New Speed Control / Electronic Throttle Synch For Twins / Ridesteady by Hydrophase

[swatski]

The round housing is unavailable for this system. I ordered mine with a round gauge and tried to order the bezel and was told that the bezel is only available for the pp and not ridesteady. The reason is because pp sends the gauge to jbp and they build/install the gauge in house then send it to the customer. I had to call and cancel the round gauge and change to the rectangular one befor they shipped.
By the way, i will be installing mine on Saturday

That is correct - thank you for clarifying!

I don't think the JBP mount will fit our round displays. My understanding is that it requires disassembly of the display to remove the housing, presumably to reduce the overall depth of the assembly. Also, it seems to be tailored fairly specifically to PP displays, so my recommendation would be to use the external display if a Hydrophase product is installed on a boat without a speedo that can be removed.

 

[swatski]

A quick update after a few months of use.


Ridesteady. One of the top three mods in my boat.

What I find myself doing (when just cruising around these days) is this:

1. the Ridesteady set to RPM mode but "OFF"
2. use the throttles to get up on plane and up to any desired cruising/coasting/whatever speed
3. adjust the RPM "Set" in Ridesteady (withe RS still "OFF") with the knob to match (roughly) my current operating RPM
   
4. turn the Ridesteady "ON" - it will take over smoothly w/no big transition
5. use the knob all day long - from no wake to WOT
6. if in need to make any sudden adjustments or stop - grab the throttles to override the system.

This ends up working kind of like cars' cruise control, except boats best use constant RPM for cruising.

When docking or under any conditions when I need rapid response I turn the Ridesteady OFF (at anytime).

The Ridesteady is built and designed with water skiing/wake/surfboarding enthusiasts in mind, but it works amazingly well as a regular cruise control. Just switch the GPS/RPM modes between towing and cruising. Unlike PerfectPass, RS for Yamaha twins does not have any moving parts, mechanical linkages, servo motors, etc - so there is nothing to wear out and break. It is essentially a splice-in fly-by-wire system that takes over at the APS modules overriding the mechanical throttles (with all the safety stops built-in).

I use the OEM "cruise assist"... almost never.

Matching the RPM across the whole RPM spectrum in twin engine boats is a difficult problem as the pumps are loading unevenly between the two sides. To make it worse, Yamaha no longer equips the new boats with impellers that are differentially pitched for each side (which they used to do to alleviate this issue).

The only way to really synch the twin engines across the RPM range is electronic. Given E-series fly-by-wire throttles are not retrofitable in non-E series, the only option (for non-E-series) right now is the Hydrophase/Ridesteady system.


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[J-RAD]

A quick update after a few months of use.


Ridesteady. One of the top three mods in my boat.

What I find myself doing (when just cruising around these days) is this:

1. the Ridesteady set to RPM mode but "OFF"
2. use the throttles to get up on plane and up to any desired cruising/coasting/whatever speed
3. adjust the RPM "Set" in Ridesteady (withe RS still "OFF") with the knob to match (roughly) my current operating RPM
   
4. turn the Ridesteady "ON" - it will take over smoothly w/no big transition
5. use the knob all day long - from no wake to WOT
6. if in need to make any sudden adjustments or stop - grab the throttles to override the system.

This ends up working kind of like cars' cruise control, except boats best use constant RPM for cruising.

When docking or under any conditions when I need rapid response I turn the Ridesteady OFF (at anytime).

The Ridesteady is built and designed with water skiing/wake/surfboarding enthusiasts in mind, but it works amazingly well as a regular cruise control. Just switch the GPS/RPM modes between towing and cruising. Unlike PerfectPass, RS for Yamaha twins does not have any moving parts, mechanical linkages, servo motors, etc - so there is nothing to wear out and break. It is essentially a splice-in fly-by-wire system that takes over at the APS modules overriding the mechanical throttles (with all the safety stops built-in).

I use the OEM "cruise assist"... almost never.

Matching the RPM across the whole RPM spectrum in twin engine boats is a difficult problem as the pumps are loading unevenly between the two sides. To make it worse, Yamaha no longer equips the new boats with impellers that are differentially pitched for each side (which they used to do to alleviate this issue).

The only way to really synch the twin engines across the RPM range is electronic. Given E-series fly-by-wire throttles are not retrofitable in non-E series, the only option (for non-E-series) right now is the Hydrophase/Ridesteady system.


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I agree with it being one of my top mods as well. My wife had never towed me better! Besides the few interior upgrades, the oversized bimini and the integration thru the context system... I feel like I'm driving around in an E-Series boat.

I was under the impression that the system could only be activated under 5mph not on the fly... I'll have to try that trick.

Good notes!

 

[RightStuff]

So I came up with a question regarding this system over the past week. We have been surfing with the surf side engine at a higher RPM than the opposite side engine to get a little better wave. This ends up being 7k on the surf side and 4.5k on the other.

Is there a way to store something like that in the system? Or can you simply recall a 'saved' speed setting and pull/push one of the throttles to get the same effect without affecting the speed?

 

[Mainah]

So I came up with a question regarding this system over the past week. We have been surfing with the surf side engine at a higher RPM than the opposite side engine to get a little better wave. This ends up being 7k on the surf side and 4.5k on the other.

Is there a way to store something like that in the system? Or can you simply recall a 'saved' speed setting and pull/push one of the throttles to get the same effect without affecting the speed?

There is a setting for twin engine sync. If you turn it off it the system will try to maintain speed limited by how far the throttles are pushed foward. I don't know if the large delta between the two throttles that you are looking for would work though. @Ridesteady can you comment? Also any word on the RF interference issue for those with vhf radios?

 

[J-RAD]

So I came up with a question regarding this system over the past week. We have been surfing with the surf side engine at a higher RPM than the opposite side engine to get a little better wave. This ends up being 7k on the surf side and 4.5k on the other.

Is there a way to store something like that in the system? Or can you simply recall a 'saved' speed setting and pull/push one of the throttles to get the same effect without affecting the speed?

We did the same thing while surfing prior it installing the speed control. I noticed in the settings on the control module there was a feature that would allow you to disable the synchronization of the engines. I contacted Justin at Hydrophase to ask him about the possibility of utilizing the speed control while operating the engines at different RPM. His reply was:

"... yes, if you disable synchronization, then it will hold the speed but not sync the engines. It will apply the same increase or decrease in throttle to each engine to maintain the set speed, regardless of the current throttle level of those engines."

He requested I try it and let him know how it performed... so far I only tried it once... I was on the board while my wife played operator. She encountered a problem where the Surf side throttle was set to low and the system kept asking for more throttle and sort of spent the whole time fighting it a bit... it was not the cleanest run. Since then neither I or her have felt it was worth the added challenge during my runs. However, I am still waiting for my chance to test it out as operator and see if I can achieve better results. Unfortunately My wife is the second half of our surf team and she's spent the season on maternity leave. I'm afraid now that we have a newborn my season has come to a premature end, so my prospects of testing the scenario again is not likely to happen until next season.

The inconvenient part is the setting is a main menu setting and is not one that can be programmed to a rider profile. It's not hard to change the setting but it's not the most convenient either...

So, with that said, I don't know that I have a true answer to the question. I'm still interested in trying, my wife is not the most experienced operator nor the most mechanically inclined. Though having the system has significantly improved her ability to tow me and in that regard proven its value.

I do feel like if you get serious about surfing on a Yamaha you'll eventually end up with the Wake Wedge and the offset RPM will prove to be a non-issue. Unfortunately I blew my budget before I could make that investment this season, but Christmas is coming...

 

[swatski]

Also any word on the RF interference issue for those with vhf radios?

@Ridesteady I second that question!

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[swatski]

So I came up with a question regarding this system over the past week. We have been surfing with the surf side engine at a higher RPM than the opposite side engine to get a little better wave. This ends up being 7k on the surf side and 4.5k on the other.

Is there a way to store something like that in the system? Or can you simply recall a 'saved' speed setting and pull/push one of the throttles to get the same effect without affecting the speed?

We tried various tricks like that, but it never works well (for us).
The reason is, with the higher thrust off of the surf side pump (which is apparent even at the same RPM due to better pump loading on the "submerged" side) - one ends up steering the nozzles towards that side to counter a turn the uneven loading/thrust is forcing. That means one is now "shooting" more water towards the surf surface, which does not seem to help.
I have also tried easing the trim tabs ever so gently to "massage" the wake and that does seem to help.

@J-RAD @Mainah @jcyamaharider

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[J-RAD]

@swatski all good points. I've found, whether is the best strategy or not that performing a gradual turn surf side actually has helped us favor the wake on the surf side and prior to the Ridesteady offsetting the throttles really helped decrease the amount of jet wash. In this scenario the difference in thrust actually helped steer into the turn. Since the Ridesteady I've still found it to be surfable enough.

At this point I think the answer for my surf quest is additional ballast and a wake wedge.

@swatski what ever came out of your trim tab mounted surf device i saw you working on in another thread? Are you ready to sell me one, or are you holding out until JBP or @jcyamaharider buy out your patent? Maybe the you've updated your other thread...?

 

[zipper]

@J-RAD Congratulations on the newborn.

 

[J-RAD]

Thanks @zipper !

 

[swatski]

@swatski all good points. I've found, whether is the best strategy or not that performing a gradual turn surf side actually has helped us favor the wake on the surf side and prior to the Ridesteady offsetting the throttles really helped decrease the amount of jet wash. In this scenario the difference until thrust actually helped steer into the turn. Since the Ridesteady I've still found it to be surfable enough.

At this point I think the answer for my surf quest is additional ballast and a wake wedge.

@swatski what ever came out of your trim tab mounted surf device i saw you working on in another thread? Are you ready to sell me one, or are you holding out until JBP or @jcyamaharider by out your patent? Maybe the you've updated your other thread...?

Yes, slow surf side turn is still THE trick, that is why @jcyamaharider developed the Wedge, to be able to surf in strait line. I would buy the Wedge for sure, but my boat may become a donation to a charity (I hate Yamaha so much right now), lol.
The tab mod (the "beast") works, kind of. It can be very effective BUT only under extremely narrow conditions. The two major drawbacks are: 1. to be effective it needs to be so big that it interferes with normal cruising (I can not get it out of the water by just retracting the tab) - and there is nothing that can be done about it because of the way the transom is curved, just not enough space), 2. the beast deployment (which is mounted on the tab opposite to surf side) forces one to steer into the surf side - which pushes some water over the surf surface - not ideal.

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[Ridesteady]

Man, y'all respond fast to thread updates!

Regarding maintaining a certain delta in engine speeds, there is no way to set that in Ridesteady. You can disable engine sync, which will apply an even amount of throttle increase/decrease to both engines. But, as @J-RAD mentioned, decreasing one engine means the other is going to have to compensate quite a bit. If in total they aren't enough to maintain the desired set speed (or close to not enough), then the system will complain about increasing the throttle ("more gas").

Regarding the VHF radio interference issue, it has already been verified by us and our customer who originally experienced the issue. We're really just waiting on final-final confirmation that the issue has been solved since it is a bit of a hassle to return the throttle nodes for the fix. That said, anyone who wants to can return them early (i.e. if they have a need to use their VHF radio for a trip or the like) and we'll be happy to get the fix in.

Congrats on the new family member, @J-RAD!

 

[zipper]

@swatski Not being a surfer, yet, that explains a lot. We do see surfers pretty much every time we go out. Different boats, all non Yamahas. And I have noticed they were always moving in a large circle in a section of the bay, circling surf side. I just thought they were trying to stay in calmer water. Their wake really rocks us while at anchor. Obviously they do not have a wake wedge for straight surfing or they just like going around in circles. As far as hate, I hear you, we have been in several (3) law suits over our property (land) since 2004 and we are still in one now, easements, PITA. Be patient the legal system moves slowly. We love your content, yours keeps me coming back. In my posts over the last 15 mos., I have posted about what I consider design issues, mostly water draining to the bow and not the stern, but that is not life threatening. Keep up the good fight my forum friend.

 

[swatski]

Regarding the VHF radio interference issue, it has already been verified by us and our customer who originally experienced the issue. We're really just waiting on final-final confirmation that the issue has been solved since it is a bit of a hassle to return the throttle nodes for the fix. That said, anyone who wants to can return them early (i.e. if they have a need to use their VHF radio for a trip or the like) and we'll be happy to get the fix in.

Awesome! Keep us posted.
So the fix is in the throttle nodes, not the "brain", hah!

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[Ridesteady]

@swatski Yeah, apparently the throttle nodes don't like to be interfered with...

 

[J-RAD]

Yes, slow surf side turn is still THE trick, that is why @jcyamaharider developed the Wedge, to be able to surf in strait line. I would buy the Wedge for sure, but my boat may become a donation to a charity (I hate Yamaha so much right now), lol.
The tab mod (the "beast") works, kind of. It can be very effective BUT only under extremely narrow conditions. The two major drawbacks are: 1. to be effective it needs to be so big that it interferes with normal cruising (I can not get it out of the water by just retracting the tab) - and there is nothing that can be done about it because of the way the transom is curved, just not enough space), 2. the beast deployment (which is mounted on the tab opposite to surf side) forces one to steer into the surf side - which pushes some water over the surf surface - not ideal.

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There's obviously a science to the surfing wave and hundreds of ways to go about it (example: wake wedge, Surf Pointe, delayed convergence, "the beast", etc...) there's obviously more than one way to go about it and who says the best isn't yet to come. I wouldn't mind messing around a bit testing an idea or two... but I fear I'd get into trouble spending to much time wiping the wrong baby's ass...

It still SUPER SUCKS you've been put at odds with Yamaha the way you have. I feel the disappointment. But we don't need to get into that argument again here... there's 17 pages of that elsewhere. Nothing else to say, but I don't blame you for feeling the way you do and I hope the outcome proves positive.

 

[renrab]

@Ridesteady how about a group buy??

 

[FloJet]

Finally Ridesteady installed and I tested it on Saturday. All I can say is WOW. So so loving this thing. The way it was able to keep the speed within .2 mph on turns was just too amazing. The system can do so much, it's going to take awhile before I can figure out how it all works. But with test runs in the RPM mode and GPS mode, everything ran flawlessly. The ability to change the GPS speeds or RPMs without touching the throttles is excellent. Now my engines also sync together and I get more pleasant cruising speeds. Thank you all for helping me make this great investment. Well worth it. Putting this gadget with trim tabs is going to be amazing IMO.

 

[cj3737]

Hate to jack the thread guys, but, does this work as well on the singles? I know the synchro is out the window but all the other benefits sound amazing.. Is there another identical discussion on the 190/192/195 users?