Unsecured property tax bill- how to beat it <California tax>

[vinniedatorch]

Just got off the phone with LA county tax assessors office and they assured me i had to pay it "unsecured tax bill" no matter what. "This is the bill we have all been receiving as boat owners". So i decided to do some online research and started reading California's tax code and found out that if your unsecured property "boat" is not moored in California or in my case in LA county and you can prove it, then the reality is that they can waive it. But here's what you gotta do first:
1- your insurance information has a section that lists a location of mooring, use your river address, hopefully in AZ
2- You must also notify the DMV or AAA if you have it, of the boats mooring location because the assessors office uses DMV records to determine if you're going to get assessed or not.
3- Contact the assessors office @213-974-3119 (this is for LA county residents) if you're not in LA county google your assessors info and contact them. Ask to speak directly to an assessor and explain you have the aforementioned info and Viola! No more bullshit tax responsibility
You can thank me when we meet at the river.
This link is the legal mumbo jumbo needed to state your case to the assessor's office so they know you're not full of shit as a Christmas turkey-http://gruftlaw.com/vessel-owners-beware-you-may-not-have-to-pay-that-property-tax-bill/

 

[vinniedatorch]

http://gruftlaw.com/vessel-owners-beware-you-may-not-have-to-pay-that-property-tax-bill/

 

[renrab]

Jesus the man will tax anything

 

[Ronnie]

I’m not seeing how this would help a CA resident like me avoid the luxury tax on my boat. Per my county assessor all CA counties charge this tax and even though my boat is not moored but instead parked on the side of my house, it’s location in the county is the basis on which I am taxed. What am I missing? Seriously I think this tax is bs and would love to not pay it if I can do so legally. As it stands if I don’t pay the dmv will not allow me to license my boat the next time around.

 

[spatty99]

@Ronnie I don't think you are missing anything, with your boat being situated in the area, you have to pay the area taxes. This is for someone to claim (legit or otherwise) that their boat taxes fall under a different area/state/country's jurisdiction.

This ruling is why all the mega yachts are registered through the Cayman Islands, etc., even though they are used throughout US waters.

 

[Betik]

@JBehrens might have an impute here .

My recommendation is more like a question ..... is it really worthy it to leave in CA ? My wife and I have ready jobs there but we cannot bring our selfs to move there. The math does not add up. We have looked at it so many ways but but the premium is just too high

 

[bronze_10]

I read an article that says 50% of the population of the state said they want to move out of the state. Not sure of the sorce u get the point.

 

[vinniedatorch]

I’m not seeing how this would help a CA resident like me avoid the luxury tax on my boat. Per my county assessor all CA counties charge this tax and even though my boat is not moored but instead parked on the side of my house, it’s location in the county is the basis on which I am taxed. What am I missing? Seriously I think this tax is bs and would love to not pay it if I can do so legally. As it stands if I don’t pay the dmv will not allow me to license my boat the next time around.

Ronnie,
Maybe you haven't read the post clearly, the reason this was posted is because i have a different situation than you. I'm a resident in the county of LA but i own a home in Arizona where my boat is parked. The insurance company required that i show the address or location of mooring for purposes of insuring it. Because i can prove or show the county o LA that my boat is never parked at my residence in LA, there is no tax responsibility. You on the other hand suggested your boat is parked at your place of residence (whatever county in Ca that may be) so you are responsible to the tax in that county within Ca. Its that simple and the info I've provided is going to benefit boat owners that may be in a situation like mine where their boat is parked or moored outside of Ca. Not sure if any other states have the same aggressive tax as Ca. but i know Arizona does not.

 

[vinniedatorch]

@JBehrens might have an impute here .

My recommendation is more like a question ..... is it really worthy it to leave in CA ? My wife and I have ready jobs there but we cannot bring our selfs to move there. The math does not add up. We have looked at it so many ways but but the premium is just too high

Betic,
It wont be long and we're heading your direction.

 

[Ronnie]

@vinniedatorch , you are correct I did not see that the AR aspect of your post. I wonder how many people are in your position though? I would take advantage of this if I was. Currently I pay 1% of the boat/hull value every year for this tax. If you are late the fee goes up like it would for dmv registration fees.

I’m surprised they haven’t figured out a way to close this loop hole, probably not worth the expense monitoring and tracking use would cost. I recall that some boat/yacht buyers used to boat to international waters to take title which allows them to avoid some taxes but also thought they revised the tax code to prevent that from happening anymore.

Speaking of moving out of state, I just heard the results of a poll on the subject on the radio while driving in to work. More than 50% of those asked say they are moving away or would. The major drivers being the cost of housing and horrendous commutes. What I see is if you want to live close to work it’s going to cost you. Example. A single family home in Cupertino near Apple is $1m+ at least, if you can find one, one being a 40 year old 1800 sq. Ft. House. The same house 30 miles / one to two hours away is $500k, 50 miles / two to three hours away it’s $250k. THe same applies to homes in SF. There is also a ballot measure to raise the bay bridge toll to $9 from the $6 current price. Before the quake in 1989 the price was $1. It went up to $2 supposedly temporarily right after the quake. Imagine paying $45 to get over the bridge per week, $180 per month. This in addition to other costs of owning a vehicle.

 

[djetok]

@vinniedatorch , you are correct I did not see that the AR aspect of your post. I wonder how many people are in your position though? I would take advantage of this if I was. Currently I pay 1% of the boat/hull value every year for this tax. If you are late the fee goes up like it would for dmv registration fees.

I’m surprised they haven’t figured out a way to close this loop hole, probably not worth the expense monitoring and tracking use would cost. I recall that some boat/yacht buyers used to boat to international waters to take title which allows them to avoid some taxes but also thought they revised the tax code to prevent that from happening anymore.

Speaking of moving out of state, I just heard the results of a poll on the subject on the radio while driving in to work. More than 50% of those asked say they are moving away or would. The major drivers being the cost of housing and horrendous commutes. What I see is if you want to live close to work it’s going to cost you. Example. A single family home in Cupertino near Apple is $1m+ at least, if you can find one, one being a 40 year old 1800 sq. Ft. House. The same house 30 miles / one to two hours away is $500k, 50 miles / two to three hours away it’s $250k. THe same applies to homes in SF. There is also a ballot measure to raise the bay bridge toll to $9 from the $6 current price. Before the quake in 1989 the price was $1. It went up to $2 supposedly temporarily right after the quake. Imagine paying $45 to get over the bridge per week, $180 per month. This in addition to other costs of owning a vehicle.

There is no insane emoji. I honestly do not know how people do it. My tax basis is way , way lower and my cost of living is as well. I realize California is a more attractive place to live with the scenery, but with everything else I do not think I could do it.

 

[Jgorm]

I could never live in the bay area again. After school i promptly retuned to San Diego. I could make 10 to 20% more up there in biotech, but the politics and cost keep me out. I'm a ca resident with Arizona property where my boat will be. Thanks @vinniedatorch

 

[adrianp89]

You couldn't pay me to live in California. I will stick to living with Florida man lol.

 

[Ronnie]

If I wasn’t born and raised here, actually if my family and friends were not here I wouldn’t live here either. By the way the luxury tax bill burns just a little more when i review it because almost none of the money goes to things that are even remotely related to boating. More like x% to study traffic congestion, y% for the schools and z% for homeless programs, the list goes on and on without water or boating ever being mentioned.

On a semi related note, I will never understand why we pay some of the highest prices in the nation for gas when so much of it either passes through the state or is refined in the state.

 

[JBehrens]

This thread should be renamed to "everything wrong with California" being born and raised here with a good portion of my family and work here it is hard to leave but just as hard to stay. This state is a nightmare and will unfortunately only get worse before it gets better...

As for the tax, California luxury tax is the biggest BS I have ever seen. The solution, register in Arizona and don't look back. For me I only saved a few bucks by the time it's all said and done because the skis don't cost a lot to register in the first place but someone like my uncle who has a top end Monterey ended up saving a good amount. The interesting thing is, regardless of where you live, your boat is supposed to be registered in the state of primary use. For the most part everywhere I go is considered Arizona waters so I'm technically doing it correctly if the tax collector ever nocks on my door.

 

[MattFX4]

Doesn't matter. They will raise taxes in other areas when they need their money. Or they will find a way to close this loophole. Used to be able to buy used cars from private sellers here in Georgia and pay no sales tax. Well they introduced the TAVT tax so now if you buy a used car from a private seller you have to pay 7% tax when you register the car.

 

[Jgorm]

This thread should be renamed to "everything wrong with California" being born and raised here with a good portion of my family and work here it is hard to leave but just as hard to stay. This state is a nightmare and will unfortunately only get worse before it gets better...

As for the tax, California luxury tax is the biggest BS I have ever seen. The solution, register in Arizona and don't look back. For me I only saved a few bucks by the time it's all said and done because the skis don't cost a lot to register in the first place but someone like my uncle who has a top end Monterey ended up saving a good amount. The interesting thing is, regardless of where you live, your boat is supposed to be registered in the state of primary use. For the most part everywhere I go is considered Arizona waters so I'm technically doing it correctly if the tax collector ever nocks on my door.

But az makes it hard to register as a resident. The out of state fees are 10x the in state. I heard you need a federal tax return as proof of residency. I'm going to register in ca and pay the tax to save on the yearly fees. Break even is about 5 yr.

 

[Ronnie]

On a related note I thought jet skis/pwcs were exempt from this tax in CA because I hadn’t been charged for any of them in the past. However I bought a used fx140 at the end of 2017 and sure enough the assessor sent me a questionaire and eventually a tax bill on it. I have to wonder how CA is managing all this tax revenue when they can justify the effort it takes to collect under $30 in luxury tax on a low dollar vehicle.

FYI I am charged my county’s sales tax rate (9.5 or 9.75%) when I take title to a vehicle regardless of where I bought it.

 

[Matt Phillips]

Yep. I live in Santa Clara County (Bay Area) but boat Primarily in El Dorado County (Lake Tahoe). I pay taxes in El Dorado County as the rate is lower than in the Bay Area.

Now don't get me started on their valuation for this year. It seems the county assessors office wants to believe that my boat is worth $74,500. Mind you that's about $2,500 MORE than what MSRP was on it last year when I bought it, and it's even MORE than what the 2018s cost. Needless to say we are tussling over that valuation. I looked it up and the assessors board recommends 97% of payment price on a first year valuation....but of course I argued what the boat is currently worth according to NADA. I also had to point out that these boats are sold as a package with the trailer, and this tax is ONLY on the boat, and so they need to deduct for the price of the trailer.

Now I await their response...

 

[Ronnie]

Please follow up with their response @Matt Phillips , I know it’s not much but if I can keep a few dollars going forward I want to. FYI this is the first year I have noticed the luxury tax go down on my boat since I got it in 2012 the annual tax has always been over $300, this year it was just under $300 as I recall.