The Vaccine

[Rumbo]

Reinfection Rates Among Patients Who Previously Tested Positive for Coronavirus Disease 2019: A Retrospective Cohort Study - PubMed

Prior infection in patients with COVID-19 was highly protective against reinfection and symptomatic disease. This protection increased over time, suggesting that viral shedding or ongoing immune response may persist beyond 90 days and may not represent true reinfection. As vaccine supply is...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I found this interesting...seems like a very low rate of re-infection and even a lower rate of symptomatic re-infection (0.35% of original positive patients).

“Conclusions: Prior infection in patients with COVID-19 was highly protective against reinfection and symptomatic disease. This protection increased over time, suggesting that viral shedding or ongoing immune response may persist beyond 90 days and may not represent true reinfection.”

So again, why the massive push for everyone to get the injection?

 

[Bruce]

Please explain the long term effects of taking the experimental injection ? Are the results finalized?

The mRNA vaccines completely wash out within a few days. All they leave behind is the knowledge needed to recognize and fight the virus.

DNA is permanent. RNA is transcribed from DNA to be translated into proteins. RNA is a temporary transcription that washes out. The RNA injected in the vaccine washes out just like RNA produced in your body.

For adults the vaccine studies were completed, peer reviewed and accepted by every major regulatory body in the world. Some studies continue in children primarily to determine appropriate dosing levels.

This is the publication of the Pfizer study that will be used for adult approval. I can post others if you would like to read them.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmoa2034577

I think he means, it was rushed and pushed out in less than 12 months, while most vaccines take years upon years with a ton more testing. I'd tend to lean with him, the vaccine is in a BETA stage at best.

Development of mRNA vaccines started before 1990. Development of coronavirus vaccines started in 2003 if not earlier in response to the SARS-CoV outbreak then continued for MERS. The SARS-CoV-2 vaccines arethe result of more than three decades of research. Having been delivered to hundreds of millions of people they certainly are not beta.

 

[Bruce]

@Rumbo am I understanding that you want people to contract CoVID to gain, likely lesser, natural immunity instead of taking the vaccine.

Do you really feel that the deaths and permanent illness that would occur would be reasonable?

 

[adrianp89]

@Rumbo am I understanding that you want people to contract CoVID to gain, likely lesser, natural immunity instead of taking the vaccine.

Do you really feel that the deaths and permanent illness that would occur would be reasonable?

Sift through the media BS of trying to find the truth and you will find multiple studies disproving this. Here is a recent one:

Longitudinal analysis shows durable and broad immune memory after SARS-CoV-2 infection with persisting antibody responses and memory B and T cells

Cohen et al. evaluate immune responses longitudinally in 254 COVID-19 patients over 8 months. SARS-CoV-2-specific binding and neutralizing antibodies exhibit biphasic decay, suggesting long-lived plasma cell generation. Memory B cells remain stable; CD4 and CD8 memory T cells are polyfunctional...

www.cell.com

 

[crazy4life]

Here's an interview I did which some might be interested in.

Everyone watch this interview from 1 hr 40 min mark to the 2 hour mark. I promise you will be enlightened. Remember this man invented the MRNA technology.
Please don't come back here and try to disparage this man ( you know who you are). I think he knows more about the subject then anyone here.
I watched the entire interview and its really drills down in to the truth from the 1 hr 40 minute mark till the end.

After watching you can make your own decision on what to believe.

 

[scbruet]

Reinfection Rates Among Patients Who Previously Tested Positive for Coronavirus Disease 2019: A Retrospective Cohort Study - PubMed

Prior infection in patients with COVID-19 was highly protective against reinfection and symptomatic disease. This protection increased over time, suggesting that viral shedding or ongoing immune response may persist beyond 90 days and may not represent true reinfection. As vaccine supply is...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I found this interesting...seems like a very low rate of re-infection and even a lower rate of symptomatic re-infection (0.35% of original positive patients).

“Conclusions: Prior infection in patients with COVID-19 was highly protective against reinfection and symptomatic disease. This protection increased over time, suggesting that viral shedding or ongoing immune response may persist beyond 90 days and may not represent true reinfection.”

So again, why the massive push for everyone to get the injection?

Sift through the media BS of trying to find the truth and you will find multiple studies disproving this. Here is a recent one:

Longitudinal analysis shows durable and broad immune memory after SARS-CoV-2 infection with persisting antibody responses and memory B and T cells

Cohen et al. evaluate immune responses longitudinally in 254 COVID-19 patients over 8 months. SARS-CoV-2-specific binding and neutralizing antibodies exhibit biphasic decay, suggesting long-lived plasma cell generation. Memory B cells remain stable; CD4 and CD8 memory T cells are polyfunctional...

www.cell.com

Of course you have some immunity after covid. Thats how the immune system works. Why do you want to get covid though?

 

[Bruce]

Sift through the media BS of trying to find the truth and you will find multiple studies disproving this. Here is a recent one:

Longitudinal analysis shows durable and broad immune memory after SARS-CoV-2 infection with persisting antibody responses and memory B and T cells

Cohen et al. evaluate immune responses longitudinally in 254 COVID-19 patients over 8 months. SARS-CoV-2-specific binding and neutralizing antibodies exhibit biphasic decay, suggesting long-lived plasma cell generation. Memory B cells remain stable; CD4 and CD8 memory T cells are polyfunctional...

www.cell.com

The relevant issue is not how long that immunity persists after illness with SARS-CoV-2 but that the antibodies formed to that infection may be more variant specific than those formed from vaccination.

Although the greater concern is that exposing humans to SARS-CoV-2 to develop herd immunity would result in death or permanent illness for many. From this perspective vaccination clearly is better than contracting the virus.

 

[swatski]

Here's an interview I did which some might be interested in.

Most of these claims are misleading and many are downright false.

Of course, like every effective spam, often contain a nugget of truth; causing perennial conundrum for the fact checker, and endless opportunities for those who just seek to sow chaos and disinformation.

This dude did not invent mRNA vaccines, BTW, it's a laughable claim. He contributed a paper.

--

 

[Rumbo]

@Rumbo am I understanding that you want people to contract CoVID to gain, likely lesser, natural immunity instead of taking the vaccine.

Do you really feel that the deaths and permanent illness that would occur would be reasonable?

Maybe I didn’t specify my thought clearly enough....why the push for people who have already been infective with and recovered from the virus to be injected? There is very broad and strong evidence that shows that strong natural immunity caused by recovering from the virus including protection against new strains though crossover and T-cell immunity.

I never once said or even remotely insinuated that someone should go out and get infected to become immune. It is a massive misrepresentation of those questioning universally injecting people with mRNA to claim that we think that people should get infected and die. There is middle ground in there. Some people should get it and I’ve never once said they shouldn’t. It’s not my job nor anyone else’s to tell you what is best for your situation. And stop discounting natural immunity in those who have recovered from the virus.

 

[AZMark]

Everyone watch this interview from 1 hr 40 min mark to the 2 hour mark. I promise you will be enlightened. Remember this man invented the MRNA technology.
Please don't come back here and try to disparage this man ( you know who you are). I think he knows more about the subject then anyone here.
I watched the entire interview and its really drills down in to the truth from the 1 hr 40 minute mark till the end.

After watching you can make your own decision on what to believe.

I watched it and I don't understand what "truth" you found in this segment. That there are unknown risks to the vaccines? I don't think that's a secret.

He also says he had both long covid and has gotten the vaccine and had some adverse reactions. He goes on to recommend which vaccine he thinks you should get if needed (pfizer).

DId you come away from this thinking no one should get vaccinated?

 

[mwalker4]

Most of these claims are misleading and many are downright false.

Of course, like every effective spam, often contain a nugget of truth; causing perennial conundrum for the fact checker, and endless opportunities for those who just seek to sow chaos and disinformation.

This dude did not invent mRNA vaccines, BTW, it's a laughable claim. He contributed a paper.

--

I wish instead of an unchallenged interview or press releases, we could see a discussion / debate where people have to defend their claims real-time. I listened to the interview and was concerned. Then I followed it up with some study of the claims he made and ended up thinking that the interview was misleading at best. Once I looked into his claim of inventing the internet (wait that was Al Gore), all his other claims becomes suspect. But it sure makes for a good headline.

 

[Rumbo]

I can’t find any data, likely because it hasn’t been studied yet but has anyone heard of recovered patients being infected by the delta variant? Yet there are thousands upon thousands of breakthrough cases of people being infected with the delta variant who have had the mRNA injection. So is it really plausible to believe that mRNA injections provide better protection from variants than those who have ALREADY been infected and recovered from the virus? Maybe it is ??‍, the data is hard to find.

 

[tabbibus]

And stop discounting natural immunity in those who have recovered from the virus.

Tell that to the couple of ICU patients that I know of currently dealing with round 2!

 

[tabbibus]

I can’t find any data, likely because it hasn’t been studied yet but has anyone heard of recovered patients being infected by the delta variant? Yet there are thousands upon thousands of breakthrough cases of people being infected with the delta variant who have had the mRNA injection. So is it really plausible to believe that mRNA injections provide better protection from variants than those who have ALREADY been infected and recovered from the virus? Maybe it is ??‍, the data is hard to find.

Sorry, didn't read whole thread before replying. I have no robust data. Just personal anecdotal data.

- Number of vaccinated people in the ICU in this new wave= 2. Both had certain conditions that basically made it so they had no immune system
- Number of non vax ICU patients = 10 and counting at this very moment. (number is higher if I add the ones that died in the last month)
- Number of non vax, previously infected ICU patients = 2.

So based on this very limited cross sectional cohort, if you are vaxed you will not end up severely sick (unless you don't have the capacity to mount antibodies, which essentially renders you unvaxed). If you are not vaccinated and you already had covid, you still can end up in the ICU. If you are not vaccinated and have zero immunity, high chance delta will screw you up.

Oh, btw, avg age of ICU covid patients? 45. Let that sink in. 45!

 

[HangOutdoors]

I can’t find any data, likely because it hasn’t been studied yet but has anyone heard of recovered patients being infected by the delta variant? Yet there are thousands upon thousands of breakthrough cases of people being infected with the delta variant who have had the mRNA injection. So is it really plausible to believe that mRNA injections provide better protection from variants than those who have ALREADY been infected and recovered from the virus? Maybe it is ??‍, the data is hard to find.

I don't have data per say. I speak with several of the Doctors up at Beaumont Hospital on a regular basis where I used to work and they indicated that they have received patients with the delta variant whom previously have been infected. As far as numbers I don't have that. The majority of their cases, which they indicated, are greater than 90% are the unvaccinated and some are previously infected. FWIW

 

[Robconn]

When you give your consent that your spouse is a DNR/ DNI status and you have small children. I Can’t say enough. The fact that covid is affecting younger people it’s inevitable. Then I’m brought back to previous conversation on this thread that they were not raising cowards.

 

[tabbibus]

When you give your consent that your spouse is a DNR/ DNI status and you have small children. I Can’t say enough.

Oh man. Yes. These break my heart.

 

[Rumbo]

Sorry, didn't read whole thread before replying. I have no robust data. Just personal anecdotal data.

- Number of vaccinated people in the ICU in this new wave= 2. Both had certain conditions that basically made it so they had no immune system
- Number of non vax ICU patients = 10 and counting at this very moment. (number is higher if I add the ones that died in the last month)
- Number of non vax, previously infected ICU patients = 2.

So based on this very limited cross sectional cohort, if you are vaxed you will not end up severely sick (unless you don't have the capacity to mount antibodies, which essentially renders you unvaxed). If you are not vaccinated and you already had covid, you still can end up in the ICU. If you are not vaccinated and have zero immunity, high chance delta will screw you up.

Oh, btw, avg age of ICU covid patients? 45. Let that sink in. 45!

I don't have data per say. I speak with several of the Doctors up at Beaumont Hospital on a regular basis where I used to work and they indicated that they have received patients with the delta variant whom previously have been infected. As far as numbers I don't have that. The majority of their cases, which they indicated, are greater than 90% are the unvaccinated and some are previously infected. FWIW

Thank you for the info. Though it’s a limited cross sections as you said I think that info like this is what people need to make decisions.

 

[tabbibus]

Thank you for the info. Though it’s a limited cross sections as you said I think that info like this is what people need to make decisions.

You know, I wish we could share more of this info, and more details about it. Due to patient privacy this is already skirting what is allowed. But I think more details and more real stories can drive the point across more than cold numbers. It is just how we humans work I think.

 

[crazy4life]

I watched it and I don't understand what "truth" you found in this segment. That there are unknown risks to the vaccines? I don't think that's a secret.

He also says he had both long covid and has gotten the vaccine and had some adverse reactions. He goes on to recommend which vaccine he thinks you should get if needed (pfizer).

DId you come away from this thinking no one should get vaccinated?

Nope. Just thought it was enlightening.
That's the problem with people today they jump to conclusions based on their own bias.
Never said don't get the vaccine (matter of fact I said to get the vaccine in this thread over ten times and capitalized it 5 times) but don't let the truth get in the way.
By the way there are people in hear that say the vaccine is perfectly safe so maybe you should explain the risks to them.