Huge Power Loss

[Bruce]

In the picture above my impeller is separating from the pump, is that bad..?

Did you remove the bolts to pull the pump?

If so keep pulling....

 

[AboveTheBest]

The pump housing is coming out, but the impeller is staying in.

I took out the first four bolts and the pump (not the impeller) is coming out. I’m assuming I’ll have to take the next section off to get to the impeller.

At what point am I going to do something really stupid?

 

[Bruce]

The pump housing, the section that the impeller resides in, often comes off with the trailing sections and impeller.

The impeller should not bind in the pump housing.

If the impeller comes out without the pump housing that is fine.

 

[boudin]

Impeller is torqued to the driveshaft. It should have all come out as a unit. Pull it out and take some pics. Possible the impeller is stuck and pulled out of the housing and bearings.

 

[Gym]

Just looks like you took off the pump liner bolts rather than the entire pump mounting bolts. The pump mounting bolts attach the pump to the large mounting plate.

 

[boudin]

He took off the correct bolts. The impeller seems stuck to the wear ring. It should have come out as a unit. He can now either try to pull the impeller w/driveshaft out of the wear ring, or unbolt the wear ring. But he will still need to separate the impeller from the wear ring.

It appears the 190, like the HO waverunners, also has a 2" spacer between the wear ring and transom housing. That can stay in.

-Greg

 

[AboveTheBest]

It seems to me the problem is about as bad as it could be with the given symptoms.

I pulled the correct four bolts and when I tried to take off the pump I ended up separating the bearings holding the impeller to the pump. So I tried to “press” it all back together by tightening the pump bolts back down, but came to a stop about an inch away from being seated.

Then I took off the bolts to the ring and it immediately came free of the impeller.
Now it appears the shaft is stuck in the bearing in between the impeller shaft and the engine shaft.

Anybody ever replace that bearing?

 

[SamCF]

Yeah that looks pretty bad. You are going to need to pull the wear ring and pump off and get it on the bench to get some better pictures. On a positive note, these parts aren't terribly expensive, and you already learned to pull the pump.

 

[boudin]

You won't be able to just put it back in. The shaft is pressed into a bearings in the pump and there are also two seals on that side. The shaft is now stuck at the splines in the intermediate shaft. Pull the five bolts on the wear ring and try to pry it out... four (4) 14mm and one (1) 10mm.

Squirt a bunch of penetrating oil into shaft hole, maybe with the bow of the boat lowered as much as you can. Let it sit overnight.

Is this a saltwater boat? Unusual for a freshwater boat to be stuck at the splines, unless it's been left in the water for long periods of time.

Doubtful unless you have the tools or a shop nearby it's going to be a quick fix.

-Greg

 

[AboveTheBest]

It’s a freshwater boat and is always drydocked (except for this week). I’ll try lowering the bow and squirting oil into the shaft.
My plan is to take off the bottom grate and beat the shaft out from the front. Maybe I can find someone local to press the pump housing and impeller back together, but then I need to figure out the problem with the bearing as it appears this was the part that failed.

 

[boudin]

Don't let it ruin your vacation or have your spouse mad at you for working on the boat all day... speaking from experience here.

Be careful trying to beat it out... with the splines stuck, you'll end up pulling the intermediate shaft through the intermediate housing, separating the PTO couplers.

Take a look on partzilla.com for a parts blow-up to get an idea of how it's put together.

-Greg

 

[AboveTheBest]

Good advice Greg, I’ll try to stop obsessing over it and deal with it when I get back home.

I’m pretty sure the problem lies somewhere in the intermediate housing. I’ll have to look at the diagram and figure out how many parts I need to order to get things operating correctly again.

 

[Bruce]

Anybody ever replace that bearing?

Yes, my change story is here https://jetboaters.net/threads/changing-yamaha-jet-boat-pump-duct-housing-bearings-and-switching-to-oil-bath-lubrication.10155/

 

[Bruce]

@AboveTheBest, the bearings at the back are cheap and easy to change. The one at the front is expensive and difficult. I would not do anything that risks that front bearing.

The bearings typically require a press or hammer to remove. I am guessing that they were already damaged and that your pump liner has swollen trapping the impeller.

 

[AboveTheBest]

Thanks @Bruce.

My guess is I’ll get a chance to replace all of the bearings pretty soon.

 

[swatski]

Thanks @Bruce.

My guess is I’ll get a chance to replace all of the bearings pretty soon.

Shoot!!!
Unbelievable...

Well, if you take the cone off - is there any evidence of water intrusion? I wonder if the o-ring on the cone failed?
If you have the L13, the o-ring transfers from the OEM cone, hope that was done.

This is terrible! (ruining your vacation!) But - relatively strait forward to fix, if you can get the parts and help pulling and pressing the bearings. @Bruce is an expert, he has done one a day before Bimini departure one year.

--

 

[swatski]

This is your stator segment, normally coming out with the impeller and the shaft
did you get the impeller and the shaft out? Or is it stuck? May need to pull the wear ring.
The wear ring has 4 big and one small bolts, the small one is easy to strip (when reinstalling). DOn't lose the small dovels, too - you see one in the pic, there are two per each interface.

 

[boudin]

Glad you decided to just enjoy your vacation. A few more questions if you have time, @AboveTheBest.

Look back at the diagram, part #20 and #21. That is a washer and retaining nut on the end of the driveshaft inside the cone, and when tightened makes it impossible to pull the shaft through the front the stator housing like yours did. So not only is the driveshaft pressed into the bearings (which have circlips to prevent them from moving), but that nut as well. Something happened in your stator housing.

Take some pics and post here... or if you want we can pick this up once you get back home next week, that is fine.

1. Remove the cone. Is the nut there laying there? Or is the nut on the end of the driveshaft that pulled through?
2. How freely do the two bearings spin. Are they seized? Are they even there?
3. Smell inside the cone and stator housing. Does it smell burned?
4. Was there grease in the cone?
5. Do you know if the pump has ever been rebuilt or taken off? Original impeller?

To fix, as others have said, the parts are not expensive, assuming there is no problem with your stator housing. You'll need new bearings, seals, an impeller removal sleeve/tool, a shop press, a vice, a big crescent wrench, and probably a torch to heat up the impeller threads. (Once you get the driveshaft/impeller out of the boat, it might be possible to press in the driveshaft with the impeller still on, though.)

Also, if you do plan to drive home with the impeller/driveshaft still in the boat, do your best to reassemble the pump, just so that the end of the driveshaft and impeller are not flopping around.

-Greg

 

[AboveTheBest]

I’ll pull the cone and see how everything looks. Currently the shaft is still stuck, but I will be removing it (somehow) prior to trailering the boat home.

I’ll get pictures of everything once I get it apart.

 

[SamCF]

Really need more pictures to see what happened. Try to diagnose before taking everything apart. I can't tell if the driveshaft is still in the pump. Did the impeller back off of the driveshaft? Is the impeller stuck in the wear ring or is the shaft seized?