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Towing with Tesla Model X

Nakk

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That's an issue certainly. Four more opening in Alabama in the next few months though... Plus, don't forget you only use the supercharger stations on road trips. Day to day driving you just plug in at home.
While you can argue preferences all day. (Find it hard to believe you got a 300 mile charge in the time it took to take a piss and grab a burger, but whatever). I also think driving 4 hours of interstate driving on a single charge is bit far fetched., given their max range is hardly 300 miles. A Model 3 stomping everyone at the track - your buddy must be a significantly better driver than everyone else.... The highest optioned model 3 is drivers race against any Hellcat. And prime driver vs. driver, the Hellcat should stomp it. Of course the v8 sound is worth it alone IMO.

I am curious what happens with Tesla when you push your range to far, or you can't find a station in the middle of Nebraska? I doubt the road ranger has a battery charger for you.
Didn't need 300 miles, we did get 180 miles though. That's all we needed. Level 3 superchargers rolling out now will give you 250 miles in 15 minutes. Four hours at 70 mph is 280 miles leaving a very comfortable 30 miles in reserve. As far as running out of charge, you'd have to be pretty stupid in a Tesla. You tell the car where you're going, it tells you where you need to stop. It also warns you before you drive out of range of a charging station. It even picks the best station based on waiting lines. As far as driving skills in a drag race, the Tesla does everything, the driver just stomps the pedal. If the Hellcat driver doesn't get a perfect launch, he's got no chance against a Tesla. Street driving, a Hellcat just doesn't compare to a Tesla. Off the line the Tesla is just so much quicker. It takes time for the Hellcat to get rolling. Admittedly, if the standard race was 5/16 instead of 1/4 mile, The big V8 would win every time. If you run the 1/8, well the Hellcat will be behind by at least five or six car lengths. Remember, max torque at zero, and max torque is instantaneous.

Don't get me wrong, I love big V8s. I've been a motor head all of my life. I've rebuilt more engines than I can count, and have done a number of pretty cool engine swaps. It's just that after driving a Tesla, it became apparent pretty quickly that it was the future, and ICE cars are the past. Not because of being "Green". It's because a Tesla is just that much better.
 

buckbuck

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So I am naive about the Tesla's but can someone tell me how the A/C and heating loads affect the range? Is it significant?
 

Nakk

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So I am naive about the Tesla's but can someone tell me how the A/C and heating loads affect the range? Is it significant?
This is second hand, as I don't have one myself yet. ( I will though.) I have friends who have slept overnight in their Model 3 while skiing at Mt. Hood. (The back is cavernous with the rear seats folded down.) According to those friends, leaving the heat on overnight burns about 15 miles of range. AC is about a 5% hit on range, according to friends who have one.

There are negatives to the Model 3. No roof racks are available that I know of. The glass roof, while gorgeous, requires more AC in sunny weather. There are no parts available for working on it yourself. (On the other hand, the maintenance required is so much less than a regular car your cost for maintenance will still be less than working on a normal car.) Unless you get the performance model--which has a track mode--it's impossible to drift the car, it just won't let you do it. It does require more planning to charge it than just filling up an ICE car. (If you tell it where you're going, it will do the planning for you.)
 

Dixie Highway

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I think the biggest issue to overcome right now is the cost. Sure, it’s cheaper to run, lower maintenance, etc...HOWEVER, currently a highly optioned Model 3 (smaller than a Honda Accord) costs as much as my F150 did brand new, and it won’t tow my boat. I can buy 2 comparably sized Toyota Corollas for the price of 1 Model 3, and likely get as many trouble free miles on each one. Not to mention this tiny useless (to me) car will not do everything I need it to. As of today, it’s a gimmick until it gets more mainstream and accessible to a larger percentage of the population. Musk will continue gouging the iPhone and Green New Deal crowd until one or more major automakers adopts the new technology all the way and forces him to lower prices and raise his QC levels to a similar level as other makers. At that point I’ll take a serious look.
 

Betik

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@Dixie Highway I agree with you and the numbers Tesla is quoting about fuel savings is a bit biased to say the least. I hired them to get solar for the house and while they were promising the panel will pay for themself it just simply they do NOT. They showed me some incredibly good looking numbers and when I put them in my excel and showed it to them, they never called back. They just issued a $500 refund, but did not say anything, I even followed up telling that I would love for them to find a flow in my calculation because deep in side of me I want to have solar, but the math just does not work.

Just as you pointed out, a hybrid corolla is better value than model 3 ( period). Down the road maybe, but right now you cannot claim that a model makes business sense. the math does not add up.

The model X which our dear friend got...... well lets say that is great vehicle if you want to be have quality time in the back seat while the car is taking you to your destination.
 

Nakk

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I think the biggest issue to overcome right now is the cost. Sure, it’s cheaper to run, lower maintenance, etc...HOWEVER, currently a highly optioned Model 3 (smaller than a Honda Accord) costs as much as my F150 did brand new, and it won’t tow my boat. I can buy 2 comparably sized Toyota Corollas for the price of 1 Model 3, and likely get as many trouble free miles on each one. Not to mention this tiny useless (to me) car will not do everything I need it to. As of today, it’s a gimmick until it gets more mainstream and accessible to a larger percentage of the population. Musk will continue gouging the iPhone and Green New Deal crowd until one or more major automakers adopts the new technology all the way and forces him to lower prices and raise his QC levels to a similar level as other makers. At that point I’ll take a serious look.
Let's see, two Toyota Corolla XSEs--nowhere near as nice as or even a tiny bit comparable to an model 3: $57,340. One Tesla Model 3: $38,990. Nope, I guess not. Fuel cost about 1/5 that of your Corolla. Maintenance cost a tiny fraction of your Corolla. Dude, I don't own an iphone. I think the Green New Deal thing is about the dumbest thing to come out of Washington EVER. Until I drove one, I thought Tesla was ridiculous. Then I drove one. Better, cheaper in the long run, WAY faster, WAY less maintenance, more fun to drive than a Corvette, WAY more space inside than anything you listed, (except the back of your Ford pick up. Not a truck. Like I said, if you need to tow then EV is not going to cut it yet. As far as a car, nothing I can say will make you understand. Just go test drive one before you waste money on another car. Don't listen to me. Don't listen to anyone. Just test drive one. Do the overnight deal where you don't even have a salesman with you. Even if you don't buy one you will have more fun than you ever thought possible in a car. They are FAST. Fast in a way you can't even comprehend until you drive one. The torque is so instant that you get motion sickness--literally--until you get used to it. And I taught acrobatics in USAF supersonic jets. Be advised though, you are going to want one after you drive one. I've driven Vettes, Mercedes AMGs, BMW M cars, Hellcats, Vipers, etc. Nothing else compares. If you like cars, driving a Tesla Model 3 is going to put a no shit ear to ear grin on your face. And, the damn thing drives itself on the freeway. And soon enough off the Freeway too. Fall asleep, and it will pull over and park. Does that sound "Green" enough for you?
 

Nakk

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@Dixie Highway I agree with you and the numbers Tesla is quoting about fuel savings is a bit biased to say the least. I hired them to get solar for the house and while they were promising the panel will pay for themself it just simply they do NOT. They showed me some incredibly good looking numbers and when I put them in my excel and showed it to them, they never called back. They just issued a $500 refund, but did not say anything, I even followed up telling that I would love for them to find a flow in my calculation because deep in side of me I want to have solar, but the math just does not work.

Just as you pointed out, a hybrid corolla is better value than model 3 ( period). Down the road maybe, but right now you cannot claim that a model makes business sense. the math does not add up.

The model X which our dear friend got...... well lets say that is great vehicle if you want to be have quality time in the back seat while the car is taking you to your destination.
Agreed. The break even point for solar is about 25 years if you count interest on the investment--which you should--and you have no Mx on the panels. Not a great deal. It would be pretty easy to lose money on the installation. A Model 3 on the other hand... More fun than a BMW M3--or a Corvette for that matter--and cheaper than a Corolla over 10 years or less.... And yes, the math adds up. I can fit all of my kiteboarding gear in back of an Model 3. Something I can't even get close to in a Corolla. (Try putting a hydrofoil in the back of a Corolla.)

Again you guys, try one before you knock them. It's just very interesting how Tesla's biggest critics have never driven one. Critiquing something you have absolutely no knowledge of is kind of pointless, isn't it? The test drive is free you know.
 

swatski

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While you can argue preferences all day. (Find it hard to believe you got a 300 mile charge in the time it took to take a piss and grab a burger, but whatever). I also think driving 4 hours of interstate driving on a single charge is bit far fetched., given their max range is hardly 300 miles. A Model 3 stomping everyone at the track - your buddy must be a significantly better driver than everyone else.... The highest optioned model 3 is drivers race against any Hellcat. And prime driver vs. driver, the Hellcat should stomp it. Of course the v8 sound is worth it alone IMO.

I am curious what happens with Tesla when you push your range to far, or you can't find a station in the middle of Nebraska? I doubt the road ranger has a battery charger for you.
Not to be argumentative but let me guess - you have not had a ride in a tesla? When you do be prepared for a possibility it will change the way you look at things, lol. It is crazy we even have a discussion like this. There is simply no comparison. Teslas have their serious limitation but arguing performance of a modern EV vs ICE is a bit like comparing ICE vehicle to one powered by a steam engine (yes, there was a time it was a real debate!).

As far as V8 sound, at least in the boat I see no value in any sound, the quieter the better.

--
 

seanmclean

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While you can argue preferences all day. (Find it hard to believe you got a 300 mile charge in the time it took to take a piss and grab a burger, but whatever). I also think driving 4 hours of interstate driving on a single charge is bit far fetched., given their max range is hardly 300 miles. A Model 3 stomping everyone at the track - your buddy must be a significantly better driver than everyone else.... The highest optioned model 3 is drivers race against any Hellcat. And prime driver vs. driver, the Hellcat should stomp it. Of course the v8 sound is worth it alone IMO.

I am curious what happens with Tesla when you push your range to far, or you can't find a station in the middle of Nebraska? I doubt the road ranger has a battery charger for you.
To be fair, a 'drivers' race between an AWD Electric and a Hellcat leans heavily towards the electric vehicle - takes much more skill to squeeze the best out of a hellcat.
 

2kwik4u

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Been quietly reading along for a bit here......I'm bored at work this morning, so here it comes. :D :D........TL;DR at the end

I've driven both a Model X and a Model 3. Personally, I can't stand the damn things. If they're the future, then call me a Luddite and let me keep my truck forever.

Those giant screens, and minimalist interior is entirely incorrect from a "drivers car" perspective. I want those gauges in front of me, and I want them to be nice analog dials. They can be "screens", but they need some dials in them, and then need to be front and center for the driver. The amount of mental processing required between a digital speed readout, and an analog speed readout is significantly different. You have to do a slight bit of "mental math" if you're going 52 in a 55 with a digital speedo, an analog speedo, you'll quickly learn the approximate location of 55 on your gauge, and just know the needle is "close enough" to where you want to be. It becomes as much feel as it does actual read/process/decide......Now this doesn't hold a TON of water due to the nature of electric vehicles. No oil pressure, coolant temp, or tachometer to speak of. A fuel gauge, speedo, and maybe voltage.

No tactile controls. This is complete and utter shenanigans IMO. I can adjust MOST things in my truck by feel alone, and often do. I don't have to look over and find the right button on a screen full of other bs to change the station, adjust the A/C, or control my seat heaters. It's a physical button, that I can push that hasn't moved, or been covered up since the last time I touched it.

There's no "feel" to the car when driving. It's a constant pull without any other movement. There is no liveliness in the driveline. No difference in feel between driving it lightly, and whipping the snot out of it. It just goes. What a bland and boring personality for a car to have. Where's the fun in that? Sure if you want to drive a toaster to work every day, I guess that's OK. I personally want a bit more personality in my vehicles. I want to feel those shifts, and to have the sound change. For me that's part of what makes driving entertaining. I don't want to ride in a sealed off, temperature controlled, eclosure on wheels. I want to feel something other than the basic movement of going from one place to the other. My wifes Nissan Rogue has a similar problem with it's CVT transmission, overly soft suspension, and wildly over-assisted steering and brakes. It's just numb to drive. She loves it, but then again, she loves our toaster too.

If you want to talk acceleration on a drag strip, I'll take a GMC Syclone with a tune over a Model 3 any day. Those were doing 0-60 in under 3 seconds, in the rain, since the early '90's. A launch from a good running Syclone will quite literally hurt your teeth and your chest as it leaves the line. Tesla's have a similar feeling at launch, but are far less exciting with all the electronics keeping wheelspin in check, and the electric motors just spinning away. Where's the drama to accompany such a high end performance? Let's be honest here, if we're driving like that, we're out looking for some drama, we aren't just commuting to work at those accelerations. On the street they're both equally fast, but one exudes personality and uniqueness, the other is just a quick toaster.

Maintenance is a whole 'nother topic as well. Sure the electric car has less, and that's a good thing. I personally hate maintenance. With that said, anyone buying a $40k+ vehicle is most likely not doing it themselves anyway. Hell I lost both headlights in the truck yesterday. Couldn't find my meter to check anything, so I scheduled an appointment for the service center. Turned out to be two burnt bulbs (yes, two at the same instant), but if I hadn't found my meter, I probably would've let the dealership handle it. While I might have fewer service center visits in general with a Tesla over say an Audi (apples to apples for this one), the Audi service experience is so seamless it really doesn't matter. I'm going to get a loaner and go about my day with a small interruption.....Point being, the EV will have lower maintenance, but that isn't a high enough selling point to convert me at this time.

Cost is improved on an EV. Can't argue that one a little bit. Energy to run it is less expensive. The distribution network for electricity is much better than gasoline, and much less expensive. It's easier to create electricity over gasoline/diesel as well. Again, how many people are buying $40k+ cars, and are really concerned about the fuel mileage enough for it to make a dent in their driving decision? If you're really strapped for cash, you're probably buying a used Corolla and driving the wheels off of it. If you're not strapped for cash you're buying a $40k Tesla, and bragging about how much money you're "saving" on fuel. Your savings account balance isn't increasing, you just aren't spend as much. I hate the word "savings" for this exact reason. Stupid marketing from years past has ingrained it in our head that spending less is "saving" money.....we're still spending money....but that is for another thread some day.

TL;DR......EV's might be the future, but they aren't the solution for me yet. Lots of reasons I don't like them, and won't be spending my money on one any time soon.
 

adrianp89

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To be fair, a 'drivers' race between an AWD Electric and a Hellcat leans heavily towards the electric vehicle - takes much more skill to squeeze the best out of a hellcat.
Still almost a second difference between the two in ideal conditions. To the point above - no fun if the car does everything for. Feeling a car and learning it is part of the experience.
 

Dean P

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@2kwik4u Do you own a cell phone or a computer or flat screen TV? How old is your truck?
I doubt you're a luddite. As I mentioned previously, technology is here to make our lives easier. I'm sure you benefiting from it everyday. (God forgive) Wait until you visit the hospital. The advancements in tech and medicine will help and or save your butt. You can fight it as long as you want but it's going to happen (with or without you). Your children and grand children (assuming here) will see to it.
I understand we're all diverse; that's what makes the world go 'round. We all have a right to our opinions and I respect that. We should all IMO keep an open mind as "Change does not come from a YES man."
 

2kwik4u

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@DeanP I don't actually think I'm a Luddite, I was being overly dramatic :D I have plenty of tech in play, and am all for advancing it. I try as best I can to keep an open mind about new advancements in technology. I do, however, think that most people are too busy worrying about if they can do something that they don't step back and think if they should do something.

iPads in the classroom are another subject I can rail on for hours and hours. They are 99% more distraction than tool. Everyone said "Hey look, we have tech in the classroom", and never stopped to consider if it was really a value add for the kids and teachers. More often than not it was a burden on the teachers to setup lessons, and a burden on the kids to learn to use the device. Even once workflows were established, they are still typically more cumbersome than more traditional means of learning. Electric cars follow the same vein for me. So far, it's far more sizzle than steak, and a LOT of people professing they are the best thing they've ever driven. That is quickly followed with statements along the lines of; "This is the best answer. Period.".......It should follow closer to "This is the best answer I've found for me".

With that said, I'm glad there are early adopters. They tend to spend the time/money/effort to iron out the tech for the rest of us. Improving on the good parts, and casting aside the useless parts. I'm glad there are those that love their EV's, I'm just not in that crowd, and I think I tend to be the minority in general there. So I speak up when it comes up.

Styling aside, I'm excited to see what Rivian can do with their EV pickup.
 

Nakk

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Been quietly reading along for a bit here......I'm bored at work this morning, so here it comes. :D:D
Good points. You're absolutely right in that the Tesla has much less "feel" and "liveliness". You do miss the V8 scream when you nail it. My Blazer has the Dynomax VT mufflers. Normal driving the L94 is very quiet. Hit it hard and the internal bypass valve opens open and sounds great! I will be keeping my Blazer for towing, so I'll still have that. :)

Yep, the lack of tactile controls is a compromise for sure. Worth it for me as I drive my cars for a LONG time. (Note the '92 Blazer I'm still driving...) One of the bigger failure points in a car are the switches. Tesla does away with most of those so I don't have to source those 20 years from now. But yeah, something that really needs getting used too. I'll let you know how used to that I get.

As far as the gauges, I'm kind of used to the display on the side thing now. I designed a gauge set to use on my Android tablet for my Blazer L94 engine swap while I set up normal gauges. I've never bothered to put normal gauges in partly because I've been so busy with other projects, and partly because the gauges displayed over to the right works fine for me. I thought it would be annoying, but after a few weeks I realized no big deal. A quick glance to the right, eye movement only, is all it takes. I've never talked to a Tesla owner who thought it was an issue. But, different strokes for sure.

Yes, I can afford a $50K car, but I've never come close to spending that before. Yes, the cost analysis is a BIG part of why I'm buying one. I'll drive mine for at least 250K miles. In that time the savings in fuel cost alone will come close to paying for the car. Yes, savings. I'm going to drive those miles anyway. The cost of buying a Corolla and 250K miles worth of fuel is greater than buying a mid line Tesla Model 3 and 250K worth of electricity. And I've owned enough used cars to know that the maintenance is going to cost me even more. And driving a Model 3 for 250K is going to be a damn sight more pleasant than being stuck in a Corolla.

I agree that we're losing something. Throwing a 'Vette into a four wheel drift with the small block singing it's song is a memory I'm glad I have. I do think we're gaining more though. I have a buddy who teaches driving race cars. He owns several race cars, and several very high end Porsche street cars. His favorite car to drive? His Tesla Model 3 Performance. You think Model 3's take spirit out of driving? Wait till cars don't have steering wheels. That's coming faster than you think.

Anyways, everyone wants something different. That's what makes us great. It'd be pretty boring if everyone wanted the same thing. Me? I want my daily driver to be fun to drive, quiet, have very comfortable seats, have a great sound system, be VERY cheap to run, be as maintenance free as possible, carry all of my gear, lower my stress level while driving in traffic, avoid an accident if some idiot swerves into me at the moment I'm not looking in his direction, and if it would pull over and park if something happens to me that would be great too. Add those numbers up and you get one answer. Tesla. And pretty soon, after flying a red eye in from Tokyo and I'm facing a three hour drive home--something I do three or four times a month--I'll be able to say "Tesla, take me home." and then go to sleep.
 
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Nakk

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If you want to talk acceleration on a drag strip, I'll take a GMC Syclone with a tune over a Model 3 any day. Those were doing 0-60 in under 3 seconds, in the rain, since the early '90's.
I'm having a really hard time believing this. Stock was 4.3 seconds; I might buy 4.0 with a tune. I could probably build one to go that fast, but I'd be breaking front differentials for sure. Even stock those things were hell on front differentials. Built to go that fast? Bye bye front axle. I can't remember what they put in the rear on those. I'm guessing you'd be breaking those too. At least the rear wouldn't be hard to beef up or replace.

Edited to add: I guess maybe if the tune allowed you to really up the boost. But then you're going to be blowing motors too.
 

2kwik4u

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I'm having a really hard time believing this. Stock was 4.3 seconds; I might buy 4.0 with a tune. I could probably build one to go that fast, but I'd be breaking front differentials for sure. Even stock those things were hell on front differentials. Built to go that fast? Bye bye front axle. I can't remember what they put in the rear on those. I'm guessing you'd be breaking those too. At least the rear wouldn't be hard to beef up or replace.

Edited to add: I guess maybe if the tune allowed you to really up the boost. But then you're going to be blowing motors too.
Sorry that was a typo, under 4 seconds, not under 3 seconds. I've seen a good number of 3.7-3.8 0-60 times (with a G-Tech meter, or similar accelerometer based tool). 60ft times at the drag strip are easily in the 1.6-1.8's on street tires, with the occasional 1.5's on good sticky tire setup.

Friend of mine pushed a mostly stock engine/turbo build into the high 11's. Engine had never been opened, not even the valve covers, Stock turbo was lightly ported. Biggest help was a VERY custom tune, and copious amounts of methanol injection. Stock boost was ~15lbs, he was running 29lbs. LOTS of driveline carnage along they way to that goal. Front axles and diff are surprisingly stout. Viscous coupler in the transfer case went once. Rear diff carrier was lost once. Several 700R4's were lost, eventually converted to 4L80E in that truck to handle the power. Even then we twisted the output shaft about 1/2 turn. That truck put down over 500ft-lbs at 20lbs boost on the dyno the year it broke into the 11's.

A good running, mostly stock truck with a custom tune can run in the mid-high 12's pretty easily on a good day. It's also dead simple to launch it the same EVERY SINGLE TIME, just like the Tesla. Also has tons of traction both on and off the track, making it a helluva stoplight sleeper for those that don't remember them.

The unique driveline in that truck allowed it to leave at nearly full torque. A slightly "loose" torque converter allowed one to rev the engine under load to ~2,400rpm or so and build boost in the process. Peak torque on that motor was around 2,800rpm. Leaving the line with 400+ft-lbs of torque on tap, and all wheel drive traction makes for insane acceleration. It's the same recipe as the Tesla's, just in "relatively antique" technology. Having ridden in both, the acceleration is nearly identical, the Syclone has a lot more "drama" in the experience though. SOOO much noise, and poor chassis dynamics during the launch it's really quite the exciting ride.
 

thefortunes

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Just came upon this thread. My daily driver is a Tesla Roadster, my wife drives a Tesla Model S.

I am a "car guy" and I can honestly say that, other than possibly buying toys, I probably will not buy another ICE car. My hope is that the rest of the auto manufacturers catch up to Tesla with EVs, because I think there are areas where Tesla fails.

The instant response of an EV just makes gas cars feel like dinosaurs. When I want to pass, I know that I can get from 60-80 or 70-90 in an instant, no waiting for the transmission to downshift, no screaming rpms, no worry about traction control kicking in and not getting the response I need (without a transmission the TC can react MUCH more quickly - to the point that I actually have to see the light flickering on the dash to know it is happening).

I don't begrudge anyone their preferences, if you love that sound of a V8 and it is important to you, so be it.

What I do is let people take a spin in one of ours, and watch their reaction. It's priceless. 0-60mph in 3.7secs (Roadster) or 2.4sec (S) is tough to understand until you've felt it. And it can be done by anyone, you don't have to be a "good driver" to accomplish it. Push the accelerator and hold on.

P.S. Regarding traveling. I bought the S in California and drove it back. While it did take longer due to charging (you typically stop every 2-3 hours for about 15-20 minutes) I arrived much more refreshed due to the breaks.

ETA: Regarding the 2kwik4u's comment about acceleration of a 4 second 0-60 and a 2.4 sec 0-60 being "nearly identical" is ludicrous (pun intended). I drive the 3.7sec Roadster daily and the 2.4sec S is in another league.
 
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thefortunes

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So I am naive about the Tesla's but can someone tell me how the A/C and heating loads affect the range? Is it significant?
I have extensive records (yeah, I'm kinda a nerd) for both our vehicles.

A/C hit is minimal.

There's really no way to isolate heat from other winter hits to mileage/range (aerodynamics, rolling resistance, etc...) so I'll just share that over the almost 150k miles we have on both cars we average about a 20% hit in the winter.

Interestingly enough, that is similar to the hit we had in our Prius back in the day. If any of you keep mpg info you probably see the same thing.
 

Ramblin Wreck

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@2kwik4u Do you own a cell phone or a computer or flat screen TV? How old is your truck?
I doubt you're a luddite. As I mentioned previously, technology is here to make our lives easier. I'm sure you benefiting from it everyday. (God forgive) Wait until you visit the hospital. The advancements in tech and medicine will help and or save your butt. You can fight it as long as you want but it's going to happen (with or without you). Your children and grand children (assuming here) will see to it.
I understand we're all diverse; that's what makes the world go 'round. We all have a right to our opinions and I respect that. We should all IMO keep an open mind as "Change does not come from a YES man."

Tech supposed to make life easier yet I get and respond to work emails at 10pm. Hummmm
 

Dean P

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Tech supposed to make life easier yet I get and respond to work emails at 10pm. Hummmm
Same here. Can't let go but it's better than walking into the office to 200 emails. Especially when there's really nothing good on (TV).
 
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