The Vaccine

[Bruce]

@haknslash you seem to be obsessed with ivermectin perhaps with a focus on convincing the world that it is a human drug not a veterinary drug.

Many FDA approved drugs are also prescribed for animals. Some are available over the counter.

In 2019 132,000 Americans were taking prescribed ivermectin. The most common human use of ivermectin is to kill bed bugs that later feed on the human.

The most common use of ivermectin is in worming products for a wide variety of animals. Heartgard Plus is one that many of us have likely given to dogs. My largest experience with ivermectin is with worming cattle but it also is used for horses, sheep and many other veterinary purposes.

Perhaps it would be better to describe ivermectin as a drug approved by the FDA for human use in certain formations but mainly used in veterinary applications. However how it is described does not change that is unreasonable to take ivermectin for SARS-CoV-2 outside of clinical studies and unfortunately many are self treating with veterinary products.

This is a well rounded article on ivermectin

Ivermectin sales surge at pharmacies, feed stores despite inconclusive studies on effectiveness against COVID-19 - The Dispatch

In his book, “Summer of ‘49,” David Halberstam told the story of Boston Red Sox manager Joe McCarthy’s efforts to reform a talented, but troubled pitcher whose drinking binges made him unreliable.

cdispatch.com

This provides historical prescribing level data

Ivermectin - Drug Usage Statistics, ClinCalc DrugStats Database

Ivermectin drug usage statistics for the United States (2013 - 2022). Statistics include drug synonyms and therapeutic classes, including: Ivermectin, Sklice, Soolantra, Stromectol, Antiparasitic, Pediculicide.

clincalc.com

The FDA approval of ivermectin (STROMECTOL) is to treat Strongyloidiasis of the intestinal tract and onchocerciasis due to the nematode parasite Onchocerca volvulus. The FDA label is available at https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2008/050742s022lbl.pdf

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

@crazy4life, actually I'm getting tired of you repeated saying that someone who doesn't agree with your point of view is dulsional. If you have something to say, just go ahead and say it.

I likely know as much about of the pricing of drugs and drug advertising as you. First off, 75 cents of every advertising dollar is NOT spent by the pharmaceutical industry. This is a ridiculous thing to say. U.S. advertising is estimated at $240 billion a year. Quite honestly, I do not know the advertising budget of the pharmaceutical industry. So let's use your number of $6.5 billion. Using your number, pharma ads would make up 2.7 cents of every advertising dollar, no where near 75 cents per dollar.

Let's be clear, I do not work for Pharma, never will, and have no financial interest in the Pharma Industry. I have dedicated my entire career to public service.

Again, I want to state that in this post I am speaking as a private citizen.

Crazy as you might think this sounds, I actually agree with you on drug pricing. I have travelled all over the world for work, and it pisses me off that that here in America, we (as a society in whole) pay some of the highest drug prices in the world. It also pisses me off the Medicare cannot negotiate drug prices. If you want a change in this law, write to your representative and tell him/her to support H.R.3 - Elijah E. Cummings Lower Drug Costs Now Act, that would require the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) to negotiate prices for certain drugs. Trying to keep this non-political, I would add that if anyone wants the federal government to not have the ability to negotiate Medicare drug prices, please write to your representative and tell him/her to not support H.R.3

Jim

 

[crazy4life]

@crazy4life, actually I'm getting tired of you repeated saying that someone who doesn't agree with your point of view is dulsional. If you have something to say, just go ahead and say it.

I likely know as much about of the pricing of drugs and drug advertising as you. First off, 75 cents of every advertising dollar is NOT spent by the pharmaceutical industry. This is a ridiculous thing to say. U.S. advertising is estimated at $240 billion a year. Quite honestly, I do not know the advertising budget of the pharmaceutical industry. So let's use your number of $6.5 billion. Using your number, pharma ads would make up 2.7 cents of every advertising dollar, no where near 75 cents per dollar.

Let's be clear, I do not work for Pharma, never will, and have no financial interest in the Pharma Industry. I have dedicated my entire career to public service.

Again, I want to state that in this post I am speaking as a private citizen.

Crazy as you might think this sounds, I actually agree with you on drug pricing. I have travelled all over the world for work, and it pisses me off that that here in America, we (as a society in whole) pay some of the highest drug prices in the world. It also pisses me off the Medicare cannot negotiate drug prices. If you want a change in this law, write to your representative and tell him/her to support H.R.3 - Elijah E. Cummings Lower Drug Costs Now Act, that would require the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) to negotiate prices for certain drugs. Trying to keep this non-political, I would add that if anyone wants the federal government to not have the ability to negotiate Medicare drug prices, please write to your representative and tell him/her to not support H.R.3

Jim

Oops didn’t catch the typo should b 7.5%
My rant against the Pharma Industry is spot on.
AbbVie doubled the list priceof Humira from 2012 to 2018 from $19,000 to a whopping $38,000. Sales of Humira reached a record breaking $20 billion in 2018.

The Kantar Media report found that AbbVie increased advertising spending on Humira by 13 percent last year – bringing total ad spending on the drug to a staggering $487 million.

Pfizer was no different:
Since 2012, Pfizer has increasedthe price of its pain management drug Lyrica by 163 percent. In January, Pfizer increased the list prices of Xeljanz and Chantix by 9.4 and five percent, respectively.

Kantar Media found that Pfizer’s top advertising spending for those three drugs reached nearly $750 million dollars.

Ask anyone who takes insulin what they have done to the price of that. I know someone that had to sell her only mode of transportation so that she could get insulin for herself and her daughter because she made ti much money trying to feed her family to get it free.

By the way if youIf you got some time I can tell you about my marine nephew who died of an oxy contin overdose at 22 because billions of them were being flooded into the market. Thousands of moms and dads and sons and daughters dead and millions more in rehab and not a peep out of the people that care about there fellow man.

By the way why do you give a fuck about what I got to say about big pharma. Or do you get off on being an antagonist.

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

By the way why do you give a fuck about what I got to say about big pharma. Or do you get off on being an antagonist.

What the hell are you talking about? ?‍

Your advertising number was wrong AND I AGREED WITH YOU ABOUT THE HIGH PRICES OF DRUGS!

 

[haknslash]

@haknslash you seem to be obsessed with ivermectin perhaps with a focus on convincing the world that it is a human drug not a veterinary drug.

Wrong assumption.

I can’t make my point any more clear. My issue is with the media LYING AND SPREADING MISINFORMATION about private citizens. I don’t know how y’all can read millions of peer review articles and stellar medical information yet seem to fail to understand the simple point I’m making how the media lies and contorts the facts to fit a narrative. Joe Rogan DID NOT take horse dewormer. Period. There are two distinct doses given for human consumption and animal. Yet media still to this day is painting a narrative that he took animal deworming medicine. That is NOT right. Yet despite the facts I’ve laid out, some still seem to side step the root cause of where much of the distrust in this country and around the world comes from which is the mainstream media. You would think everyone would want to hold them accountable but we all (those who aren’t asleep) know the ball game isn’t about that. If you can’t see how they are twisting the facts then I don’t know what to tell you but it doesn’t taken a phd or mindless web surfing to see they’re full of shit.

 

[crazy4life]

What the hell are you talking about? ?‍

Your advertising number was wrong AND I AGREED WITH YOU ABOUT THE HIGH PRICES OF DRUGS!

My bad. I did'nt realize that your entire post was about my missplaced decimal point. Especually when it starts with " actually I'm getting tired of you repeated saying that someone who doesn't agree with your point of view is dulsional. If you have something to say, just go ahead and say it."

I probably woulda started my post with a "hey you sure that number is right it looks a little high to me" But thats just me.

Carry on

 

[Bruce]

@haknslash, is your argument that prescribed ivermectin and veterinary ivermectin are different drugs?

They are exactly the same chemical compound delivered via different chemical formulations.

The more common horse wormer and the less common Stromectol tablets both are ivermectin.

 

[haknslash]

@haknslash, is your argument that prescribed ivermectin and veterinary ivermectin are different drugs?

They are exactly the same chemical compound delivered via different chemical formulations.

The more common horse wormer and the less common Stromectol tablets both are ivermectin.

They are different. Do not try and move the goal post in trying to in a roundabout way imply they are the same. Yes they technically are both “Ivermectin” but one is specifically formulated for animal use and the other for human use. There is a difference. Hell even that blowhard Gupta admitted they (CNN) shouldn’t have worded it the way they did.

https://www.health.nd.gov/sites/www/files/documents/Webpage%20Updates/COVID-19_Fact_Sheet_Ivermectin.pdf

Now with that being said, again, my point is the media is twisting the facts of what Joe Rogan was prescribed and it was NOT animal dewormer formation of Ivermectin. Yolur argument and my argument aren’t the same thing. Please don’t confuse the two.

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

My bad. I did'nt realize that your entire post was about my missplaced decimal point. Especually when it starts with " actually I'm getting tired of you repeated saying that someone who doesn't agree with your point of view is dulsional. If you have something to say, just go ahead and say it."

I probably woulda started my post with a "hey you sure that number is right it looks a little high to me" But thats just me.

Carry on

No worries.

Carry on

Jim

 

[haknslash]

BTW here is the interview. I will give Gupta some respect for taking the grilling but it’s warranted due to how much mud slinging and misinformation the MSM creates.

 

[Bruce]

@haknslash, assuming that he did obtain a prescription that would have been for an anti-parasitic drug approved for the treatment of strongyloidiasis of the intestinal tract and onchocerciasis due to the nematode parasite onchocerca volvulus. It is the same anti-parasitic used to worm lower animals. The most frequent human use in the US is to poison bed bugs that bite humans instead of ridding the home of bed bugs.

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

I think @haknslash was trying to make the point that Rogan's prescription was for the human version of Ivermectin and perhaps the media was making it look like he was taking the animal version of the drug. I would not take this drug for Covid, nor recommended it to any one else, but if someone is determined to take it than getting a script from your doctor and having it filled at your pharmacy is the safest way to do so.

I would agree that the media did exhibit a poor choice of words (perhaps deliberately to give a story more punch) in this reporting.

Unfortunately, some folks are getting the horse dewormer from farm stores for non-animal use. This is a terribly bad idea.

Jim

 

[the MfM]

@crazy4life, actually I'm getting tired of you repeated saying that someone who doesn't agree with your point of view is dulsional. If you have something to say, just go ahead and say it.

I likely know as much about of the pricing of drugs and drug advertising as you. First off, 75 cents of every advertising dollar is NOT spent by the pharmaceutical industry. This is a ridiculous thing to say. U.S. advertising is estimated at $240 billion a year. Quite honestly, I do not know the advertising budget of the pharmaceutical industry. So let's use your number of $6.5 billion. Using your number, pharma ads would make up 2.7 cents of every advertising dollar, no where near 75 cents per dollar.

Let's be clear, I do not work for Pharma, never will, and have no financial interest in the Pharma Industry. I have dedicated my entire career to public service.

Again, I want to state that in this post I am speaking as a private citizen.

Crazy as you might think this sounds, I actually agree with you on drug pricing. I have travelled all over the world for work, and it pisses me off that that here in America, we (as a society in whole) pay some of the highest drug prices in the world. It also pisses me off the Medicare cannot negotiate drug prices. If you want a change in this law, write to your representative and tell him/her to support H.R.3 - Elijah E. Cummings Lower Drug Costs Now Act, that would require the Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) to negotiate prices for certain drugs. Trying to keep this non-political, I would add that if anyone wants the federal government to not have the ability to negotiate Medicare drug prices, please write to your representative and tell him/her to not support H.R.3

Jim

Reported for political content. I’m sure that even though @Bruce agrees with your advocacy you will be issued a warning point.

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

Reported for political content. I’m sure that even though @Bruce agrees with your advocacy you will be issued a warning point

LOL, so which part are you reporting?

Telling folks that if they support H.R. 3 to write to their Representative to support the bill, or telling folks that if they don't support H.R. 3 to write to their Representative to not support the bill?

Jim

 

[AZMark]

@the MfM wtf is that.

He named a bill, in a legitimate discussion over drug prices, which happens to be named after a deceased representative.

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

@the MfM, the difference of course being that you have jumped into partisan politics!

Seriously, our insurance companies negotiate the price of drugs, the VA negotiates the price of drugs, large hospital systems negotiate the price of drugs. Why can't we have a non-partisan discussion on what medicare pays for drugs?

Did you know that Medicare purchases about 1/3 of all prescription drugs in the U.S., and that a GAO study found that the VA's prices were 68 percent lower than Medicare prices for the 203 generic drugs (an average difference of $0.19 per unit) and 49 percent lower for the 196 brand-name drugs (an average difference of $4.11 per unit).

Jim

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

By the way if youIf you got some time I can tell you about my marine nephew who died of an oxy contin overdose at 22 because billions of them were being flooded into the market. Thousands of moms and dads and sons and daughters dead and millions more in rehab and not a peep out of the people that care about there fellow man.

@crazy4life, my sincere condolences on the passing of your nephew.

It is troubling that the folks who made billions of dollars of the suffering of others where not held accountable for their actions.

Jim

 

[crazy4life]

@crazy4life, my sincere condolences on the passing of your nephew.

It is troubling that the folks who made billions of dollars of the suffering of others where not held accountable for their actions.

Jim

Members of the Sackler family who are at the center of the nation's deadly opioid crisis have won sweeping immunity from opioid lawsuits linked to their privately owned company Purdue Pharma and its OxyContin medication.
4.5 billion dollar fine and between the family they keep around 8 billion dollars and total immunity from all future lawsuits. Thank you very much Uncle Sam. They should have been stripped of every dime and that 8 billion should have gone to treatment centers for our addicted veterans trying to self medicate after witnessing the horrors of battle. And also the thousands of moms and dads and children that are addicted to this scourge.These are real crimes against humanity that go unpunished while the guy selling some weed (my other nephew) gets 3 years in a for profit prison financed by the gov. That young Jarhead was a kind, funny, outstanding young patriot and I miss him dearly.

 

[Evil Sports]

. The most frequent human use in the US is to poison bed bugs that bite humans instead of ridding the home of bed bugs.

Now you have you attention, I am a Board Certified Entomologist and own a multi million dollar pest management firm thats been in business for 108 years. No where in my industry is Ivermectin used as a systemic insecticide for bedbugs. A version of Streptomyces Avermitilis IS used as an insecticide for roaches and ants called Abamectin but it is not used on or in humans.
This is All about dispelling misinformation which allegedly was Your charter from the beginning but yet you allow it to be posted here and echo it your self.

 

[Bruce]

@Evil Sports, strange as it may sound taking ivermectin to poison bed bugs that may bite has occurred in the US for close to a decade and was the most common reason for prescribing prepandemic.

This might improve your understanding The Benefit of a Single Oral Dose of Ivermectin in Humans: The Adverse Effects on Cimex lectularius L. Populations and Fecundity