new cobra super ultimate on a 2018 19 foot yamaha sent to me by a recent customer

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

I received a few pictures from one of my customers who just installed the new super Ultimate steering on his 2018 - 19 foot Yamaha.

 

[swatski]

Looks good! can't wait to pull the boat and put mine on, maybe another week or so.

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[mwalker4]

Do the fins hinder the effectiveness of the new reverse bucket for the 19's. It seems possible that they deflect the side to side flow component of the new buckets.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

Not at all the 2019 fin design is far enough out from the nozzle to avoid interference. Since the nozzle and reverse are wider that the previous nozzles the steering is also a wider stance. Actually even the new ak-19 systems on the 2019 twin engine AK boats with the addition of the original AK fangs to the outside surface of the fins rather than the inside surface work just fine and the fangs on this are only 35 dollars extra so the super magnum ak-19 with the tie extra patented tie rod addition for balance and the ak fangs cots a total of $394.99 with free priority mail in the USA . I believe the pictures I put up are boats from members here on this site. People send them to me and save them in my picture file.

 

[mwalker4]

Not at all the 2019 fin design is far enough out from the nozzle to avoid interference.

So am I trading improved forward slow speed steering for degraded reverse steering?

 

[Dwrat]

Cobra Jet,
I have a set of your fins on my 2013 SX19.
They look very similar to the above picture in post #1.
Can you tell me if they lift up when I'm at speed or do they stay down all the time?
If they stay down, how much speed are these costing me?
Thanks

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

First of all let me get focused on the correct system the Ultimate ak-19 single engine for the 2019, 19 foot boats There is no interference with the 2019 nozzle design because the fins are set apart wider than the original super ultimate system just like the super magnums for the twin engine 2019 boats .
There is no fangs on the single engine set for the 2019 model nozzles just the fins however one of the reasons I made design changes to the ultimate system was to in crease the slow speed forward and reverse influence of the new nozzle design and since it worked so well on the earlier nozzles I actually discontinued the original ultimate system fins all together so there is no compromise of reverse control or slow speed control only enhancements of those features due to the extra fin surfaces that come into play when the boat is off plane and with the new nozzle designs.

Also the fins are adjustable and selectable so you decide if they stay up or go down at speed as well as how far down .
So If you have a set of my new super ultimate steering on a 19 foot boat, even if the system is set to stay down as I recommend for the most effect you should not have any loss of top end, now considering it's your boat if it was loosing speed I would expect that you would be telling me not asking Just a bit confused on that question, that being said show me some pictures of where you have it set and perhaps I can answer your question.
The picture below shows where I suggest it be set on a 19 foot boat regardless of the year. and regardless if it is a regular Ultimate or the new super ultimate system.
On pre ak models you can also add a set of mega fangs to the system for 85 dollars to make up for not having the rudder, for even more slow speed and reverse control and more real reverse power and steering, so no worries about trying to power off a trailer and have your boat jump sideways possibly hitting the dock or another boat since the fangs only capture and direct the real reverse thrust to provide better stopping power in reverse and faster turning response as the forward leading fangs lead the back of the boat while the fins turn the boat, plus they reduce steering resistance. As for reducing reverse steering response there is nothing I make that hinders reverse or forward. Actually I just had a customer tell me he backed 75 feet against a current using the super ultimate system on a 19 foot boat.

 

[Dwrat]

I only ask about speed because I bought my boat with them already installed.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

Ok if you post a picture I can tell you if they are set to go up at speed or stay down at speed and if you have them set properly.

 

[Dwrat]

 

[Dwrat]

Can you tell me what model these are?

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

WOW those are an OLD set of 6 hole regular ultimate steering , They don't even have the fang mounting holes, look just fine except I would suggest you set them one hole lower , making the fins 1 adjustment higher, on a 19 foot boat it places the bottom of the fins in line with the hull . One thing about a 19 foot hull especially when it has no rudder, the nozzle is the lowest point of the hull so making steering for there requires you to be aware of the position of the fins, You do not want them hanging too far below the hull. the picture I attached is a 7 hole regular ultimate fin but the position I am suggesting is the same even though your fins were made years prior to the 7 hole set , now to understand the fin surface difference between the ultimate and super ultimate see the top and rear portion of the new super ultimate is a lot larger compared to the regular ultimate and the 7 hole ultimate is exactly the same size as the one you have. Adding more fin to the top rear allows me to offer more influence at slow speeds without interfering with the influence at planning speeds.
So try that setting and let me know how you like it. The nice thing is you get to decide the influence and you get to change the function as well .

 

[swatski]

Can you tell me what model these are?

I think those are the Ultimates?
I had them on my 2012 190, set allways down. Loved, lvoved, loved them. No speed loss. Essential for water sports behind a 190.

Take them off and see how quickly you will run back to reinstall, lol. No kidding. Those are that good.

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[swatski]

So am I trading improved forward slow speed steering for degraded reverse steering?

I drool anytime I look at the new 2019 reverse nozzles. The new Yamaha design is brilliant. Adds lateral thrust with essentially no loss of reverse.

There is no reverse loss with Cobra fins, zero. Fangs enhance the reverse somewhat, the dual setup (two Fangs per nozzle more than one).
JBP Lateral Thrusters improve lateral thrust by scrubbing a lot of strait reverse thrust, but the factory lateral thrusters feature the design that does not have those problems.

EDIT: loss of strait reverse can be a problem if you ever launch over shallow ramps, you may not be able to power off of your trailer.
Otherwise it probably does not matter all that much, no one races in reverse.

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[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

he can set them to go up at speed by repositioning the actuator as shown on the old 6 hole fins, the new 7 hole do it a different way using the #6 and #7 hole.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

Actually the new 2019 reverse nozzles deal with a different approach aprox 45 degree angles shooting the water out the nozzle both at the same time to stabilize the deliverance of the reverse thrust. NOT a 90 degree thrust.
This works a lot better that the previous nozzles that just sort of dumped the reverse thrust out the bottom of the nozzle.
Several years ago I developed the fangs to capture and direct more of the reverse thrust being dumped out the bottom of the nozzle.
This worked out and improved the amount and direction of the reverse thrust forces that were being put to use by directing the thrust better for steering straight and working against currents , more power in reverse for backing off trailers beaches and lifts etc. as well as directing the back of the boat better in reverse but in a real reverse way.
Also improving the reverse stopping capability and assisting in faster high speed turning with way less speed bleed off while adding in a mild power steering effect to make the admirals happy when they drive the boat. From the fangs and mega fangs I now have the mega fang plus for most of the boats with a few exceptions.

 

[BigAbe75]

I drool anytime I look at the new 2019 reverse nozzles. The new Yamaha design is brilliant. Adds lateral thrust with essentially no loss of reverse.

@swatski Now that I have the ‘19, I don’t feel like it’s as awesome as I expected it to be. It might be some better than my old boat at moving laterally, but with a little dual throttle wizardry you can get very similar results.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

Yes any twin engine boat with duel throttles can crab walk sideways or rotate in place just by learning how to work the throttles I have been telling people that for years.
However since a jet boat has no transmission you can learn to operate the controls even on a single engine to go forward /reverse / neutral constantly and walk a boat in forward or reverse easily with no harm to anything as the direction is being controlled by the water flow not the direction of a prop.

 

[swatski]

@swatski Now that I have the ‘19, I don’t feel like it’s as awesome as I expected it to be. It might be some better than my old boat at moving laterally, but with a little dual throttle wizardry you can get very similar results.

I agree. The 190s need it, in the 240s it is more optional in my opinion - I Iike those for more control in turns and this:

Importantly, Cobras permit turning when you slow down and have no thrust. Such as during avoidance manuevers.

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[Dwrat]

Thank you Jeff.
I will adjust my fins one hole down and see how it does.