Towing with Tesla Model X

[2kwik4u]

Yep, that 300 straight 6 with the oil leaking out the valve cover to the exhaust manifold. That brings back memories.

My grandfather custom ordered a 1995 F150 with a 5.0L straight six, 4wd, Long bed and Regular cab. In gray. We called it the elephant. He loved that truck until we stopped letting him drive.

I remember that thing was slower than molasses, but would pull a small house at the exact same speed. Had a really interesting sound at full throttle as well. I'll try to snap a pic the next time I see it (Uncle owns it now).

Horsepower TV rescued one of those engines from an old Genset in a field. Made something like 48hp and 200ft-lb right off the pallet. They added a ton of upgrades and some forced induction and got it well into 500hp territory for not much cash.

In other thoughts, I have always wanted to put a 4.2L straight six from a Trailblazer into an S10. Add some boost and go out hunting for Supras.

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

I have no plans on giving up my Ram, but we are beginning to think about a new vehicle for my wife. We are in no hurry and are excited to see what 2022/2023 brings as lot of manufacturers start introducing new electric vehicles! Our budget is smaller than most of yours (we want to keep it in the 40's) and I will continue to have my Ram as our tow vehicle. We do have some interest in the Nissan Ariya and are looking forward to seeing one in person.

Speaking of the Nissan Ariya, I ran across this youtube video that I found interesting on the robot build of the the Ariya,

Jim

 

[Peelz]

I have no plans on giving up my Ram, but we are beginning to think about a new vehicle for my wife. We are in no hurry and are excited to see what 2022/2023 brings as lot of manufacturers start introducing new electric vehicles! Our budget is smaller than most of yours (we want to keep it in the 40's) and I will continue to have my Ram as our tow vehicle. We do have some interest in the Nissan Ariya and are looking forward to seeing one in person.

Speaking of the Nissan Ariya, I ran across this youtube video that I found interesting on the robot build of the the Ariya,

Jim

I saw that one too!

I believe Tesla is years ahead for the moment, because the big automakers ignored the changes, and just kept banging out the same old cars.... BUT. once they pivot, they'll move relatively quickly and we should see some pretty cool advancements. The Cadillac Lyriq looks excellent as well.

Ill need a truck though, so my eyes are on the Cyber, F150 and Rivian.

 

[2kwik4u]

I saw that one too!

I believe Tesla is years ahead for the moment, because the big automakers ignored the changes, and just kept banging out the same old cars.... BUT. once they pivot, they'll move relatively quickly and we should see some pretty cool advancements. The Cadillac Lyriq looks excellent as well.

Ill need a truck though, so my eyes are on the Cyber, F150 and Rivian.

100% agree here, and I think Tesla's "innovative edge" is already showing some cracks in the armor. Things like GM's SuperCruise, while late to the game, is every bit as good as Teslas tech. You've got Rivian that is struggling to scale at the moment, but has quality that is better than Tesla if they can maintain prototype levels through production. Then things like the Lightning that is essentially a "barely changed" pickup that just happens to have a different driveline in it and anyone can get in and immediately feel comfortable with. There is a LOT of competition coming, and I think we've just seen the tip of the iceberg at this point.

 

[J-RAD]

Rivian could get a major boost as they're set to go public this week. I believe shares begin trading on Wednesday. It should give them some cash to make some moves.

 

[Peelz]

100% agree here, and I think Tesla's "innovative edge" is already showing some cracks in the armor. Things like GM's SuperCruise, while late to the game, is every bit as good as Teslas tech. You've got Rivian that is struggling to scale at the moment, but has quality that is better than Tesla if they can maintain prototype levels through production. Then things like the Lightning that is essentially a "barely changed" pickup that just happens to have a different driveline in it and anyone can get in and immediately feel comfortable with. There is a LOT of competition coming, and I think we've just seen the tip of the iceberg at this point.

YEs the big companies wont be far behind. the f150 is a great way to do it. I cant find much wrong with that machine, huge frunk, power backup... BRILLIANT, and all within the package of the comfortably familiar and reliable F150. Make big changes, but....Move the needle JUST ENOUGH without upsetting the system. Smart move by Ford.

But I need that charging network out here in the rural areas to make it useful. We drive a LOT.

 

[2kwik4u]

YEs the big companies wont be far behind. the f150 is a great way to do it. I cant find much wrong with that machine, huge frunk, power backup... BRILLIANT, and all within the package of the comfortably familiar and reliable F150. Make big changes, but....Move the needle JUST ENOUGH without upsetting the system. Smart move by Ford.

But I need that charging network out here in the rural areas to make it useful. We drive a LOT.

yea, the charging network is still a big stumbling block for rural adoption, and I think you'll find a good number of those owners will be at the end of the adoption timeline. Farmers, Oil workers, Construction workers......Those are the guys that will be hard to serve with electric until power density on the batteries increases.

Was talking to my boss who has the Rivian on order about towing the boat and the range associated with it. He asked "Well, there's a campground right? Can't you just drop the boat off, then go park there to charge?".......I think he has a fundamental misunderstanding about how the campground/boat ramp is typically laid out . Interesting idea though. If we are to take it camping, no reason we couldn't grab some electrons while there, and get our range back. Otherwise we're on the edge of making most of our trips happen. Same rural charging issues though.

 

[2kwik4u]

Rivian could get a major boost as they're set to go public this week. I believe shares begin trading on Wednesday. It should give them some cash to make some moves.

I as trying to get in on the IPO, but the restrictions in place to participate through my Fidelity account are absurd. Something like having to have like $200k on hand, or verified assets, and then has to be invite only or something.

Any investors here have some thoughts on how to get in on the IPO? I wouldn't mind owning a few shares.

 

[Peelz]

yea, the charging network is still a big stumbling block for rural adoption, and I think you'll find a good number of those owners will be at the end of the adoption timeline. Farmers, Oil workers, Construction workers......Those are the guys that will be hard to serve with electric until power density on the batteries increases.

Was talking to my boss who has the Rivian on order about towing the boat and the range associated with it. He asked "Well, there's a campground right? Can't you just drop the boat off, then go park there to charge?".......I think he has a fundamental misunderstanding about how the campground/boat ramp is typically laid out . Interesting idea though. If we are to take it camping, no reason we couldn't grab some electrons while there, and get our range back. Otherwise we're on the edge of making most of our trips happen. Same rural charging issues though.

Very much on the edge of it working for us as a tow rig to our favorite lake over an hour away.. But the margin is tight. It works for the river. only 25 miles away. It would be easy money to add a charger at ramps, id pay extra for the convenience BUT. How to use them would be difficult should there be a queue. (problem for smarter people than me to solve-lol)

The camping thing, I know people that do that with them. Works great! Camp mode on the tesla is a great feature...keeping you warm/cool not having a generator or to leave an engine running.

I know Rivian is working on their charger networks at national parks and other outdoorsy attractions, for stuff like this.

 

[2kwik4u]

Very much on the edge of it working for us as a tow rig to our favorite lake over an hour away.. But the margin is tight. It works for the river. only 25 miles away. It would be easy money to add a charger at ramps, id pay extra for the convenience BUT. How to use them would be difficult should there be a queue. (problem for smarter people than me to solve-lol)

The camping thing, I know people that do that with them. Works great! Camp mode on the tesla is a great feature...keeping you warm/cool not having a generator or to leave an engine running.

I know Rivian is working on their charger networks at national parks and other outdoorsy attractions, for stuff like this.

We're very much the same way. 45miles to the nearest lake. 90mi round trip. I worked the math awhile back and it leaves like 5% overhead in the battery to make it there and back on a starting full charge with the 190 in tow. I'm sure a 240 or 252 would tax the capacity a bit more and I would be able to make it there, but maybe not home on a single charge. River is 6mi away, and the nearest ramp is 10. I can do that on a Friday night if I just commute to work/home and only go to river back.

As soon as you add an overnight, and assume 100mi of range loaded. I can make most lakes in the area, especially if I have access to a 240V plug overnight.

I also agree. I would pay to charge at the ramp. Hell, I would pay a premium (2x+ going rate in this area) to charge at the ramp. Many problems with getting power to the docks, as well as logistics of how to park/pay/charge while you're on the boat all day. Lots of logistics issues there to overcome. Hell we can't people to not take two spots, or to not block the handicap spots at the ramps as it is. I can't imagine the shenanigans around trying to have EV tow vehicle charging only, good grief!

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

Just out of curiosity, do the manufacturers give you the figures on truck battery range when towing or carrying a heavy payload or is something you calculate on the side?

Jim

 

[Tyguy]

Range is one of our critical purchase criteria with minimum 400 miles in normal driving (not towing). We want to be able to drive to and from the lakes we'll most commonly visit without recharging, so with towing in mind, that means lakes 100 miles away from our home assuming 50% towing range loss. I'd prefer 500 miles to account for eventual battery capacity loss, which means the Tesla is top of our list for that specific criteria.

The Rivian could also meet the minimum with their larger battery upgrade. I gave it some serious thought but then chose not to go with their truck.

Now the big question is how the feds will handle EV incentives, which could be significant based on the most recent discussions. Ford could be given an ability to pad their pricing if the feds stick with a union-only incentive.

 

[Tyguy]

Just out of curiosity, do the manufacturers give you the figures on truck battery range when towing or carrying a heavy payload or is something you calculate on the side?

No, unfortunately they do not, similar to ICE vehicles not listing their gas mileage while towing. It's all EPA-based testing criteria that drives the EV range rating. Rivian has stated to plan on 50% reduction while towing, which I think is pretty realistic in many conditions, but range degradation would be dependent on a lot of factors like drag coefficient of what's being towed, weight, elevation change, outside temperature, and much more.

 

[buckbuck]

The F150 will have built in range calculations as you drive with your trailer. That will sure help with the range anxiety.

 

[J-RAD]

I as trying to get in on the IPO, but the restrictions in place to participate through my Fidelity account are absurd. Something like having to have like $200k on hand, or verified assets, and then has to be invite only or something.

Any investors here have some thoughts on how to get in on the IPO? I wouldn't mind owning a few shares.

The Google machine yesterday was saying that initial shares would have those restrictions for early investors. I thought I read that the price of the stock would be set today and buying would start Wednesday. I'm just an amateur Robinhood investor... I have yet to see it listed their platform.

 

[Peelz]

The F150 will have built in range calculations as you drive with your trailer. That will sure help with the range anxiety.

I Certainly hope so. Tesla does this already and Its dead accurate. The right foot corrupts, and you can watch it wreck your range in real time lol

Eastern Colorado, INT. 76. And western nebraska on 80 Difficult to go slow. a couple times i kinda had to chill out, didn't like seeing less than 10% estimated percentage on supercharger arrival.

We hit Brush Colorado at 9%, that is the lowest we ever got.

Based on that run, driving 90+(100 for a minute or two lol) with a full car(not towing) dropped the range to an estimated 220-230 miles. Haven't towed yet, but guessing a 40-50% loss. Bigger hit than the ICE takes for sure which was. 30%. 18 mpg vs 12. Still MUCH cheaper though.

 

[adrianp89]

I Certainly hope so. Tesla does this already and Its dead accurate. The right foot corrupts, and you can watch it wreck your range in real time lol

Eastern Colorado, INT. 76. And western nebraska on 80 Difficult to go slow. a couple times i kinda had to chill out, didn't like seeing less than 10% estimated percentage on supercharger arrival.

We hit Brush Colorado at 9%, that is the lowest we ever got.

Based on that run, driving 90+(100 for a minute or two lol) with a full car(not towing) dropped the range to an estimated 220-230 miles. Haven't towed yet, but guessing a 40-50% loss. Bigger hit than the ICE takes for sure which was. 30%. 18 mpg vs 12. Still MUCH cheaper though.

The M3 range calculation is garbage. It doesn't seem to change at all based on speed and other usage factors.

 

[Peelz]

The M3 range calculation is garbage. It doesn't seem to change at all based on speed and other usage factors.

hmm, maybe because I have it set to display percentage on the main UI screen, not miles, I found that part useless lol I know most people keep miles up there. Do you do that too?

I only meant how it calculate in gps and the energy page.

 

[adrianp89]

hmm, maybe because I have it set to display percentage on the main UI screen, not miles, I found that part useless lol I know most people keep miles up there. Do you do that too?

I only meant how it calculate in gps and the energy page.

I got rid of miles because it was useless, just see % now.

 

[Tyguy]

The M3 range calculation is garbage. It doesn't seem to change at all based on speed and other usage factors.

Are you thinking of the one that's displayed near the speedometer, or the Energy graph where the map is usually displayed? I've found both to be pretty accurate unless something unexpected happens...like that 60-mph headwind and torrential downpour I hit in the middle of Kansas that doubled my energy output...but the Energy graph in particular has been fantastic. I love that it allows me to change how many miles in history it's using to predict consumption. Typically the maps-based estimates have been within a few % of actual and it seems to adapt quickly to changing conditions like temperature drops. I think the little meter near the speedo is the least accurate of the three options if conditions are averse, and I just keep mine set to battery % readout instead of miles/km.