195s or AR210 - Tow Vehicle Limit

[orionone]

Alright I thought we had it narrowed down, we need your help on a decision. We have a new SUV with 5K tow capacity. We don’t want to push the tow limit. Family of 4, 2 kids under 3yo. Trailering 30-45 min on a normal day, up to 3-4 hours for longer hauls. We’re in a mountainous area.

Keep the new SUV and go 195s
-OR-
Trade for a pickup SuperCrew (one car family) to support towing the 210?
Either one could be stored in our garage.
Our intention is to not be the boat hosting family, rather meet other families that have boats. However, this is our first boat so I’m not sure how that will play out.
Thanks!

 

[fatboyroy]

Get the supercrew and 210, 195 is a bit small for family also by the time u added passenger and gear weight to your suv you will be close to max with 195 anyway.

 

[HangOutdoors]

I guess it depends on where you launch at, and what they allow. Here where I live, a lot of the inland lakes only have parking for Vehicles with Trailers and no close parking so if you don't come with us in our car or uber in, you won't usually be going.

I was in the same dilemna as you, sort of and I got a nice used 2017 Ford Expedition Limited for around 30k. I have the bench for the second row. Towing capacity is 9200 lbs. So I can carry 8 passengers if needed or drop the back seat and have a ton of storage and carry 5 people. I could upgade the boat to something considerably larger, which gives me options down the road. It pulls the 21' no problem and effortlessly.

I like to have options for things that may occur. It is great when we take a few people along for a long boating road trip or on vacation with the boat.

Just some thoughts.

 

[gallobg]

We have a 2019 Honda Pilot (5k tow limit) and a 2019 AR195. The combo does just fine for us, but we are in Ohio where it's generally level (i.e., not mountainous like you said).

I've done several tows and just got back from a 3 hour one. The Pilot did well for us with everything loaded down. However, if you are in a really mountainous area, the limits of your SUV may become apparent going up the hills, and then braking on the way back down. Remember, you need engine power AND braking capacity for a safe trip.

Also, I would NOT have done the same trip with the Pilot if I had an AR210. Maybe short trips around town, but certainly not a multi-hour tow with the family on board.

One other thought that often gets overlooked when considering tow vehicles is the amount of actual cargo weight capacity you have based upon the tow vehicle GCWR (Gross Combined Weight Rating = vehicle + people + cargo + trailer). For our situation, I estimate the AR195 to have a total trailer weight of around 3800 lbs with fuel and gear. Our family of four has a people weight of about 700 lbs. Adding everything together and we have about 950lbs of cargo available to max out the Pilot's GCWR. That sounds like a lot but disappears quickly if you're packing up for a long trip. So find out your SUV's GCWR and do the math yourself to see what kind of headroom you really have.

Last thing I'll leave you with - we have the 195 because the lake I live on has a 20ft limit. If I was allowed to have the 21' boat I would hands down have purchased that one (or maybe even a 24). The extra few feet of space makes a huge difference as the kids get older and have friends (and their parents) on board. Keep in mind that your kids are small now but they won't stay that way for long!

 

[HangOutdoors]

@gallobg You could of just bought the 21' footer and changed the graphics to read AR200 or 200s or better yet just slapped a 19' footer graphic logo on it

 

[AZMark]

If you’re absolutely certain that boating will be your thing then I’d go truck & 210.

If you’re pretty sure I’d go 210 and deal with your current tow vehicle until you are certain and then get the truck.

If you’re just giving this a shot then go with the 195 and your vehicle. Less investment, easy to unwind, somewhat easier/cheaper boat to deal with.

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

I like big trucks, I can not lie!

In a mountainous area, I would pick the larger tow vehicle, even for an AR195.

Are you absolutely sure you have a 5K capacity with your current SUV? If 5K is the max for you model SUV, you may or may not have a lesser individual vehicle rating depending on how your SUV was optioned. With my RAM 1500, I was able to go on the manufacturer's website and look up my payload and towing capacities by my truck's VIN.

Also, for you current vehicle double check the tow capacity of the installed hitch to make sure it is a 5,000 lb one. I would hope the manufacturer puts on the correctly sized hitch, but I wouldn't assume that they did.

Jim

 

[orionone]

If you’re absolutely certain that boating will be your thing then I’d go truck & 210.

If you’re pretty sure I’d go 210 and deal with your current tow vehicle until you are certain and then get the truck.

If you’re just giving this a shot then go with the 195 and your vehicle. Less investment, easy to unwind, somewhat easier/cheaper boat to deal with.

This is a solid approach, I like it. Thank you. I guess it’s tough knowing whether boating will be our thing, we won’t really know until we do it. And if we give it a shot and absolutely love it, we’ll regret not going bigger to start. Your second option is a good middle ground solution.

 

[orionone]

I like big trucks, I can not lie!

In a mountainous area, I would pick the larger tow vehicle, even for an AR195.

Are you absolutely sure you have a 5K capacity with your current SUV? If 5K is the max for you model SUV, you may or may not have a lesser individual vehicle rating depending on how your SUV was optioned. With my RAM 1500, I was able to go on the manufacturer's website and look up my payload and towing capacities by my truck's VIN.

Also, for you current vehicle double check the tow capacity of the installed hitch to make sure it is a 5,000 lb one. I would hope the manufacturer puts on the correctly sized hitch, but I wouldn't assume that they did.

Jim

Thanks, we are definitely good with the 195s with current TV. GCWR 10500, actual tow capacity 5060. AWD with tow package, extra transmission cooling,etc. Factoring in tow capacity, payload, cargo, fuel, we have some cushion. We would have very little cushion with the 210 (extra ~1000lbs).

 

[HangOutdoors]

Easier to change vehicles than to change boats.

 

[AZMark]

This is a solid approach, I like it. Thank you. I guess it’s tough knowing whether boating will be our thing, we won’t really know until we do it. And if we give it a shot and absolutely love it, we’ll regret not going bigger to start. Your second option is a good middle ground solution.

I probably should have said I was in the exact same situation and that is what I did.
5000lb tow vehicle (4runner) worked ok for a while but I upgraded after a few months. Quite a few big hills to get to my lakes too.

 

[Dave burke]

Tough choice. I’m with @HangOutdoors though, easier to change vehicles than boats.

My BMW X5 pulls my 212X in mountainous terrain no problem. Great vehicle too although it’s not cheap.

 

[orionone]

I probably should have said I was in the exact same situation and that is what I did.
5000lb tow vehicle (4runner) worked ok for a while but I upgraded after a few months. Quite a few big hills to get to my lakes too.

Yeah it seems that it’s inevitable that we’ll need a TV upgrade, regardless of 195 or 210. And as @HangOutdoors said, we don’t want to be dealing with upgrading the boat. Sounds like the more logical solution is to go 210, try current TV, realize it’s not fun, then come to terms with upgrading the TV lol.

 

[HangOutdoors]

@orionone Sounds like a great plan. Just know you and your tow vehicles limits. As I have mentioned many times before, just because you can do something doesn't mean you should. If it doesn't feel right or you are going over, just get another TV.

 

[orionone]

@orionone Sounds like a great plan. Just know you and your tow vehicles limits. As I have mentioned many times before, just because you can do something doesn't mean you should. If it doesn't feel right or you are going over, just get another TV.

I agree, safety is priority with the family so I’ll be triple checking the numbers to be safe. I found this tool handy to back me up on towing calculations, you just have to verify your numbers are accurate (GCWR, GVWR,payload, etc):

Google Domains Hosted Site

I appreciate all the advice, thank you all!

 

[fatboyroy]

This is a solid approach, I like it. Thank you. I guess it’s tough knowing whether boating will be our thing, we won’t really know until we do it. And if we give it a shot and absolutely love it, we’ll regret not going bigger to start. Your second option is a good middle ground solution.

Learn your boat before taking it out... only reason you won’t be full-on boating family is if you messed up your boat and you will be frustrated. Everyone loves their boat if it runs right

 

[Dfred]

Sorry for a bit of late after-though comment on this - you seem pretty well informed and decided… Concur - Go 210 & get a TV when you need it.

echoing everyone….
We do not recommend compromise on the boat… “buy your second boat first” if possible. Always make sure the Admiral is happy (not cramped). Definitely take some familiarization trips (towing practice, and boating practice) with just you and a trusted trainer friend - before you get everyone out on the maiden voyage. Twin engine is a joy-ride (compared to days on an I/O) and ridiculously easy to maneuver (especially with CobraJetSteering or Thrust Vectors “required” add on equipment). We love love love our AR210, even though it’s an older ‘09 (which is lighter than newer model).

We tow around the flatter mid east coast 20min to 4hrs (local roads and highway) on top capacity edge of a Honda Pilot 4x4 with factory tow package (trans cooler etc). If we were in real mountains area regularly - it would not work out with the tail wagging the dog. There are some that say you can … but, it’s not worth the risk and stress. The 21 2-axel trailer does also have brakes…. That could factor into decision also regardless.

Something to consider in any TV - We added Timbren rear suspension kit (and DIY upgraded the rear shocks …. and all bushings, all brakes) - this made a huge difference in all performance and handling factors. (Had Firestone airbag in another and prefer the Timbren bushing system.) Also, check specs on your tires (upgrades may be needed for capacity) and inflation at proper max for loads.

We just did a 400mile PA mountain filled vacation journey… blessed with a borrowed TV (V8, 7K capacity Toyota Sequoia) knowing the Honda would have likely smoked the transmission, or worse. That was awesome experience to have real FOB truck and power needed for the ups and downs. It was interesting though - it had noticeable sag/squat from the loaded and hooked up weight …. So when we do upgrade our full time TV, probably will be getting the Timbren installed on that also.