AR210 won't start and rough idle ***UPDATE SOLUTION***

[swatski]

Wow, that is great news! And the sticking valve picture looks the same as @ToddW850 (in post #39 here)! Different cylinder, but eerily similar picture.

Thank you for the updates guys, this is super informative.

 

[ToddW850]

Great news @itsdgm ! You should be back up and at it in no time. And I was thinking the same thing as @swatski , we have the same boat and looks like the same valve issue. Good news is, I haven't had any issues since.

 

[buckbuck]

What kind of oil are you guys using?

 

[ToddW850]

What kind of oil are you guys using?

Previous owner used Valvoline 10W-40. I've continued with that.

 

[buckbuck]

I have also switched over to 10W-40. Do you think the valve guide issue could be related to oil?

 

[ToddW850]

I don't think so, based on the fact it was only one cylinder affected out of 8 total. My Mechanic didn't believe it had anything to do with the oil either.

 

[itsdgm]

Latest update: (as of a week or so ago, sorry been busy )

Last time I spoke to the mechanic we agreed that he would have the machine shop that he uses take a look at all of the valves on the affected cylinder.

A few days ago, my mechanic called and said that the machine shop looked at the valves and found some surface rust on the affected exhaust valve stem. The machine shop cleaned them all up and reinstalled them. I was very skeptical about not replacing it. He said that the machine shop wasn't recommending it due to the low hours (230) on the engine and that everything was straight and within spec. He really trusts his machinist, so who am I to question.

Seeing how it would only be a bit more cost for labor, we agreed to have the machine shop take apart the remaining valves and inspect (hopefully take pictures), clean, and reinstall them too

I'm not holding my breath of getting any pics from the machine shop though. We will see

My mechanic did tell me a couple days ago that he had ordered new gaskets and was expecting to get the head back any day now. It will probably only take him about an hour or so to reassemble.

I'm getting anxious

 

[buckbuck]

Hmmm...sounds like the old -"valve is open when engine shuts off allowing moisture in exhaust to rust things" -theory.

 

[itsdgm]

Hmmm...sounds like the old -"valve is open when engine shuts off allowing moisture in exhaust to rust things" -theory.

Yeah, I was discussing that exact scenario with him. That's why I really wanted pics to see if all the valves looked similar or if that cylinder is the one that tends to stop more often with the exhaust valves open.

 

[itsdgm]

Well, I got the engine back a few days ago. My mechanic said that the machine shop pictures were too dark to see anything

All repairs:
Diagnostics (leak down testing, compression, scoping)
Tear down
Machine shop work
Reassembly
Oil pan gasket replacement (in hopes that this will cure my mystery oil drip)
Placed a heli-coil on valve cover (for a stripped out COP hold down bolt)
Final compression test
Parts:
Head gasket
Exhaust gasket
Head pipe gasket (I think this is another exhaust gasket)
Oil pan gasket
Valve cover gasket
Heli coil

Total cost, parts, labor & tax $686.00

This of course doesn't include the cost of building my gantry, $150 and $50 for a used chain hoist and leveling bar that I eventually picked up.

So all told, I'm in this repair for $886.oo. Which is a drop in the bucket of what I initially feared when I saw 0 psi on my compression gauge. I truly believe that pulling the engine and bringing it to a jet ski shop potentially saved me thousands of dollars over a dealer's cost of repair and even a boat shop. Nobody wants to store a boat with a tower during repair, and this repair was mostly labor. So pulling the engine was most of the work.

After picking up the engine I changed the spark plugs, topped off the oil (it had been drained to replace the oil pan gasket) and filter.

Today I installed the engine back into the boat. I still need to hook everything back up. But at least the engine is set.

 

[Scuba_ref]

Hero!

 

[ToddW850]

@itsdgm that's a very good price. Glad you got it back.

 

[buckbuck]

Looking good. When is the maiden voyage for the rebuilt motor?

 

[itsdgm]

Looking good. When is the maiden voyage for the rebuilt motor?

Not sure exactly when I'll get a chance. I will probably get it all dialed in this week and test it on the hose. Hopefully I can take the kids out for the day on a local lake during their Easter break in a few weeks.

 

[Gym]

@itsdgm. Just reread this thread. Glad you came out of this as well as you did. With regard to your wish that they replaced the affected valve. That would have also required them to lap the valve into the head so that it would seat properly. That would have raised your parts and labor bill some but I dought the results would have been any better. It seems your mechanic made a good decision on your behalf where some would have taken the opportunity to boost the bill. Did he give you any preventative advise other than the known Ring Free & fogging?

 

[itsdgm]

@itsdgm that's a very good price. Glad you got it back.

Thanks @ToddW850 & @buckbuck for the support both with expere

@itsdgm. Just reread this thread. Glad you came out of this as well as you did. With regard to your wish that they replaced the affected valve. That would have also required them to lap the valve into the head so that it would seat properly. That would have raised your parts and labor bill some but I dought the results would have been any better. It seems your mechanic made a good decision on your behalf where some would have taken the opportunity to boost the bill. Did he give you any preventative advise other than the known Ring Free & fogging?

thanks @Gym. He really didn't give much advice.

I agree with not replacing the valve unless absolutely necessary because of the additional work in seating everything and setting clearances properly. But I wanted him to know that I was willing to do it if there was any doubt as to whether or not the valve was bent or damaged in any way. But everything checked out once they were cleaned up.

As far as maintenance changes. This type of issue is clearly due to storage. I do use ring free but rarely fogged up to this point because I fire up the boat about once a month during the off season to prevent this type of thing from happening. He was surprised that this happened to me given my prior history of running the engines about once a month. He's seen a lot of engines with a lot worse wear and complete lack of maintenance and very rarely a stuck valve.

So in the future, I'll still be using stabil for storage, ring free with each fill up. But I'll also be fogging at the end of the season, running the engines once a month and probably pulling the spark plugs and shooting some fogging oil into each cylinder and turning over the motor with the lanyard removed to move the oil around a few times in the off season too.

 

[Gym]

Good info @itsdgm. I'll be a little more religious about the fogging also as I already use the Ring Free. Glad you're back on the water. Thanks for the education.

 

[InmyElement]

Thanks for the insight..never heard of ring free until now.

 

[Scottintexas]

adding this to faq under engine removal,

how has the engine ran this summer?

 

[ToddW850]

adding this to faq under engine removal,

how has the engine ran this summer?

It's been two full summers and has run flawless. And we boat A LOT. Glad to contribute.