Wake Surfing on the 210 (now a build thread)

[anmut]

How much can you notice it throttling the engines during wakeboarding? When I was out with 8 adults, above 18 mph it would start to plane out then at 20 once more hull is out of the water it would shoot up to 25. Throttle back down, rinse and repeat. Really annoying. I'm wondering how hard the PP will have to work to prevent that from happening.

How do I explain this - it's near perfect? Set the speed or (for cruising) the RPM either manually or by setting up rider profiles. Turn on (while boat is in N), select profile or RPM speed. If wakeboarding the driver will pop the rider out of the water, throttle up and past the speed setting and RS will beep and alert that it's taking over and then it'll throttle it back down to set speed. To change speed while towing, just adjust the knob one way or another to adjust by .10 of a MPH.

When being pulled, I'll feel the pop out of the water like normal, then the surge to get up to speed, then just as fast the boat will calm down and I'm carving at 18mph no matter what conditions are or how deep into a turn we might be. 18.miles.per.hour.all.the.time. It's pretty awesome!

 

[Botchco]

I installed Ride Steady two weeks ago - it's made our lives 100% easier for towing anyone.

Agree on ridesteady. Made my wife and kids 200% happier with ride experience. Also great to use for auto sync of engines full time.

 

[rwhelton]

Ordered 2150 lbs of ballast today. Going to have this thing slammed and we'll see how it does. Usually I'm around 11-12 mph but will keep playing with speed.

I'll echo the comments of the others regarding V drive vs jet. The no prop to worry about in the shallow lakes is awesome. My true criteria was I wanted a CC I could surf from and the FSH, Scarab Open and Mastercraft CSX (2007-2010) are the only ones on the market.

Agree, just bought the 210 FSH because I can't find or justify when I do find spending $50K for a 13 year old CSX220 from Mastercraft. All that said I'm still not surf ready. I have added the TVW Wake and Perfect Pass but with only 1000 lbs and my skim board there's not enough push. I've got another 1000 lbs ordered so I think I'll have a shot then and probably on a longer board. Fingers Crossed.....

 

[brian86992]

Agree, just bought the 210 FSH because I can't find or justify when I do find spending $50K for a 13 year old CSX220 from Mastercraft. All that said I'm still not surf ready. I have added the TVW Wake and Perfect Pass but with only 1000 lbs and my skim board there's not enough push. I've got another 1000 lbs ordered so I think I'll have a shot then and probably on a longer board. Fingers Crossed.....

Sounds like you and I did the exact same thing. I searched nationwide for a CSX before throwing in the towel because paying $50k for a 13 year old boat just stings as you mentioned. It's also still a direct drive so surfing the CSX would have its own obstacles as well.

How do you like the TVW? Is it the style that clips to the ladder or the one that attaches to the jet nozzles? I'm a bit confused about which is which.

 

[rwhelton]

The TVW has helped a few different things with the handling of this boat but it does clip into the ladder when surfing and the fins are permanent/bolted onto the jet nozzles. Installation was pretty easy. Just ordered another 1100lbs of ballast yesterday so I'm really hoping it's a weight issue that I have been having. I was told all I needed to surf was weight/ballast and the TVW. I'm starting to wonder if I don't also need the Gantlin Wake Wedge to clean up the port side.

 

[brian86992]

Well I'm here to brag about the Perfect Pass. Although expensive, this is the best money I've spent on the boat so far. Being able to slam the throttle forward then totally ignore it makes the day 100% better. Way more ability to focus on the rider, navigating and also just having fun instead of babysitting the throttle constantly. I also set up a cruise mode on it which is a thing of beauty. No adjustments when crossing wakes, change in wind etc.





Will be back shortly with high quality pics of surfing with the ballast.

 

[brian86992]

Alright here's the surf video. Finally was able to ride ropeless on the Slingshot Coaster. 7 adults (let's say 140 lbs average), 2100 lbs ballast, wake booster, perfect pass set to about 11 mph. That puts the boats weight around 6500 lbs. I have to compliment the handling while carrying that much... was very stable the whole time even though the wake of passing surf boats.

600 lb bag between bow seats
800 lb bag behind cooler
800 lb bag left of helm

So the real hold up from getting any more out of the boat...? Power. With the ballast full and wake booster installed the boat struggled to get past 9 mph at full throttle. The perfect pass would be flashing MORE THROTTLE and I just didn't have any more to give it.

Next up I'll be playing with ballast placement (more weight on stern, less on bow) and looking into how to get more out of the motors. Most realistically that's a tuner. Not sure if these boats can benefit from intake or exhaust.

 

[anmut]

Nice! We had a great weekend of surfing. Did 750 in the ski locker, 750 on the surf side deck, Ridesteady, wakebooster and a lot of human ballast (4 teenagers, 5 adults)! Everyone but my 6'7", new to wakesurfing, step brother was able to go ropeless with ease. Lake was nice and deep and my last time out I had a bigger pocket than I've ever experienced, allowed me go up and down the wave and catch back up to the boat - so much fun!

What engines do you have? I had no problem dialing between 9.5mph and 11.5mph, depending on the rider, with my 1.8l twin.

 

[Scottintexas]

So the real hold up from getting any more out of the boat...? Power. With the ballast full and wake booster installed the boat struggled to get past 9 mph at full throttle. The perfect pass would be flashing MORE THROTTLE and I just didn't have any more to give it.

Next up I'll be playing with ballast placement (more weight on stern, less on bow) and looking into how to get more out of the motors. Most realistically that's a tuner. Not sure if these boats can benefit from intake or exhaust.

If you'll move some weight forward, especially passengers while you're first getting on plane it will help out a lot.
last session we had, I was full throttle trying to get to 10mph and just couldn't, moved two people to the bow when starting and boat easily got to speed and held at 8k rpm (for mr1 engine) and then the people could move back around,


.

 

[brian86992]

Nice! We had a great weekend of surfing. Did 750 in the ski locker, 750 on the surf side deck, Ridesteady, wakebooster and a lot of human ballast (4 teenagers, 5 adults)! Everyone but my 6'7", new to wakesurfing, step brother was able to go ropeless with ease. Lake was nice and deep and my last time out I had a bigger pocket than I've ever experienced, allowed me go up and down the wave and catch back up to the boat - so much fun!

What engines do you have? I had no problem dialing between 9.5mph and 11.5mph, depending on the rider, with my 1.8l twin.

The 210 FSH is only available with twin TR1s unfortunately. With only about 110 hp each, pushing 6500 lbs is asking a lot of them.

 

[Tailwaters]

I can't imagine how much fuel you guys are using with all that weight in the boat.we had a little success the other night with three people sitting on the swim platform boat cruising at 12 miles an hour my daughter who weighs all but about a hundred pounds was actually able to let go of the rope and surf for about 30 yards before she came disconnected with the wake. So we have basically used the rope as a tow. They all love it That's for darn sure it's been the hit this summer haven't had the tube out or wakeboard one time.

 

[anmut]

I can't imagine how much fuel you guys are using with all that weight in the boat.we had a little success the other night with three people sitting on the swim platform boat cruising at 12 miles an hour my daughter who weighs all but about a hundred pounds was actually able to let go of the rope and surf for about 30 yards before she came disconnected with the wake. So we have basically used the rope as a tow. They all love it That's for darn sure it's been the hit this summer haven't had the tube out or wakeboard one time.

It's not an optimal rpm for fuel efficiency, believe me. Over the last long weekend I went through about 25 gallons a day, 11am - 5pm. Wakeboarding, surfing, skiing. Wakeboarding seemed to take the most fuel as rpm/speed is 10mph under it's most efficient speed of 30mph, the boat is running some ballast, you're running at those speeds for longer, and you're starting/stopping more between rider falls / switches. Surfing was second due to increased weight - however most surfing times lasted less than a 4 minute song. Skiing was probably the most efficient because all the ballast is empty and speeds are up around 25mph.

 

[brian86992]

Back with a report from another weekend. Had a small crew of just three people this time. Got my maybe favorite yet surf wake.

Having some issues with the Perfect Pass where it way overshoots the set speed (28 mph before settling down to 20 mph for wakeboarding) so I've emailed them to see if there's tuning I can change.

This time I only filled two of the bags. Initially I put one of the swim platform (higher step) and one behind the cooler but the boat couldn't get to speed unless one of the guys went to the bow. I then moved the bag behind the cooler next to the console to get some list and the weight forward. This was a good wave.

I'll be taking no questions about my $10 Amazon hammock hack that's half falling off the boat at this time

Also found out that the Riva tuner isn't recommended for boats so no silver bullet to my power woes yet.

 

[brian86992]

Another weekend in the books. Since I keep adding to this thread I'm just going to make it my build thread. Why not.

Did my first long trip. 90 miles through the ship channel and into the gulf. So glad to have a boat that can handle the open water in addition to the lake play. To that end, settled on a name for the boat finally. I've put so much effort into getting this boat setup to surf, but recognizing it's "supposed" to be a fishing boat at heart, it's now called SURFSH.
"Do you have a wake surfing boat?"
"...well, it's surf-ish..."



I got my letting from Sign Specialist for under $20 shipped and they also sent me 2 instead of one for some reason. Really happy with the quality and the matte black color.



Also toyed around with ways to store the board when not in use. Super happy with this $8 suction cup from Harbor Freight I put a second one on the top side tail of the board and it doesn't budge at full throttle in 2' chop.





Two issues I'm having... still haven't resolved my Perfect Pass issue where it way overshoots the set speed https://jetboaters.net/threads/perfect-pass-seriously-overshoots-speed.29094/

and also my tachometers sometimes freak out and shoot down to 2k or even 0 RPM and then bounce around while at full throttle. The engines have full power the whole time so not sure what's going on. Any of you ever seen this?



Oh... also had a really solid hit on a submerged stump at about 15 mph and did a bit of damage to the hull. Nothing structural but will need to touch up the gel coat. Was bound to happen sooner or later...

 

[rwhelton]

My Perfect Pass does the same thing, overshoots and then falls back so it's always exciting white knuckle experience for the rider momentarily. How much weight did you put on the platform? I'm still messing with mine and cannot get it dialed in, really thinking about picking up a wakebooster to clean up which ever side I list but JBP swears I don't need it. Hammock idea is a good one, I can't get anything to secure weight really far back on the boat.

 

[anmut]

Get a wakebooster or Gatlin wake wedge. I have asked for proof that the JBP wake thingy does anything close to either of the aforementioned products... still waiting!

 

[brian86992]

I guess Yamaha is laughing at my suction cup board storage with the new product they released today.

My Perfect Pass does the same thing, overshoots and then falls back so it's always exciting white knuckle experience for the rider momentarily. How much weight did you put on the platform? I'm still messing with mine and cannot get it dialed in, really thinking about picking up a wakebooster to clean up which ever side I list but JBP swears I don't need it. Hammock idea is a good one, I can't get anything to secure weight really far back on the boat.

I have no experience with the Gatlin nor JBP product so I won't speak to either but the wake booster makes 80% the difference on my boat. The way it swoops in the water does a few things

1. Creates a pocket behind the boat in a way where it' scoops out a smooth swath behind it
2. Directs all of that water into the surf side jet wash completely moving the wash to the middle (+-) of the wake
3. That extra jet wash now becomes part of the surf side wave

I really do think Yamaha did a great job designing the product which is not too surprising because after all they have been designing hulls for decades.

Recently I've been putting 550 lbs on the platform centered. Getting decent results but still tuning. If I put a full 800 back there the boat can't get up to speed unless there's lots of bow weight too. My next outing I'm going to try to off center that stern weight perhaps by laying the bag parallel to the gunnel across both steps and the transom. We'll see how I fund out how to rig that..

 

[brian86992]

Best surf wave yet. For the first time today I extended out the rope all the way to its longest loop and the wave still had push behind that. It's a 16' rope from the tower so this is the most surf-able wave I've had.

http://imgur.com/SaYHNqu

It was just the girlfriend and I so 100 lbs at helm when I was surfing. I stuck 540 lbs on the second step of the stern as close to port as possible. 800 lb bag in between bow seats and 800 lb bag port of console scooted all the way back. Had a pretty good amount of list which the boat really liked. I'm going to find a way to position the bags to get it to lean over even more next time. Wakebooster install per normal as well. 11-11.2 mph on the PP.

 

[rwhelton]

That wave looks nice, I need a wakebooster but really want to try one first before I throw more money at my project.....JBP TVW was a disappointment for surfable push. I have plenty of ballast...

 

[brian86992]

Got a lake house this weekend and kept the boat in the water overnight at the dock. What a treat.



The Perfect Pass is still driving me absolutely nuts. It's overshooting speed so bad that it'll pull a wake boarder 28 mph before settling down to the set point at 20 mph. I'm emailing with a Perfect Pass engineer now and hopefully they have a solution. In order to not take the rider for a wild time I have to manually control the throttle until we hit speed and also take over control any time we turn... which is essentially why you buy the $1000+ system. Really hoping they have a solution/software update etc.


Took the dog surfing.


Also got caught in a storm in the roughest water the boat has seen. Wind picked up and got really nasty really quick with some steep 3-4' waves. With 7 adults on board it was not a fun time. Tried some passengers up front to get more of the V in the water (which is generally smoother in small chop) and started taking wave break over the bow. Moved them to the back and the boat barely had enough power to plane out with the waves. Ended up getting close to shore at 8 mph to more protected waters before bringing it back up. Definitely a taste of why this is a "coastal" boat and not an offshore boat