limited S in great shape that I've been thinking about upgrading to a 242x E-Series. I love the 232 and it's a great all around boat and after 5 seasons, I think I have it about updated to where I want it.

The main reason I'm looking to go with a 242x is that we've gotten into wake boarding more in the past few years and the integrated keel is something that just can't be added to the older boats. That and the fact that ballast bags are built-in would make a bigger wake much easier to taylor-fit.

@Matt Phillips Can you board/ski off of the Limited S tower with the bimini up/open, or do you have to fold it closed?

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[robert843]

Wow @swatski really interesting concept I battled with this last year a bit but decided quickly to go newer. I have been in and ridden on all three models and actually ridden on all three models in the ocean even. I actually prefer the looks of the interior of the both the newer body styles 10-14 and 15+ over the 07-09 models. The cusions are a little more plush on the 07-09 but the overall feeling I get in the 07-09 is it is an older boat the newer ones just feel more modern. I also love the bow set up in the newer models over the prior ones they feel a whole lot more roomy. There is a sound difference between the 07-09 as mentioned and it was one of my deciding factors to go newer and a choice I do not regret as even the 10-14 models are a little loud and the prior model would have likely really bothered me long term. One big question I would ask my self is how long term is this boat purchase. If its a boat that you think you will keep for 10+ years I think any would be ok to purchase but if you think 5-7 years from now you maybe looking at some kind of upgrade again I would go 10 or newer. The current 07-09's are two generations back now and based on the the last several generation tenures we will likely have a new generation in the 18 or 19 models and with the 17's about to come out that's not far off and will push those 07-09's into a likely less desirable body style when you go to try and resell it. Not because they are not great boats but just because they are three generations old. Once again if your going to keep it 10+years it likely wont matter as it wont be worth a ton when you are trying to get rid of it any ways as it would be a 17 year old boat. If its a short term purchase 5-7 years you will be outside of the that prime financing age in three years and would likely take a fair hit when trying to resell as you would be in a cash only market may not matter if you are getting a smoking deal on it. Overall pick the one that you think will make you and your family happiest. Honestly my biggest deciding factor when I went newer was 2 footitis. Not that the foot was a big deal but I didn't want to buy older and regret it later and have to loose money on the older boat to upgrade to a newer one, I knew that if I went newer I was likely not going to regret it and sell my boat to go older and so far that has held true.

 

[2nazt]

I love my 230 but being my first and only boat may be biased. It has plenty of room we have 9 full adults on board and it wasn't cramped and we have been in some rough waters and felt confident and never uneasy. The noise doesn't bother my wife or I, yet but almost 40 hours on the boat still no complaint. I think our fuel economy has been very good as well. If we upgrade though it would be to a newer 15+ ar240 as I love the look and high front on them as well. Either way I don't think you can make a bad purchase and if you hold on to the older boat you won't lose much.

 

[swatski]

Wow @swatski really interesting concept I battled with this last year a bit but decided quickly to go newer. I have been in and ridden on all three models and actually ridden on all three models in the ocean even. I actually prefer the looks of the interior of the both the newer body styles 10-14 and 15+ over the 07-09 models. The cusions are a little more plush on the 07-09 but the overall feeling I get in the 07-09 is it is an older boat the newer ones just feel more modern. I also love the bow set up in the newer models over the prior ones they feel a whole lot more roomy. There is a sound difference between the 07-09 as mentioned and it was one of my deciding factors to go newer and a choice I do not regret as even the 10-14 models are a little loud and the prior model would have likely really bothered me long term. One big question I would ask my self is how long term is this boat purchase. If its a boat that you think you will keep for 10+ years I think any would be ok to purchase but if you think 5-7 years from now you maybe looking at some kind of upgrade again I would go 10 or newer. The current 07-09's are two generations back now and based on the the last several generation tenures we will likely have a new generation in the 18 or 19 models and with the 17's about to come out that's not far off and will push those 07-09's into a likely less desirable body style when you go to try and resell it. Not because they are not great boats but just because they are three generations old. Once again if your going to keep it 10+years it likely wont matter as it wont be worth a ton when you are trying to get rid of it any ways as it would be a 17 year old boat. If its a short term purchase 5-7 years you will be outside of the that prime financing age in three years and would likely take a fair hit when trying to resell as you would be in a cash only market may not matter if you are getting a smoking deal on it. Overall pick the one that you think will make you and your family happiest. Honestly my biggest deciding factor when I went newer was 2 footitis. Not that the foot was a big deal but I didn't want to buy older and regret it later and have to loose money on the older boat to upgrade to a newer one, I knew that if I went newer I was likely not going to regret it and sell my boat to go older and so far that has held true.

Thanks @robert843 These are solid points.
I also realize 2017 or even 18 is not going to be a model overhaul for 240s, so not holding my breath. But they will have to do something fairly dramatic by then to stay competitive in this segment, and I mean about the engines. Something like additional 100hp per unit, that they are close to with the SVHO, maybe new pumps which have not seen any overhaul in a decade.
I'm definitely not looking to purchase and flip anything, but I am worried we may have a different view of the 1.8l units 3 years or so from now.

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