Thoughts and demo rides of wake / towsports boats: Moomba Max, Axis A22, MB Sports

[OrangeTJ]

So last Saturday I went to Madison, WI to look at some Malibu boats. First was a 21' Malibu on their showroom. Not impressed with the lack of a walk through on the stern, the bow "tub only seating", and the real lack of quality. 100k+ boat and the seats aren't on hinges when you open them? Carpet underneath the bolster seat?? The 2021 model in the showroom had the tower folded because it actually broke and was waiting on warranty repair?! LOL damn.

The salesman, who was really nice, took me to see a 23' Malibu they had in another building. This one had a lot more room (obviously) but still had the same goofy design in the bow where they front ballast tank prevented the bow seating to actually have a walking area. Furthermore, my wife and cousin attempted to both sit in the bow, each on opposite sides, and their feet had to cross significantly in that position.

The 23' had a nice Wet Sounds system that sounded decent. Not sure how it compared to my current JL, seemed to close enough. This boat had the Monsoon engine, and when I asked about some of the issues with those motors the sales guy was like "yeah well, what do you expect when you build your own engine?" OK - hard pass on that. This was another 100k+ dollar boat, still no walk through, still cheap feeling vinyl and cushions, and honestly, really disappointing for the price. And the swim platform ladder wasn't included or available? Sheeshe....

I'm still struggling to understand where all the cost (price) is in these boats? Are the engines really that much more to build? Are they laying the fiberglass differently? At least on the Malibu, there certainly wasn't anything there that screamed "this is why this boat is so expensive" - seemed more like "we charge this much because we can."

On to looking at other brands I guess.

Look at other brands. There are different layouts that put more or less emphasis on bow seating. Malibu tends to put little up there and more behind the windshield, as that seems to be what lots of wakeboat people prefer. Malibu seems to have come downhill in recent years in terms of build quality, IMO. One note re. fiberglass (and this isn't specific to wakeboats) - push on the side of a Yamaha and then push on the side of most any other fiberglass boat. I know that on our Yamaha, you could easily flex the hull by pushing on it. On our MB, not going to happen.

 

[sleek98]

Part of it is the tech that goes into the surf systems and the programming behind it. Part of it is the fact that they can.

 

[ripler]

So last Saturday I went to Madison, WI to look at some Malibu boats. First was a 21' Malibu on their showroom. Not impressed with the lack of a walk through on the stern, the bow "tub only seating", and the real lack of quality. 100k+ boat and the seats aren't on hinges when you open them? Carpet underneath the bolster seat?? The 2021 model in the showroom had the tower folded because it actually broke and was waiting on warranty repair?! LOL damn.

The salesman, who was really nice, took me to see a 23' Malibu they had in another building. This one had a lot more room (obviously) but still had the same goofy design in the bow where they front ballast tank prevented the bow seating to actually have a walking area. Furthermore, my wife and cousin attempted to both sit in the bow, each on opposite sides, and their feet had to cross significantly in that position.

The 23' had a nice Wet Sounds system that sounded decent. Not sure how it compared to my current JL, seemed to close enough. This boat had the Monsoon engine, and when I asked about some of the issues with those motors the sales guy was like "yeah well, what do you expect when you build your own engine?" OK - hard pass on that. This was another 100k+ dollar boat, still no walk through, still cheap feeling vinyl and cushions, and honestly, really disappointing for the price. And the swim platform ladder wasn't included or available? Sheeshe....

I'm still struggling to understand where all the cost (price) is in these boats? Are the engines really that much more to build? Are they laying the fiberglass differently? At least on the Malibu, there certainly wasn't anything there that screamed "this is why this boat is so expensive" - seemed more like "we charge this much because we can."

On to looking at other brands I guess.

I just bought a Mastercraft NXT20 and even though it's their value line, I think the quality is top notch. Depending on the size you are looking for you can get into a NXT22 that's well equipped for 85K and they just introduced a NXT24 which can be had for about 95K. I liked the simplicity of the NXT line, no touchscreens. Mastercraft has 5 year bow to stern warranty and a 7 year 1000 hour Ilmor engine warranty. The trailer is 100% engineered and built by Mastercraft and comes standard with stern steps, bow step, Fulton winch and jack, LED lighting which includes backup lights. Mastercraft is the only company that keeps their name on the value line and they are built in the same factory side by side with the more expensive models. They redesigned the NXT line for 2020 making them wider, the hull was redesigned and has the same look as the more expensive models.

 

[JDub]

Hopefully the new hull improves the wave. I rode a 2016 nxt 22 and the wave behind my 242x was better. Maybe they didn't have it diled In? Maybe v drives don't like deep water? They could switch sides faster and didnt have to bolt on a wake booster though. I also run 300 lbs of lead.

 

[haknslash]

The newer NXT’s are said to perform much better for surfing and water sports than the previous designs. Of course drives like deep water lol. More than likely they didn’t have it dialed in though.

 

[haknslash]

So last Saturday I went to Madison, WI to look at some Malibu boats. First was a 21' Malibu on their showroom. Not impressed with the lack of a walk through on the stern, the bow "tub only seating", and the real lack of quality. 100k+ boat and the seats aren't on hinges when you open them? Carpet underneath the bolster seat?? The 2021 model in the showroom had the tower folded because it actually broke and was waiting on warranty repair?! LOL damn.

The salesman, who was really nice, took me to see a 23' Malibu they had in another building. This one had a lot more room (obviously) but still had the same goofy design in the bow where they front ballast tank prevented the bow seating to actually have a walking area. Furthermore, my wife and cousin attempted to both sit in the bow, each on opposite sides, and their feet had to cross significantly in that position.

The 23' had a nice Wet Sounds system that sounded decent. Not sure how it compared to my current JL, seemed to close enough. This boat had the Monsoon engine, and when I asked about some of the issues with those motors the sales guy was like "yeah well, what do you expect when you build your own engine?" OK - hard pass on that. This was another 100k+ dollar boat, still no walk through, still cheap feeling vinyl and cushions, and honestly, really disappointing for the price. And the swim platform ladder wasn't included or available? Sheeshe....

I'm still struggling to understand where all the cost (price) is in these boats? Are the engines really that much more to build? Are they laying the fiberglass differently? At least on the Malibu, there certainly wasn't anything there that screamed "this is why this boat is so expensive" - seemed more like "we charge this much because we can."

On to looking at other brands I guess.

As Orange mentioned you need to look at other brands. Malibu’s have more of a “cab forward” design if thinking in terms of a car where their bow is smaller and the cockpit is more emphasized and larger. Other brands may have the helm more centrally located to balance out the space in the cockpit while allowing for a larger bow. You need to list out what is most important to you and the layout you want and then narrow in your research to brands that offer those things you’re most interested in. Malibu has been having some issues if you go on their Facebook owners group. Lots of impellers being chewed up within a few hours. I wasn’t impressed with them when we were shopping when you compare themto the other higher end brands. what is your budget?

 

[anmut]

I just bought a Mastercraft NXT20 and even though it's their value line, I think the quality is top notch. Depending on the size you are looking for you can get into a NXT22 that's well equipped for 85K and they just introduced a NXT24 which can be had for about 95K. I liked the simplicity of the NXT line, no touchscreens. Mastercraft has 5 year bow to stern warranty and a 7 year 1000 hour Ilmor engine warranty. The trailer is 100% engineered and built by Mastercraft and comes standard with stern steps, bow step, Fulton winch and jack, LED lighting which includes backup lights. Mastercraft is the only company that keeps their name on the value line and they are built in the same factory side by side with the more expensive models. They redesigned the NXT line for 2020 making them wider, the hull was redesigned and has the same look as the more expensive models.

That's very interesting. I like the idea of less tech too, less pieces to go wrong when it's out of warranty. How much onboard ballast and storage do you have? How does it surf? I really want to find something that will give me a decent wave out of the box - I don't want to buy a 90k boat and have to waste time and space filling bags on the floor.

 

[anmut]

As Orange mentioned you need to look at other brands. Malibu’s have more of a “cab forward” design if thinking in terms of a car where their bow is smaller and the cockpit is more emphasized and larger. Other brands may have the helm more centrally located to balance out the space in the cockpit while allowing for a larger bow. You need to list out what is most important to you and the layout you want and then narrow in your research to brands that offer those things you’re most interested in. Malibu has been having some issues if you go on their Facebook owners group. Lots of impellers being chewed up within a few hours. I wasn’t impressed with them when we were shopping when you compare themto the other higher end brands. what is your budget?

I'd like to stay under 120k MSRP - which would give me (hopefully) some room for negotiation. Agreed that Malibus aren't my jam - I'll be looking at the others over the next few months.

 

[ripler]

That's very interesting. I like the idea of less tech too, less pieces to go wrong when it's out of warranty. How much onboard ballast and storage do you have? How does it surf? I really want to find something that will give me a decent wave out of the box - I don't want to buy a 90k boat and have to waste time and space filling bags on the floor.

My NXT20 has about 1800lb from the factory, I'm probably going to add about 300 more "lead" ballast since most of the time we will only have 3 on board. Mastercraft specs say 80 cubic feet of storage, I was worried about storage originally since we had a lot of storage on our SX210, but I'm sure we will be fine. I haven't surfed it yet since we brought it home 2 weeks ago and it went straight into the garage since our season is over. Our boat had a MSRP of 105K and I was able to get it for under 75K, I also had the dealer add surf pockets and a walkthrough door for free, which was probably close to 800.00 in options. If I had the capability of storing the NXT22 I would have bought it, not only is it 2' longer it has a higher freeboard, but my garage wouldn't allow it.

Here's a video I took on our demo, factory ballast full with me, my wife and the salesman on board. He set it to the factory profile and didn't touch it, so this wave wasn't tweeked.

Here's a video of someone surfing a NXT20.

 

[haknslash]

That's very interesting. I like the idea of less tech too, less pieces to go wrong when it's out of warranty. How much onboard ballast and storage do you have? How does it surf? I really want to find something that will give me a decent wave out of the box - I don't want to buy a 90k boat and have to waste time and space filling bags on the floor.

All of these boats will throw a decent wave stock but most people will like a bigger wave. Most entry level surf boats will require some additional ballast if you don’t have a large crew and want a big. Some of them can be optioned from the factory with a “PNP” option which is usually additional ballast bags integrated with the hard tanks or other bags onboard. The days of having bags on the floor and on the seats in these boats is kind of gone since Wakemakers and other brands make plug and play bags that tie into your existing ballast. These bags go in the compartments. The bigger the boat the more it’s designed for a larger crew and the more it needs to displace with weight to make a big wave. There is a sweet spot on boat length vs crew size and generally that is the 21-23’ length. The smaller boats require less additional ballast to make a big wave. The higher end boats will weigh more which helps them not need quite as much additional ballast if they have a light or small crew onboard.

 

[anmut]

My NXT20 has about 1800lb from the factory, I'm probably going to add about 300 more "lead" ballast since most of the time we will only have 3 on board. Mastercraft specs say 80 cubic feet of storage, I was worried about storage originally since we had a lot of storage on our SX210, but I'm sure we will be fine. I haven't surfed it yet since we brought it home 2 weeks ago and it went straight into the garage since our season is over. Our boat had a MSRP of 105K and I was able to get it for under 75K, I also had the dealer add surf pockets and a walkthrough door for free, which was probably close to 800.00 in options. If I had the capability of storing the NXT22 I would have bought it, not only is it 2' longer it has a higher freeboard, but my garage wouldn't allow it.

Here's a video I took on our demo, factory ballast full with me, my wife and the salesman on board. He set it to the factory profile and didn't touch it, so this wave wasn't tweeked.

Here's a video of someone surfing a NXT20.

Cool video, thanks for sharing. Your video looked more impressive than the MC factory video - they used a looooong board for that demo! What are your thoughts on missing out on a walk through on the transom? My wife hates the idea of having to step on and over an engine cover.

 

[ripler]

Cool video, thanks for sharing. Your video looked more impressive than the MC factory video - they used a looooong board for that demo! What are your thoughts on missing out on a walk through on the transom? My wife hates the idea of having to step on and over an engine cover.

Truthfully I never gave the walkthrough a thought. I know that the platform on my boat sits right at water level so to board my boat from the dock you wouldn't be stepping in from the platform and to step from the dock to a transom walkthrough would be a huge step.

The GEN2 surf system comes from the factory with underfloor hard ballast and transom PNP bags standard.

Here's some pics of our boat.

 

[haknslash]

I wished my platform sat that low without ballast. That’s why I’m adding a ladder in the winter.

 

[DavisAR195]

I have a 2019 NXT22 and I'm very happy with it after 3 purchases. The boat has 2,150 lbs. in ballast stock which consists of three hard tanks and piggy back ballast bags on top of the rear hard tanks. Most all NXT owners upgrade the 400lbs piggyback ballast bags to wakemakers 710 lbs. bags. Now were at 2,770 lbs. of plumbed ballast. In addition to the upgraded bags, I run an additional 600lbs. of lead. I place 200 lbs. under each rear bag and 100 lbs. on each side at the base of the tower. Total ballast with lead = 3,370 lbs. Since I have a 2019 with the 5.7l I swapped out props to help handle the extra weight. However the newer models with the 6.0l may not need to swap out props.

Cost
- WakeMakers Bags $400
- 600 lbs. lead $650
- Prop = $600

 

[Brad460]

Truthfully I never gave the walkthrough a thought. I know that the platform on my boat sits right at water level so to board my boat from the dock you wouldn't be stepping in from the platform and to step from the dock to a transom walkthrough would be a huge step.

The GEN2 surf system comes from the factory with underfloor hard ballast and transom PNP bags standard.

Here's some pics of our boat.


View attachment 135372
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View attachment 135377

Very nice looking boat!

Don’t take this wrong, but your still paying a lot for the MasterCraft name even with the NXT line...$75k for a 20’ boat with a very slimmed down tower, minimal interior features, 1800 lbs of ballast and a single axle trailer is a lot..

 

[ripler]

Very nice looking boat!

Don’t take this wrong, but your still paying a lot for the MasterCraft name even with the NXT line...$75k for a 20’ boat with a very slimmed down tower, minimal interior features, 1800 lbs of ballast and a single axle trailer is a lot..

I bought the MasterCraft for way less than I could have bought other 20' boats that we looked at and we really didn't like either of the other boats we looked at. I'm not sure what you mean by slimmed down tower, it has swivel racks and a bimini that will cover the entire cockpit and it's the same one used on the MasterCraft XT line. If minimal interior features you mean no touchscreens and other useless electronics that are only there to look impressive, yep that's exactly what I wanted. If the boat will surf well with 1800lbs of ballast, does it really matter? The single axle trailer doesn't bother me, I garage my boat and it's easier to maneuver than my Yamaha which had the dual axle trailer.

 

[CanTex]

I have a 2019 NXT22 and I'm very happy with it after 3 purchases. The boat has 2,150 lbs. in ballast stock which consists of three hard tanks and piggy back ballast bags on top of the rear hard tanks. Most all NXT owners upgrade the 400lbs piggyback ballast bags to wakemakers 710 lbs. bags. Now were at 2,770 lbs. of plumbed ballast. In addition to the upgraded bags, I run an additional 600lbs. of lead. I place 200 lbs. under each rear bag and 100 lbs. on each side at the base of the tower. Total ballast with lead = 3,370 lbs. Since I have a 2019 with the 5.7l I swapped out props to help handle the extra weight. However the newer models with the 6.0l may not need to swap out props.

Cost
- WakeMakers Bags $400
- 600 lbs. lead $650
- Prop = $600
View attachment 135383

Also have a 2019 Mastercraft NXT 22...did almost exact same mods to enhance the surf wave (swap out rear bags to 710's and added 500lbs of steel shot). Very happy with the boat and surf wave, simple electronic interface is my preference for me.

 

[suke]

Also have a 2019 Mastercraft NXT 22...did almost exact same mods to enhance the surf wave (swap out rear bags to 710's and added 500lbs of steel shot). Very happy with the boat and surf wave, simple electronic interface is my preference for me. View attachment 135424

I dunno why, but that rear arch just reminds me of an old cadillac. Can't quite tell if I like it or not everytime I see one. There's one that I see running around my local lake.

 

[OrangeTJ]

I bought the MasterCraft for way less than I could have bought other 20' boats that we looked at and we really didn't like either of the other boats we looked at. I'm not sure what you mean by slimmed down tower, it has swivel racks and a bimini that will cover the entire cockpit and it's the same one used on the MasterCraft XT line. If minimal interior features you mean no touchscreens and other useless electronics that are only there to look impressive, yep that's exactly what I wanted. If the boat will surf well with 1800lbs of ballast, does it really matter? The single axle trailer doesn't bother me, I garage my boat and it's easier to maneuver than my Yamaha which had the dual axle trailer.

I'd far sooner pay $75K for your NXT than close to $60K for any jet driven "wake" boat. I'm with you on the general aversion to touchscreens and whatnot, which is one of the reasons we chose our MB. Generally speaking, boats are expensive toys and some are more expensive than others. Watersports boats tend to be a bit more expensive foot for foot than general purpose sterndrive or outboard runabouts. But if you want the watersports performance that they have to offer, really nothing else will do.

 

[haknslash]

Agreed!