alternate side force stabilizers for the Ultimate steering system on the late model nozzles

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

This is the alternate bracket setup for Cobra Ultimate steering system on the late model nozzles. There are some for the 19 foot boats that have a keel. Those allow you to install the rudder attachment on the nozzle when you remove the rudder to access the side thrust unit during install.
This makes it convenient to simply install the 10 mm double ended bolt into the rudder attachment and then turn it up from the bottom through the nozzle boss and the new bracket , place a washer on and then a 10mm nut, tighten it all down and it's finished.

On the non rudder setups you install a 10 mm bolt from the bottom through the boss and then through the bracket, place the washer on and then the 10 mm nut tighten it all down and finished.

The original base would have been removed and the stand off from the nozzle would be installed with the other install for the side thruster.
So if you really need to play around with the new side thruster and you would not want to give up all the steering you get from Cobra jet system now you can. We did this to free up the bottom nozzle bolt to accommodate this.
However I would once again say the viper is a very good system for the 19 foot boats with the rudders, Steering at all speeds planning surface for better hole shot more stable hull in rough water, and slower planning speeds, with the fangs built in to one very simple to install system.
Also for the other setups the Mega Fangs are serious when it comes to enhancing the reverse steering, reverse thrust, the power steering and the regular steering for a very reasonable price and they mount on the existing side force stabilizer of the ultimate steering systems, but it's a free country and we always offer you the absolute most in available options to improve your boating so why change now.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

And don't forget the Mega Fangs are compatible with the thrust vector xv steering so if you want some serious improvement with all aspects of that system INCLUDING REVERSE then perhaps you should try the Mega Fangs and save money while you're at it. First one to try and post their results gets 50 percent off.

Note depending on how quickly I can get to forming the mega fangs that I just picked up I have only one set for the magnum A K steering on hand currently.
I do have 100 more but they need to be processed, since we have some bad weather rolling in I hope to have those ready for sale pretty soon since it won't be so hot out in my shop behind the nursing home.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

OK so today I worked on some mega fangs I now have ample inventory so lets do a real upgrade to the thrust vector X V and add a twin engine set complete for 219.98 and half price to the first one who posts a review .

 

[Foobar]

I will be adding my own modification to see how it works. I am going to change one of the bolts on the fins to a nylon bolt. The theory is if I ever hit something, the bolt would break allowing the fin to pivot up and not damage the nozzle. Have you ever tested this idea? Wondering if the nylon bolt would break or wear under normal use.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

What on earth has the magnum a k steering system that you have got to do with an alternate side force stabilizer for the Ultimate steering?????? two separate animals.
As far as your plastic bolt on the magnum A K steering idea don't do it! It won't work, it will fatigue and break .
The bolt and bracket support the side forces of the fin at speed , the bracket is designed to allow the fin to move up if you strike something like a rock or stump without allowing it to go too far up and become locked up. There is no record of anyone having a nozzle broken or damaged from my magnum A K system , so my advice is do not modify the system with plastic bolts as those will break and allow the fin to go up too far.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

For the record My magnum A K steering system is compatible with the side thrusters just as it is sold, the Ultimate steering is not compatible with the side thrusters but I now have a simple modification for the Ultimate steering that allows you to add the side thrusters to your ultimate steering if your boat has the newer style nozzles with the threaded boss on the end .
I am doing this as a convenience to those who wanted to experiment with both systems. Once again it is my honest opinion that people with my systems enjoy all the benefits of having that full range of control.
I also state that it is my opinion that adding the Mega Fang system to your existing Cobra steering is a better and more cost effective way to enhance all the steering features including reverse.
I also believe you should have a choice of systems if you so desire.
That being said I also offer the mega fang system to people with the thrust vector xv systems as an alternative to the side thrusters as the mega fangs do a lot more to help in several areas not just reverse. Note Mega Fangs are not compatible with the 19 foot rudder equipped boats period! Hopefully there is no confusion but you are always welcome to contact me directly if you have any questions.

 

[swatski]

I will be adding my own modification to see how it works. I am going to change one of the bolts on the fins to a nylon bolt. The theory is if I ever hit something, the bolt would break allowing the fin to pivot up and not damage the nozzle. Have you ever tested this idea? Wondering if the nylon bolt would break or wear under normal use.

Here is my 0.02. I don't know much, but I boat in a very shallow river and am constantly concerned with hitting things. I have sucked a few things from the bottom a few times causing damage to the impellers but have (thank God) never had an issue hitting the fins, at least when moving forward.

I posted some video clips of passing through some shallow parts - so I'm not bs-ing anyone here.

The way I see it when I look under the boat, the CObras - AKs or Ultimates - are sitting good 6-12 inches ABOVE the keel/bottom of the boat, articulating keel, whatever you want to call that thing - the bottom of the hull in new yammies (even when the fins are set all the way down). So when moving forward, there the chances of hitting something with the fins (without hitting it with the hull/keel) would appear to be vanishingly low. And that is consistent with my experience running shallow.

On the other hand, it is possible to bend the fins, actually both Cobras and TVs, when backing up. In that kind of scenario the fins can get damaged, but I believe both vendors provide a fix or replacement, I know that Jeff will do it very inexpensively and he has very fast turn around times.

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[Foobar]

I am not concerned with damaging the fins. I am concerned about the nozzles and pump housings.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

No reason to be concerned about that!
Any impact with an object that could possibly damage a nozzle or pump and the pump would be like nearly impossible to damage would do the damage fins or no fins those would not be a contributing factor. Remember this is not my first year or my first decade of selling and designing steering for jet boats Yamaha jet boats or other jet propelled watercraft. And here is a good example https://jetboaters.net/threads/sank-my-boat.7567/ tore the boat to hell but the pumps were still intact the rudder was ripped off the hull .

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

Go out with a baseball bat and swing as hard as you can at a fin striking it directly at the leading edge watch it move up and watch the bracket bend because it is sacrificial if you want to prove it to yourself then remove the bracket straighten it back to it's original shape and reinstall it if you need convincing . If you destroy the bracket and you can not repair it I will give you a new one for free just video this test and then honestly tell me WHO put that idea in your head in the first place. Sound like a plan .

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

https://jetboaters.net/threads/cobra-jet-viper.13241/#post-235226 Here is a thread where a cobra Viper was driven into a fish trap stone wall similar to if not the same one hit by the 24 foot boat not only did it not rip off the pump or nozzle but it was repairable.

 

[Foobar]

No reason to be concerned about that!
Any impact with an object that could possibly damage a nozzle or pump and the pump would be like nearly impossible to damage would do the damage fins or no fins those would not be a contributing factor. Remember this is not my first year or my first decade of selling and designing steering for jet boats Yamaha jet boats or other jet propelled watercraft. And here is a good example https://jetboaters.net/threads/sank-my-boat.7567/ tore the boat to hell but the pumps were still intact the rudder was ripped off the hull .

Jeff, I am sure that you do not mean it, but this is rather condescending. It borders on insulting. I know you have a lot of experience with this, that is why I asked you. I understand that your products are probably on thousands of applications. I too have a product that is on hundreds of thousands of applications. I too get all sorts of feedback and I have learned that not everyone is calling my baby ugly.

I have found the following categories useful when addressing a potential problem with my products. I would venture to guess they would also apply to your products.

- impossible
- remote
- unlikely
- possible
- likely
- imminent

As I see it, your Magnum AK system is probably on the high end of unlikely. One of your systems that lifts at speed I would consider the probability as remote. I see it this way because I have read feedback about someone having a strike or malfunction resulting in broken parts. I also just sat there at looked at how it does hang below the hull. The keel would absorb a direct strike, but if something was hit at an unfortunate angle, the fin would absorb that strike.

I understand the parts are designed to give, but aluminum is pretty strong. The nozzles are also made of aluminum. You have two metals of equal strength and , just by eyeballing it, close to the same thickness. I think that introducing a nylon bolt as a break point at the pivot would move the probability of severe damage to the remote category. This is of course if the nylon bolt would hold and not break during normal operation.

So I am not trying to infer something bad about these fins. I am asking if this could be an improvement regarding safety. Me performing these tests and providing you with results and feedback helps you and this product. I don't know why you get all upset about it.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

I answered your question I showed you some evidence about your concern and I made you an offer to test it I have bent over backward that is all I can do.

 

[Foobar]

Asking to me go outside with a baseball bat and a video camera is not an offer.

I have seen nylon bolts used as break points on other applications on boats. They work just fine under normal operation and do not sheer. I asked if you have tried it.

I am just not going to comment or share anymore.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

ok as you wish, I can promise you it is a non problem so there is no reason to fix it, Most people live in a world where perception is confused for reality. Like your Allen cap bolts for instance, I used that years ago and changed to button caps for a reason I did not bother to address it because it would not cause any harm. I have so many designs maybe I have another Mack Daddy one on the shelf but I have no desire to discuss it. See the roadway to hell is paved with good intentions and I really am a shoot from the hip person, That is just the way it is I have no plans on changing, now in the past you called me with questions and I always answered them up front. if you really wanted to know if the plastic bolt thing was a good idea or an option and you did not want me to answer on the board then perhaps you should have asked it privately. In any case I yam what I yam and that's all that I yam. I'm Jeff from cobra jet steering llc.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

So unfortunately this thread about my newest side force stabilizer for the Ultimate steering was derailed .
I will deal with that as soon as I do a for the record post to rectify inaccurate information that pertains to my magnum A K steering.
I would first like to invite anyone who would have had any nozzle damage or Pump damage that they believe was caused by the Magnum A K steering after striking a rock , stump or other fixed object that they really feel would not have occurred anyway if not for the steering.
I always thoroughly analyze any reports of damage from any of my customers who believes they had an issue with any of my steering systems, 99 percent of the time it is usually an improper installation issue with the requirement of thread locking compound and it's proper use on a bottom nozzle bolt.
I include several statements advising people to use thread locking compound on the bottom bolt when it comes into play during an install.
The Magnum A K system itself does not use the bottom bolt however the mega fangs do and I make sure people know the application of thread locking compound is vitally important to prevent the bolt from working loose and falling out. The fact that so many people have and use my steering systems year after year should prove that if it is installed properly it has no issues and it does what I say it does.
The first indicator that a bolt fell out is the evidence that the bottom bolt is not still attached to the inner nozzle like the top bolt is, the next indicator is that the bottom part of the nozzle that the bolt passes through is not damaged but the top one is broken, If that is the case the nozzle will break when the boat is placed in reverse as the reverse bucket redirects the water to exit under the nozzle rather than out the rear of the nozzle, when sufficient throttle is applied the nozzle being held on with just the top bolt will break off at that bolt due to the pump force pushing against the reverse bucket.
I point out that the steering did not cause the failure the improper installation did that and in most cases my customers are very honest about the failure to use thread locking compound as directed. To go one step further the boat would have been being used with just the top bolt holding the nozzle for a while and only when it was placed in reverse and the throttle was applied did the nozzle fail. On top of that I have read one report on this site where a person had the bolt fall out but the nozzle never did fail and I told that person to go buy a lottery ticket.
Another person here stated that his thread locking compound was over 20 years old and that it still held for around 25 hours of use before the bolt fell out. And this was a viper not a magnum A K system, the only incident I am aware of a Magnum A k system being damaged by an impact resulted from an auto accident where the boat was hit from behind while being towed..
Next is the parts and how they serve several functions. The bracket attached to the nozzle going to the fin serves as an adjustment bracket allowing you to choose the fin setting of your choice, it also serves as a side force stabilizer, since my steering is at play at speed and the fin is very effective in controlling the boats position at all speeds this requires a bracket to stabilize the fin when it has side forces being applied to it. Otherwise the fin would eventually bend both ways depending on the forces direction and we know what happens if you continue to bend a piece of tempered aluminum back and forth, it fatigues and breaks.
Now this part also serves as a restrictor in the event that a fin strikes an object at speed , it is important for that fin to be able to rise up on impact but not too far as that can cause the fin to get tangled in the swim platform or lock up the steering.
That means the fin and bracket must stay connected if that situation ever occurred.
The bracket must withstand occasional mild contact and several modifications to this bracket have occurred over the past few years to improve it's versatility and function.
The fins themselves are attached to the nozzle by the reverse bucket attachment, the bolts were intentionally made longer to reinforce the nozzle to handle the work load and this has been very successful, the bolts attaching the fins are button cap bolts the instructions advise you not to over tighten these bolts , to just snug them up, There is a reason for this advice, in order for the fins to pivot up on contact they need to be able to move fairly easily, over tightening the bolts makes their movement more difficult and requires more force or a stronger impact to accomplish this function.
Snugging the bolts as directed would not harm the button cap bolts , but over tightening them could . One more issue id bolt head clearance between the nozzle and the anode on the left side of the pump, Allen bolts often strike the anode when turning a full turn.
Now one more important item about the fins , they have adjustment holes everyone knows what they do , right? well not all the functions are obvious the holes also serve a second function, In the event that someone hits a solid object during a turn striking the fins the holes serve as a breaking point to allow the fin to bend and absorb the impact better, again becoming a sacrificial part if the situation arises. So the magnum A K system uses parts that have several functions all designed with getting the job done correctly. While protecting the factory parts .

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

haa so I do not own a baseball bat but I do own a 2 by 4 I wish I had a bat but this did the job just fine, I only mounted the pump forcing cone with 2 of the normal 4 bolts and the sun was pretty strong so I had to put a beach umbrella up to be able to see this on video or it would have been full of glare. But it was fun any way, I mounted it upside down to get a good swing at the fin hit it as hard as I could 3 times and the bracket gave in as it is supposed to with ZERO harm to any of the other parts not even the fin.

I attached a picture of the bracket that was the only damage

 

[swatski]

haa so I do not own a baseball bat but I do own a 2 by 4 I wish I had a bat but this did the job just fine, I only mounted the pump forcing cone with 2 of the normal 4 bolts and the sun was pretty strong so I had to put a beach umbrella up to be able to see this on video or it would have been full of glare. But it was fun any way, I mounted it upside down to get a good swing at the fin hit it as hard as I could 3 times and the bracket gave in as it is supposed to with ZERO harm to any of the other parts not even the fin.

ROTF

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[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

Ok young fella what the heck does that mean ROTF no one here in the nursing home knows either

 

[swatski]

Ok young fella what the heck does that mean ROTF no one here in the nursing home knows either

rolling on the floor
I think. THat's what I meant anyway.

But in all seriousness, I think this is a pretty convincing test, while hilarious.

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