Need help - Lots of water draining from plug on '17 212X

[Daren and Heather]

Hi, so I have a 2020 AR210, first boat ever... Taken it out 6 times, never noticed issues with lots of water from the drain plug. For the first time over the 4th of July I left it sitting docked in the water for 3 days (battery off while docked) and over those 3 days we ran it pretty hard and did lots of tubing, driving WOT, making really hard turns to create wake and do jumps with the towable, etc. No rainfall during the 3 days. On the final day, when clearing out the wet storage compartment, I noticed water pooling at the bottom of the drain of the wet storage compartment. There was nothing blocking the drain, it was just like the bilge was completely full to the point the water was coming up the drain. I turned the bilge pump on and I heard it run. I turned the switch off, and the bulge pump turned off. Later that day, when I pulled the drain plug it gushed out water for maybe 3 minutes! And there were maybe 2 inches of water above the cleanout plugs.

1. Shouldnt I be worried that it appears the bilge pump wasn't already running automatically?
2. If I saw water slightly coming up above the wet storage compartment drain plug, does that mean the bilge is completely full?
3. Should I take to my dealer whole under warranty, or is this normal when you drive it hard like I did and leave it docked for 3 days?

 

[Cambo]

Water on the clean out plugs is normal . There are over 20 items that penetrate the hull that are below the water line not including all the screws on the rub rail . With the boat on the trailer or on a steep incline or tongue jacked up high with blocks under it run a hose into the bilge and watch for leaks .

 

[sunbyrned]

When you turned the bilge on, it pumped water out, yes? Also, I leave mine on just in case.

 

[Daren and Heather]

I actually didn't look to see the water coming out, I was just listening for the sound and was more surprised that the bilge pump wasn't already on.

 

[Daren and Heather]

Water on the clean out plugs is normal . There are over 20 items that penetrate the hull that are below the water line not including all the screws on the rub rail . With the boat on the trailer or on a steep incline or tongue jacked up high with blocks under it run a hose into the bilge and watch for leaks .

Where do I put the hose to put water into the bilge?

 

[GoVols01]

1. Shouldnt I be worried that it appears the bilge pump wasn't already running automatically?
2. If I saw water slightly coming up above the wet storage compartment drain plug, does that mean the bilge is completely full?
3. Should I take to my dealer whole under warranty, or is this normal when you drive it hard like I did and leave it docked for 3 days?

1. Keep your batteries turned on when the boat is floating in the water. When batteries are off, bilge pump gets no power. My boat was floating in a slip for a week last month during vacation with no issues with running the batteries down. When batteries are turned on, the boat cycles the bilge pump every 5 minutes or so. If it senses resistance (i.e. water) it will continue to run until there's no more resistance and then shuts back off.
2. If the plug was left open in the bottom of the forward ski locker, then, yes, your bilge was full of water up to that point.
3. It is NOT normal for your boat to get that much water. If you pull your boat from the water after each use, place a 5 gallon bucket beneath the plug and video the water filling the bucket to demonstrate to the dealer how much water you're getting from the hull.

I'm battling Yamaha and my dealer on this very issue currently. My lousy dealer, Tims Ford Powersports, has been telling me for the last few years that "2-3 gallons of water is normal." I finally got a case manager at Yamaha who admitted to me that "dry to 1 gallon" is considered normal. At this point, I'm hauling my boat 2.5 hours to a dealer in Knoxville, TN who has supposedly fixed 6 Yamahas this year with this same issue. I've told Yamaha and my dealer this is their last chance to get this right before I pull the Lemon Law option on this thing.

 

[GoVols01]

Where do I put the hose to put water into the bilge?

Ok, look. You bought a brand new boat. It is under warranty. Why would you feel compelled to diagnose and fix this yourself? That's what the warranty is for. You're spending your valuable time and more money fixing someone else's problem and could risk voiding your warranty. I'm in the same situation. I started to fix this myself a couple years ago, but came to this realization: it's their problem, not mine.

The dealer replaced the exhaust gaskets twice, resealed the rub rail, and tightened all clamps, but the problem persists. 5 gallons isn't normal and I refuse to accept this from a boat I paid $60K for. I worked in automotive manufacturing for 16+ years. Yamaha sold me on the fact that their robot manufacturing process produced a better boat. This is my 5th boat and it's by far the worst quality. I love the layout and the style of this boat and I'll be sad to see it go, if it comes to that, but the build quality is just garbage!

 

[Crob83]

1. Keep your batteries turned on when the boat is floating in the water. When batteries are off, bilge pump gets no power. My boat was floating in a slip for a week last month during vacation with no issues with running the batteries down. When batteries are turned on, the boat cycles the bilge pump every 5 minutes or so. If it senses resistance (i.e. water) it will continue to run until there's no more resistance and then shuts back off.
2. If the plug was left open in the bottom of the forward ski locker, then, yes, your bilge was full of water up to that point.
3. It is NOT normal for your boat to get that much water. If you pull your boat from the water after each use, place a 5 gallon bucket beneath the plug and video the water filling the bucket to demonstrate to the dealer how much water you're getting from the hull.

I'm battling Yamaha and my dealer on this very issue currently. My lousy dealer, Tims Ford Powersports, has been telling me for the last few years that "2-3 gallons of water is normal." I finally got a case manager at Yamaha who admitted to me that "dry to 1 gallon" is considered normal. At this point, I'm hauling my boat 2.5 hours to a dealer in Knoxville, TN who has supposedly fixed 6 Yamahas this year with this same issue. I've told Yamaha and my dealer this is their last chance to get this right before I pull the Lemon Law option on this thing.

He has a 2020, the battery does not need to be left on for the bilge to work. It is hardwired to the battery and is automatic. I always have water above my clean out port plug after every outing, which is normal.

 

[buckbuck]

@GoVols01 Has the dealer repaired the anchor locker drain yet?

 

[GoVols01]

@GoVols01 Has the dealer repaired the anchor locker drain yet?

It’s not leaking from the anchor locker. At on point, I sealed it completely with caulking and it made no difference.

 

[InmyElement]

i just tested my new bilge pump with the hose in bilge and most of my ride plate screws are leaking through the bottom..sad for a 4 year old boat that sits on a trailer more than in the water..
Check all your through hull fittings and hose clamps..on real boats every through hull fitting has 2 stainless hose clamps.

 

[Ratket]

i just tested my new bilge pump with the hose in bilge and most of my ride plate screws are leaking through the bottom..sad for a 4 year old boat that sits on a trailer more than in the water..
Check all your through hull fittings and hose clamps..on real boats every through hull fitting has 2 stainless hose clamps.

Great... Looks like I know what I am doing on a upcoming weekend.

 

[Daren and Heather]

I thought I would update this thread with some facts I discovered related to my bilge pump after some testing that I did...

1. It takes a LOT of water in the bilge, before it will automatically activate the bilge pump. I measured - I had to dump about 15 gallons of water in the bilge, to get the bilge pump triggered and start pumping water out.

2. The bilge pump is not placed low enough to pump ALL the water out of the bilge. It will leave about 2.5 gallons of water behind in the bilge.

3. The flow rate of water coming out of your drain plug is about 2.5 gallons per minute.

4. Therefore, if you pull your drain plug and see water flowing out for a full 3 minutes, you can assume there was around 8 gallons of water in the bilge. Which seems like a lot, but apparently not to the Yamaha engineers who didn't design the boat to even bother activating the bilge pump until around 15 gallons.

P.S. I removed my hatch cover, and both cup holders on the swim deck. The factory did a very poor job applying silicone sealant on both, which explains why I had so much water leaking in. I've resealed them and will see if it makes a difference. NOTE - putting the cupholders back in is a PIA, and literally impossible if you don't have the whole hatch cover removed, and even then almost impossible unless you have a freakishly long skinny arm. They have really short drain tubes that ensure the water doesn't drain into the bilge, but it's impossible to reconnect that drain tube once you pull the cupholder out. One option would be to replace it with a longer drain tube.

 

[GoVols01]

Well, another new boating season and the leaking hull saga continues. I left my boat with a dealer in the Knoxville area for 2 weeks last Fall so that he could go through the boat thoroughly and reseal everything. I took the boat out once after I picked it up in the Fall before it had to be winterized and I was optimistic they fixed it. This last weekend, we spent the weekend on the lake and the boat was in the water from 3:00PM Friday until 11AM Sunday. Water wasn't too comfortable for swimming, so there wasn't much water brought onto the boat from swimmers, instead we spent most of the time exploring the lake. I put 161 miles and almost 9 hours on the boat. When we pulled the boat out on Sunday, I videoed the water gushing from the drain plug again for 1 minute and 40 seconds. While I didn't measure the amount coming out this time, in the past, it would nearly fill up a 5 gallon bucket. Unacceptable!

I should also add, that I observed the bilge pump cycle once while we were anchored out on the water during the day. When it did, it pumped a surprising amount of water out of the hull. Very embarrassing!

I've already sent an email back to my Yamaha Corp. contact from the Fall to resume discussion on next steps. While I love the boat's layout and fun factor, I'm afraid I'm about to Lemmon Law it.

 

[johhnyboat]

did you check the scupper valve to see if it's leaking into the bilge area.

 

[Cambo]

Leave your clean out plugs in take the hose and fill that tray with water then watch how much water pours out of the drain plug. Make sure to keep the bow higher than the stern. I used a neoprene gasket and extra screws on the entire tray and the oval inspections port . There are close to 50 hull penetrations if you include all the screws on the rub rail .

 

[Acard7]

What a deal man. I thought our AR230 had the bilge working quite a bit more than we thought it should when we were floating the other day. But, we only had a trickle come out of the drain plug after we trailered so I guess we are lucky. I still need to seal our clean-out tray though. I hope you find the fix, we are rooting for you, so let us know!

 

[Evil Sports]

So has anyone identified the true issue

 

[Cambo]

So has anyone identified the true issue

Yes the true issue is the hulls have over 50 penetrations that can let water leak in then you have the entire seam around the back of the boat were the hull connects to the deck. The main three culprits are the anchor locker the clean out tray and inspection port. Take care of these first then see what happens

If you load ballast and surf the rear cleats can be capped on the inside they will let water in they are actually designed with a water drain off system



Then your boat may have been sitting on the trailer and when it rains the cover is not water proof especially around the tower there are large gaps and the trailer jack does not get the bow up high enough to let the water drain . When your at the boat ramp you most likely pull the drain plug with the boat at a good angle so the water comes out and it could be rain water coming out .

I even went to the extent to block the rain water by the tower and tarp the cover for uv and rain protection

 

[Evil Sports]

OK, Ill start with the tray. Cambo, you run in salt all the time??