Trim Tabs - options - wake surfing (and cruising)

[2nazt]

I would just believe that eash side button moves the indicated tab separately so you could push the left side to raise lower right tab and same for right side to operate left tab. (Not to be rude if you know the normal tab operations are actually opposit of the button you push. Some people do not know that. But the wiring and programming indicates you can change that if needed)

I know what assuming does but the up and down would just move tabs together . If it syncs them up I do not know or if it would operate them at a different height but move them together, you may have to call and ask those details. @Bruce may know how the up and down work, he has the auto but his also has manual up and down. I'm sure he will chime in on how it operates.

I only have independent controls on my boat.

 

[Bruce]

Both models (SETR-61 and MLC-1) have auto-retract, that is a must-have.
Regarding controllers, I like the MLC-1 better I think. But it is newer w/not a whole lot info out there, and I have some questions:
Q: To move a tab up and down -- how is it done with a single button in MLC-1?
Does the tab move all the way before reversing directions?
Do the (side) buttons in MLC-1 toggle?
Does a side tab move both tabs simultaneously (one up, the other one down)?

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I have the Mente Marine ACS RP. I believe the Lectrotab ALC and MLC are based on the ACS.

My experience is that the single bow down button increases trim on both tabs, you can decrease the trim at any time by pressing the bow up button, the side buttons increase trim on whichever side is pressed, the side buttons do not move anything up they simply increase trim on that side.

I find the controls easy to use.

How much is the MLC-1?

Assuming it is less than half the price of the ALC / ACS I would go with the MLC-1.

 

[swatski]

@Bruce email sent
@2nazt It is not quite like that. Here is how Dan describes it:

"As far as the MLC-1 and how it operates is as follows. When you press the top “bow down” button, both tabs deploy simultaneously. When the bottom “bow up” button is presses, both tabs retract simultaneously. When the right “stbd bow down” button is pressed, it will first retract the starboard tab to reduce the lift on that side. If this lift reduction is enough to balance the boat, the stbd tab retraction will stop. If the lift reduction is not enough, the right tab will fully retract and immediately begin deploying the port tab to increase lift on that side to push the starboard side down. If the bow is riding a little high once the roll is corrected, you can press the top button to bring the bow down and still maintain level from side to side. I have this on my boat and works really well.

You also have the option of the SETR-61 which will independently control each tab. The MLC we refer to as “semi-automatic” since it will reduce the lift whereas the SETR-61 you have to remember to bring the tab up to reduce lift if the tabs are close to fully deployed but still requires roll correction."

One must-have design feature with this trim/tab setup is to be able to list the boat to one side (or the other) ON PURPOSE. While this is counter-intuitive to most boaters, who seek the opposite, LOL, forced listing would help in tuning those boats up for wake surfing. So, independent tab operation, or at least the ability to list the boat is essential (overriding the semi-automatic self-leveling mechanisms). Otherwise, we may be compelled to go with the manual controller (SETR-61).


EDIT: just to clarify (about MLC-1 function), I asked some more questions:

Q: If the right "stbd bow down" button is pressed continuously, will the right tab fully retract and the port tab fully deploy to push the starboard side of the boat down? (regardless of the actual boat attitude). In other words, can I (manually) force the boat to list, without reprogramming the controlled etc. ?

A: Yes, you can manually do this to create an out of balance.

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[swatski]

And here is one other option. Sounds awesome, but the speed limit is a no-go.

"I do have one other possible option. We are testing a wake surfing control where you can set the tabs manually and save two settings. One for right wake and one for left wake. You can still adjust the tabs manually but is made for wake surfing. It only operates below 15 mph, which may be a problem. Just let me know if you are interested in this one."

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[swatski]

After some additional discussions with Dan, we went ahead and placed the order for the tabs w/ MLC-1, which is basically their semi-automatic controller.

Here is some remaining info on how MLC-1 works (addressing the concern if MLC-1 can operate the tabs independently -- side-to-side -- for surfing, when listing the boat is deliberate). I think it should be perfect, how it works.

For example:
With both tabs fully retracted (up)
If you press the right "stbd down" button -- the port tab will start deploying
If you then press the left "port down" button -- the port tab will retract
If you then keep pressing the "port down" button (and the port tab fully retracts) -- the stbd tab will start deploying

Importantly, once the roll/list is what you want, you can still press the "top" or "bottom" button to bring the bow down or up (adjusting the attitude) -- while maintaining level from side to side.

That should be AWESOME.

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[jcyamaharider]

Ready to see this in action!

 

[swatski]

Ready to see this in action!

They'll take about two weeks to manufacture. And then it needs to stop snowing.

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[Bruce]

They'll take about two weeks to manufacture. And then it needs to stop snowing.

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Once they are installed I think @jcyamaharider should be the first to test the surf wake regardless of the quantity of snow.

 

[2nazt]

Bring the boat to FL to install and test!

 

[bobbie]

@swatski i can't wait until you are able to go to the amazing Pacific Northwest to add this mod to our boat! @jcyamaharider will vouch for our hospitality!

 

[jcyamaharider]

Yeah, I wish we could make it out there this year to visit, but that is the good thing about friends, they will be around for awhile.

 

[swatski]

Here are the tab raw materials, and how the Lectrotab hinges work. I'll post CAD drawings when we get those.


And here is the other side, which will be the bottom in our install. This way the hinge only folds less than 90degrees before stopping.


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[Glen]

Noticed today that the Tige surf boat has a 90 degree bend, at the end of the tab, into the flow of water. Must be designed to create disturbance.

@swatski
Noticed also that the tab is larger on the outside.

Also has one in the center as well.

 

[swatski]

@Glen I love it!
I did notice what you are seeing. I also noticed a tendency for the attachment points of actuators to migrate towards the swim platform - kind of reminiscent of the situation and angles we must use in our boats. So, that's encouraging. It is hard to know though what is real and could potentially work in our boats, vs just novelty in this very crowded field right now.

I am still thinking with our boats the jet/white wash plays as a major limiting factor (in generating a surfable wave). Have been thinking a lot about your earlier suggestion of using a wedge shaped device Velcro-ed on top of the nozzles to deflect the white wash (for example using a little whale-tail extension or something). There is plenty of room along the bottom of the swim platform profile, so that would render itself to a very nice install.

I must admit, had a good chuckle looking at your pics. Last night I started getting worried I'll be escorted out of the boat show when I got a bunch of weird looks for crawling under the sterns... LOL. So glad I'm not the only person checking out wake boats' rear ends at boat shows.

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[Mainah]

@Glen I love it!
..... So glad I'm not the only person checking out wake boats' rear ends at boat shows.

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Probably safer than checking out the rear ends in yoga pants if your wife was with you.

 

[Glen]

View attachment 50492 View attachment 50490 View attachment 50489 View attachment 50488 View attachment 50487 Noticed today that the Tige surf boat has a 90 degree bend, at the end of the tab, into the flow of water. Must be designed to create disturbance.

@swatski
Noticed also that the tab is larger on the outside.

Also has one in the center as well.

What also seems surprising is that those 3 actuators are putting all that downward force from a swim platform that appears to be secured to the hull, with just 12 bolts.

Ours has a much better platform/construction to work from.

Agree, we must knock down the jet wash and with you, still likening the wedge concept...

Won't be working on it today...

 

[swatski]

I will be (finally) mounting the tabs, it's been so hard to find time.

I must say, just on raw materials and finish, are high quality products and those weigh a ton. All custom cuts/dimensions. Lectrotab team has been about as responsive and helpful as any vendor you would ever meet.

Some of their proprietary features are brilliant, such as this pressure equalizing conduit that prevents the electromechanical actuator from sucking in water over time:


Now I'm just itching to mount those and go testing!




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[Bruce]

@swatski, I remember those days! You are about to do a lot of drilling.

We will all be anxiously awaiting your report on their performance.

 

[swatski]

Yes Sir, @Bruce! I may start a new install thread to properly link to your install, thank you for paving the way, I am (so far) 100% convinced that this is the right path/vendor.

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[swatski]

So, I managed to mock everything up today, and dry run the tabs/actuators -- all clear. I think I'll try to shoot a video of the semi-auto controller operation (once everything is in place and working) as it seems to be a very neat feature of this system.

Boy, this install is going to be an incredibly tight fit. Those transoms have very little of any strait-running or flat-surface/edge of anything, it is almost impossible to design good-sized working tabs... At the end, I'll be within 1/2" of transom straps with the plates' edges, and the actuators will attach (under the swim deck) barely 1/4" ahead of the transom-eyes (U-bolts)-axis (so as to still permit the Wake Wedge install if desired)...

I am happy all my calculations appear to be (so far) holding true. But, there is close to zero room for errors with this install!

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