The Vaccine

[AZMark]

I know one person that’s taken invermectin, says he got it from a dr, not completely sure I believe that. He was very sick for 2 weeks, not sure it helped him at all. Healthy guy, early 40s.

My unvaxxed brother in law now has covid and that is the last person I know well that is unvaxxed and hasn’t had the virus. He’s a super healthy guy so he should be fine. He previously said he’d never even bother getting tested but he’s sick enough that he did go do that to confirm and make sure he’s going to be ok. In my personal experience the overconfidence fades very fast when people get this.

 

[tabbibus]

I know one person that’s taken invermectin, says he got it from a dr, not completely sure I believe that. He was very sick for 2 weeks, not sure it helped him at all. Healthy guy, early 40s.

My unvaxxed brother in law now has covid and that is the last person I know well that is unvaxxed and hasn’t had the virus. He’s a super healthy guy so he should be fine. He previously said he’d never even bother getting tested but he’s sick enough that he did go do that to confirm and make sure he’s going to be ok. In my personal experience the overconfidence fades very fast when people get this.

oh no. there are plenty of doctors out there prescribing that stuff. Usually as part of a special "cocktail". Many of them charge a pretty penny for their special cocktail... unfortunately an M.D. or D.O. title does not equate to honesty

 

[Bruce]

Funny how you need a photo ID for a shot but don’t need one to vote!

Photo ID is not needed for vaccination. Anyone can get it.

Please avoid political topics on this forum.

 

[Bruce]

My unvaxxed brother in law now has covid and that is the last person I know well that is unvaxxed and hasn’t had the virus. He’s a super healthy guy so he should be fine. He previously said he’d never even bother getting tested but he’s sick enough that he did go do that to confirm and make sure he’s going to be ok.

Hope he recovers quickly and completely. Have you discussed monoclonal antibodies with him?

 

[AZMark]

Hope he recovers quickly and completely. Have you discussed monoclonal antibodies with him?

I have not. I just found out last night & I understand he got pretty frustrated answering questions from his parents and my wife yesterday so I don’t think he wants to hear from anyone. I’ll tell my wife to let him know.

We have a 1 year old & it’s been a balancing act between letting his uncle see him & trying to keep him safe. Some tough feelings right now for some of the family.

 

[Bruce]

@AZMark, I certainly understand that it could be a difficult or unwanted discussion. Hopefully he will be fine as is.

This article might speak to him. Monoclonal antibodies can save lives of sick COVID-19 patients, study finds

 

[the MfM]

It’s one thing to mock COVID vaccine objectors. Must we rob their livelihoods, too?

United Airlines is targeting workers seeking reasonable accommodations and violating their rights. [Opinion]

www.yahoo.com

 

[Tgen2013]

Notice how there arent any fancy postings denying the efficacy of Hydroxy.

I have not yet seen all 3 hours of the podcast, but will say this.

A guy who is non-college educated spent 3 hours talking medicine with a guy who has a Ph.D in it. And he held his own? Shouldn't this have been a blowout? Maybe it was and I will see that when I watch/listen to the podcast.

He didnt just hold his own,..............he laid the guy out. Had him stumbling and apologizing.

What is also funny is what "studies" and or information the main stream likes to quote. If it is favorable to their narrative they will cite it all day, if not
they will discredit it or not refer to it at all.

Example:
Studies or reports from China in agreement with their narrative will be sourced and repeated.
Studies or reports against their narrative,........Oh its "China" it cant be trusted. You cant have it both ways "Richard".
The Chinese did a exhaustive study of all patients in Wuhan who were on hydroxy for other reasons (Lupus etc.) prior and during the Covid outbreak.
Not one came down with the disease, period. This was thousands of people,....so much for the anecdotal BS.

Doctors are like any other people, there is no uniformity, hence the get a second opinion. It is a fallacy for any MD to directly discredit any treatment made in good faith.

Here where I am I know numerous Fire dept. medics who all have their own stocks of Hydroxy, in case they or their family were to come down with it. The emergency medical community has scores of MD's who are in agreement with the above. Its how these medics are sourcing this agent.

****I personally know an individual who early in the epidemic came down with Covid, and was on a ventilator for an extended time in horrible condition. His attending MD gave his hydroxy as a last resort. This individual was conscious on the ventilator when the agent was given. He describes actually "feeling" the agent kicking Covids ass. His turn around was within 24 hours. He recovered. Anecdotal my ass. 8 cents a pill. 75 year safety record. Hell, I used to take it when I was in the USMC against malaria.

It is folly to evoke the TROLLs moniker. It discredits anyone who evokes it.
It is merely calling names. Cant or wont repudiate an argument or position, so call them a name, and or ban them to silence them.
One side does this, always, like a Swiss watch.

 

[Bruce]

Notice how there arent any fancy postings denying the efficacy of Hydroxy.

Not sure what you consider a “fancy posting” however hydroxychloroquine, which is an effective anti-parasitic for the treatment of malaria, has been well studied as a potential treatment for CoVID-19 and found to be ineffective.

It would have been wonderful if HCQ had been effective.

Here are a few relevant articles.

Hydroxychloroquine does not benefit adults hospitalized with COVID-19

Hydroxychloroquine No More Effective Than Placebo in Preventing COVID-19 - Penn Medicine

In a clinical trial testing whether a daily regimen of hydroxychloroquine could protect those most likely to be exposed to COVID-19, researchers from the Perelman School of Medicine at the University of Pennsylvania found there was no difference in infection rates among health care workers who...

www.pennmedicine.org

https://www.hcplive.com/view/remdesivir-hydroxychloroquine-ineffective-covid-19-management

Science | AAAS

www.science.org

https://newsroom.uw.edu/news/hydroxychloroquine-fails-prevent-covid-19

Hydroxychloroquine: Ineffective as a therapy, can it help protect health care workers? - Vanderbilt Medicine

In addition to remdesivir, several other drugs are being tested for the treatment of COVID-19. One of them is hydroxychloroquine (HCQ), a drug originally developed to treat malaria but which currently is prescribed as an anti-inflammatory medication to reduce the pain and swelling of rheumatoid...

medschool.vanderbilt.edu

 

[Tgen2013]

PS who ever quoted the FDA statement. Thats old, dated July 2020.

Here is the latest From the NIH:

Hydroxychloroquine is effective, and consistently so when provided early, for COVID-19: a systematic review - PMC

Hydroxychloroquine (HCQ) has shown efficacy against coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) in some but not all studies. We hypothesized that a systematic review would show HCQ to be effective against COVID-19, more effective when provided earlier, not ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Dont be a predictable hypocrite and pick and choose please. Especially as an administrator.
The Chinese review alone would be grounds.
This article is from the NIH, a bit better than the sources you cite, wouldn't you say ? Then again it doesn't agree with what you are putting forth does it ?

Do I sense another ban with another engineered statement in a closed conversation status ?
Fact is your articles pale in comparison with real life experienced.
Not one thing I have done here violates any code of conduct.

 

[Bruce]

@Tgen2013, your link is not a statement from the NIH it is a questionable publication from two Sports Medicine and Orthopaedic specialists. Perhaps a little better than medical advice from comedians and entertainers.

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

@Tgen2013, feel free to take Hydroxychloroquine if you get Covid again. Me, I'm going for one of the proven Covid treatements, like monoclonal antibodies!

Jim

 

[Jerlane]

PS who ever quoted the FDA statement. Thats old, dated July 2020.

Here is the latest From the NIH:

Hydroxychloroquine is effective, and consistently so when provided early, for COVID-19: a systematic review - PMC

Hydroxychloroquine (HCQ) has shown efficacy against coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) in some but not all studies. We hypothesized that a systematic review would show HCQ to be effective against COVID-19, more effective when provided earlier, not ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Here is the latest??? LOL! That "study" was from September of last year.

 

[Julian]

I'm not sure I'd classify Dr. Gupta as an introvert incapable of holding his own in a 3 hour podcast, given his high profile job. I did watch the podcast, they both made good points (the Dr. more than Rogan)

I've watched highlights from it, and Rogan's repeated complaint is that CNN lied about him taking a horse dewormer. That seems to be what he went after over and over. Would have been more interesting if they'd gotten into discussions about the effectiveness of it in trials (perhaps they did-and that didn't make good highlight reels). Yes, CNN shouldn't have said he took the horse version. Did it help him - no one will ever know. No major clinical trial yet shows it helps.

People have whined about the Covid vaccines only have 30K people in their trials and are posting about tiny "studies" in Third world countries.....mind boggling the flip flop logic there (I put "studies" in quotes as many are "observational" vs RCTs- the ones that were RCT often are <100 participants - too small). But those "details" are irrelevant.

The point some make that- why not take it - its a safe drug. Sure go for it. But there are no studies that say, for example, that these drugs don't interfere with monoclonal antibody treatment. What if they do? Then you run the risk of counteracting something KNOWN to work. I'll be happy to have someone like @tabbibus telling me what to do if I'm ever in his ICU! (and correct me if I'm wrong Tabbibus - but you guys WERE using Hydroxy and Ivermectin early on - until you realized it was ineffective?)

 

[crazy4life]

Respectfully, you note that no one is getting medical advice from Joe Rogan, but then state that he took Ivermectin and it worked (for Covid). For the third time, here is a post to the FDA webpage, Why You Should Not Use Ivermectin to Treat or Prevent COVID-19. Currently available data do not show ivermectin is effective against COVID-19.

A physical prescribing Ivermectin for Covid-19, especially at this time, is unethical. Please understand that just because a doctor can prescribe a medicine for an off label use, does NOT mean it is beneficial to the patient and may not be harmful to the patient. A doctor could prescribe Viagra to a patient for Covid, off label. There are some medications that are common prescribed off-label for a disease treatment, especially when there are small patient populations, and the drug sponsor does not want to pursue additional labeling claims. Ivermectin, for Covid, however, is not one of these drugs.

Ivermectin, is a wonderful drug. It has been a hugely successful treatment, for man and animal, for the diseases it is labeled for.

Jim

Wow. Delusion comes to mind with this entire post. It is nothing but regurgitatrion of the FDA talking points. Did your bosses give you a script for this nonsense? The horse dewormer narrative is so overdone. I suggest you get on the phone and tell all the people running these trials all over the world that they are using a HORSE WORMER. Also be sure to tell them that it is unethical to prescribe it. They should stop right after hearing from you.

As of now, there are 77 studies assessing the use of ivermectin to treat or prevent COVID-19 registered in clinicaltrials.gov, and 139 trials listed in the WHO’s International Clinical Trials Registry Platform.

There are 2 large trials in the United Sates as we speak.

One study, led by the University of Minnesota Medical School, where Bramante is an assistant professor of internal medicine and pediatrics, started studying the use of ivermectin and of the antidepressant fluvoxamine in nonhospitalized people with COVID-19 in May.

The second large study taking place in the U.S., named ACTIV-6 — the sixth of a series of studies funded by the National Institutes of Health called Accelerating COVID-19 Therapeutic Interventions and Vaccines — started in April and included ivermectin in August.

In the United Kingdom
In June, Oxford University researchers added the drug to their PRINCIPLE trial, or Platform Randomised Trial of Treatments in the Community for Epidemic and Pandemic Illnesses

Ongoing Clinical Trials Will Decide Whether (or Not) Ivermectin Is Safe, Effective for COVID-19 - FactCheck.org

Studies on whether ivermectin is beneficial in treating COVID-19 patients haven't been conclusive, and health officials have warned people not to self-medicate. But multiple large trials are continuing to assess the antiparasitic drug. Yet, Sen. Rand Paul reportedly said researchers were...

www.factcheck.org

I will tell you what is unethical is the wholesale distribution of remdesivir for the treatment of covid. The FDA approved this drug for the treatment of covid. It does nothing except make Gilead sciences a ton of cash. Like 3.5 BILLION in just 6 months.
"Science has learned that both FDA's decision and the EU deal came about under unusual circumstances that gave the company important advantages. FDA never consulted a group of outside experts that it has at the ready to weigh in on complicated antiviral drug issues."

Science | AAAS

www.science.org

Study after study has shown it does nothing for mortality and at best might shorten hospital stays by 1 day. What it does do is make Gilead Sciences 3000 dolars per dose. In spite of this it is still on most hospitals covid regimen WHY you might ask. $$$$$$$$$$$.

Carry on

 

[Lurch]

People have whined about the Covid vaccines only have 30K people in their trials and are posting about tiny "studies" in Third world countries.....mind boggling the flip flop logic there (I put "studies" in quotes as many are "observational" vs RCTs- the ones that were RCT often are <100 participants - too small). But those "details" are irrelevant.

Why do you continually make reference to "whining" when you disagree with a post? Is it an attempt to infantilize other viewpoints? Shouldn't you be able to argue a point just using your superior facts without resorting to rhetorical flourish?

 

[tabbibus]

I've watched highlights from it, and Rogan's repeated complaint is that CNN lied about him taking a horse dewormer. That seems to be what he went after over and over. Would have been more interesting if they'd gotten into discussions about the effectiveness of it in trials (perhaps they did-and that didn't make good highlight reels). Yes, CNN shouldn't have said he took the horse version. Did it help him - no one will ever know. No major clinical trial yet shows it helps.

People have whined about the Covid vaccines only have 30K people in their trials and are posting about tiny "studies" in Third world countries.....mind boggling the flip flop logic there (I put "studies" in quotes as many are "observational" vs RCTs- the ones that were RCT often are <100 participants - too small). But those "details" are irrelevant.

The point some make that- why not take it - its a safe drug. Sure go for it. But there are no studies that say, for example, that these drugs don't interfere with monoclonal antibody treatment. What if they do? Then you run the risk of counteracting something KNOWN to work. I'll be happy to have someone like @tabbibus telling me what to do if I'm ever in his ICU! (and correct me if I'm wrong Tabbibus - but you guys WERE using Hydroxy and Ivermectin early on - until you realized it was ineffective?)

Yes. Used it early and late. Didn't do squat

 

[Evil Sports]

If the goal here is to dispel misinformation why do you keep calling Ivermectin a Horse De wormer when its been approved for human use for 40 plus years.
Ivermectin is a broad spectrum anti-parasitic, with approved uses in animals and humans. The drug was developed in the late 1970s. In humans, ivermectin is indicated for, among other conditions, two neglected tropical diseases, river blindness (onchocerciasis) and lymphatic filariasis.

 

[Julian]

Why do you continually make reference to "whining" when you disagree with a post? Is it an attempt to infantilize other viewpoints? Shouldn't you be able to argue a point just using your superior facts without resorting to rhetorical flourish?

Fair point, I'll use the work Complain from now on....unless whining is really involved. But some of the logic is infantile....ok....not infantile - but 3rd grade math level.

 

[Evil Sports]

Warning given for personal attack