Coronavirus

[F.M.]

This virus doesn't care what state we live in - so I disagree that we need a different approach in different states. I do agree that different population areas require different approaches. Cities with high density housing and public transport like NYC, Chicago, Atlanta etc require a different approach than Raleigh.

Clear and concise centralized guidance from the top are absolutely necessary. Leadership by example is critical. People emulate and mimic the behavior of their leaders (I've seen this over and over in the companies I work in! If you have a boss that swears, all of a sudden, everyone is swearing).

We've known for over a hundred years how to slow the spread of viruses like this, but we don't learn. Even during the 1918-19 flu pandemic people didn't want to wear masks.....and paid the price. Now we are doing the exact same thing! And we are seeing waves exactly like they did back then. In 1918 they learned, followed directions more, the flu was knocked down, then along came New Years Eve and everyone was stir crazy, decided it was safe, and partied in the new year......and another wave followed.

Hit the nail on the head!

Leading by example works.

And if people would care less about themselves and more about what's best for the country as a whole, this would have been over already.

 

[Dean P]

Hit the nail on the head!

Leading by example works.

And if people would care less about themselves and more about what's best for the country as a whole, this would have been over already.

Not sure it would be over, but believe there would be far fewer deaths.

 

[mike220022]

If this wasnt an election year....the whole issue would be completely different. It is HIGHLY politicized. In the United States if you were to die in a car crash while being a carrier of Covid then they rank one more death to the China Virus. I know a person that was scheduled to go in for testing then ended up cancelling, not showing up to take a test, and still get a positive test result back. This attack from China is a terrible thing for a very small population of people whose bodies cant fight it off but politicizing a virus to destroy America all because a certain party wants power back is disgraceful.

 

[Peelz]

If this wasnt an election year....the whole issue would be completely different. It is HIGHLY politicized. In the United States if you were to die in a car crash while being a carrier of Covid then they rank one more death to the China Virus. I know a person that was scheduled to go in for testing then ended up cancelling, not showing up to take a test, and still get a positive test result back. This attack from China is a terrible thing for a very small population of people whose bodies cant fight it off but politicizing a virus to destroy America all because a certain party wants power back is disgraceful.

Equally disgraceful is pretending it isn't happening to make your own party look better for the trash job it did in the first place lol.. one party better than the other...please.... tribal nonsense, polar politics is a sham.

Its pretty simple to me...Wear your damned masks, stay distant when you can. If you're sick, isolate...if you're high risk or around those that are, do those things more vigorously. My wife, mother, and brother are all higher risk.. I wear the mask to protect others, including them, from me. Not to protect myself.

Perhaps, If we were compassionate about our fellow citizens, instead of selfish, we could get back to normal sooner. But sadly, we're now a nation that thinks "____ your feelings" is a patriotic slogan.

 

[Peelz]

I dont expect everyone to believe common sense. I wear my masks at work and when I go out to eat and other things....mainly because its required of my business by the governor to remain open and other businesses are required for the same reason. I will say though, if you believe that mask youre wearing is protecting you from catching a virus then you are only fooling yourself. Most of the boxes these masks come in even say they wont protect against viruses. If there is an opening anywhere, meaning not a 100% seal against your face at all times, in that mask then guess what...an airborne virus can penetrate it. I love hearing about the "trash job" the administration has done to fight against this thing yet when asked "what would you have done different" there are crickets or they just repeat what has been happening since day 1. But as for your last line...I'll take "fuck your feelings" any day of the week over "We'll make sure the baby is comfortable in the mean time" while the parents decide whether to keep him/her or just kill the child and toss it away.

so should surgeons not wear them during a surgery because theyre ineffective? I believe you didnt read correctly? I'm not wearing it to protect myself. Its about being compassionate and mitigating the spread. Whats coming OUT of the mask, not in.

wait.... Ok... your last sentence about killing children..... wildly off topic, and unfortunate you made the assumption of me that I'm even remotely ok with that, based solely on the fact I don't approve of the job that's been done at the top. Kinda insulting, honestly. tribal and silly. I just don't have that filter, either political persuasion....it will be pointless to engage you further.

have a splendid day.

 

[Dean P]

If this wasnt an election year....the whole issue would be completely different. It is HIGHLY politicized. In the United States if you were to die in a car crash while being a carrier of Covid then they rank one more death to the China Virus. I know a person that was scheduled to go in for testing then ended up cancelling, not showing up to take a test, and still get a positive test result back. This attack from China is a terrible thing for a very small population of people whose bodies cant fight it off but politicizing a virus to destroy America all because a certain party wants power back is disgraceful.

It's HIGHLY politicized because the current administration has failed to keep us safe and STILL pretends it is not here as cases rise every single day. To know how bad it was before anyone else and then to downplay the whole thing states volumes. It was known how bad it was going to be well before it got bad. If the building is on fire and I say nothing cause I don't want everyone to panic and people die due to my inaction is just WRONG and I should be "fired" at the very least. Why shouldn't he be held accountable? I wonder if you'd feel the same way if your Mom or Dad, spouse, daughter or son (someone you really, truly love with all your heart) were to spend weeks on a ventilator and die. They would die alone. Alone is the last thing any of us would want for a loved one. Right!?!

 

[mike220022]

wait.... Ok... your last sentence about killing children..... wildly off topic, and unfortunate you made the assumption of me that I'm even remotely ok with that,

Probably the same way you assumed that "fuck your feelings" is a quote that everyone from one party agrees to. I was just using your obvious logic....if it seems the majority agree with it then why not

 

[mike220022]

 

[Dean P]

Actions speak a lot louder than words; always has and always will be. -DeanP

 

[mike220022]

Actions speak a lot louder than words; always has and always will be. -DeanP

Thats one thing we can agree on!

 

[Dean P]

Thats one thing we can agree on!

Do you denounce White Supremacy?

 

[mike220022]

Do you denounce White Supremacy?

100%....I believe racism has NO place in this country.

 

[Dean P]

100%

That's 2 things we agree on. You've stated something the big guy cannot.

 

[mike220022]

That's 2 things we agree on. You've stated something the big guy cannot.

I can load this thread up with links of him denouncing white supremacy but I think it would be if not already a matter of time before it gets deleted for politics. Need to diversify your news viewing....you'd then see how many times he actually has already done so.

 

[GTBRMC]

As long as "leadership" is inbounds, anyone care to discuss how significant this state leader action and the other state leaders that followed his example were in US total COVID-19 deaths? And why will the same leaders not disclose how many known COVID-19 positive patients were forced back into nursing homes under the attached terms?

Yes, top federal leadership has certainly been in the wrong many times this year. But so have many of the other leaders, without, seemingly, anywhere near the press noise nor the accountability heat on the national leader. And, arguably, these state level leaders have a much more direct, causal link to unnecessarily high death counts.

Note: highlighting is not mine
Edit: Link to one of a number of sources for that March 25, 2020 letter - https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...FjABegQIAhAB&usg=AOvVaw17pYfG67tgII3fVyJO95l1

 

[Dean P]

I can load this thread up with links of him denouncing white supremacy but I think it would be if not already a matter of time before it gets deleted for politics. Need to diversify your news viewing....you'd then see how many times he actually has already done so.

All children look up to their moms and dads; right? We think they know best and they teach us their values. What do you think happens when your dad is a member of the KKK? What happens when your dad get arrested at a KKK rally? Do you think possibly there may be talk at the home about such KKK events or happenings? Do you think you'll sneak and hide in a corner to listen to conversations? Do you think you would start thinking like your dad? Stand down and stand back is NOT the same as denouncing/condemning white supremacy. To say there are good people in those WS groups (ie proud boys) is not quite the same and ends up being fuel for these groups to justify their existence. Unfortunately what he says has weight as well as what he doesn't say. His words matter and has consequences. His actions matters and has consequences.

Keep in mind, there is a HUGE difference between being a leader and being the boss/person in charge.

 

[Troch1]

As long as "leadership" is inbounds, anyone care to discuss how significant this state leader action and the other state leaders that followed his example were in US total COVID-19 deaths? And why will the same leaders not disclose how many known COVID-19 positive patients were forced back into nursing homes under the attached terms?

Yes, top federal leadership has certainly been in the wrong many times this year. But so have many of the other leaders, without, seemingly, anywhere near the press noise nor the accountability heat on the national leader. And, arguably, these state level leaders have a much more direct, causal link to unnecessarily high death counts.
View attachment 136259
Note: highlighting is not mine
Edit: Link to one of a number of sources for that March 25, 2020 letter - https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...FjABegQIAhAB&usg=AOvVaw17pYfG67tgII3fVyJO95l1

So I’d challenge you to find incidences where this policy led to more cases of Covid19. As someone who dealt directly with similar policies in a neighboring state, the logic and necessity of such policies are clear. In the case of a nursing home resident who was admitted to a hospital with C19 then stablized and deemed fit for discharge, nursing homes were refusing to allow residents back to their facilities until 2 or 3 negative tests were obtained. The obvious downstream effect is that hospital beds are taken up with stable patients and this was at a time when every hospital bed and staff to maintain that bed were in very short supply. Of course this then means that nursing homes need more support by way of PPE, education on infection prevention, and equipment in some cases. It’s all an interdependent system, so all have to be in sync to work reasonably well. The policy was in no way malicious or politically motivated, it was a matter of survival for the most people. This is what happens when the shit hits the fan, hard decisions have to be made to save lives.

 

[mike220022]

All children look up to their moms and dads; right? We think they know best and they teach us their values. What do you think happens when your dad is a member of the KKK? What happens when your dad get arrested at a KKK rally? Do you think possibly there may be talk at the home about such KKK events or happenings? Do you think you'll sneak and hide in a corner to listen to conversations? Do you think you would start thinking like your dad? Stand down and stand back is NOT the same as denouncing/condemning white supremacy. To say there are good people in those WS groups (ie proud boys) is not quite the same and ends up being fuel for these groups to justify their existence. Unfortunately what he says has weight as well as what he doesn't say. His words matter and has consequences. His actions matters and has consequences.

Keep in mind, there is a HUGE difference between being a leader and being the boss/person in charge.

Again, diversify your news viewing and you will see a lot more has been said against it than what you are writing here but not in a million years do I see you agreeing with any facts so I'm done with the conversation. Fact is one side is trying to work with all people no matter your race or religion then there is....well you know...Actions

 

[GTBRMC]

So I’d challenge you to find incidences where this policy led to more cases of Covid19.

Well, there's the rub, isn't it? The governors of these states are refusing to release any data about nursing homes. So, putting a factual number on it is difficult - without any reported facts.

What do we know? Death rates in March, April, May were much, much higher (as a % of those who tested positive).*** The people that died skewed older than more recently. And they had a very strong association with multiple, long-term comorbidities. Hypothetically: Where is an 84 year old diabetic with history of heart failure and emphysema likely to reside?

Impossible to know... without facts. And there are reasons these facts are being withheld.

Also, I fully understand the systematic issues of available beds. What was the loading and usage of the tens of thousands of "surge beds" in the hospital ship, Central Park, McCormick Center, State Fair Park, the old Cobo Arena, etc.? Yes, very, very low. While these state leaders jammed known infected patients into the most concentrated location of the most vulnerable in facilities not designed for the task. Read every word of that attached memo, if you haven't already.

***yes, treatments have greatly improved - especially far more emphasis on cannula oxygen, less use of intubation ventilation, and use of Decadron - so this is certainly part of it

 

[Ramblin Wreck]

All children look up to their moms and dads; right? We think they know best and they teach us their values. What do you think happens when your dad is a member of the KKK? What happens when your dad get arrested at a KKK rally? Do you think possibly there may be talk at the home about such KKK events or happenings? Do you think you'll sneak and hide in a corner to listen to conversations? Do you think you would start thinking like your dad? Stand down and stand back is NOT the same as denouncing/condemning white supremacy. To say there are good people in those WS groups (ie proud boys) is not quite the same and ends up being fuel for these groups to justify their existence. Unfortunately what he says has weight as well as what he doesn't say. His words matter and has consequences. His actions matters and has consequences.

Keep in mind, there is a HUGE difference between being a leader and being the boss/person in charge.

You are right words do matter. How many times must he make himself clear? But back to Covid, the reality is there is nothing the president could have done or will do regarding Covid to please those that are partisan to the bone.