Who would be interested in a group buy on impellers?

[OperationROL]

Fair enough. The SS ones will definitely wear less, but that means the impellers are more likely to get worn instead. There is a trade off to either.

 

[Bruce]

@CrankyGypsy, is the white wear ring pictured yours? What happened to it? It looks like that impeller must have had bearing issues to bite into the plastic like that.

I am comfortable that the plastic wear rings will need to be replaced more often. They are cheap and I believe fairly easy to replace. I would keep a spare set on hand.

 

[CrankyGypsy]

not mine. there's a rock stuck in there that kept spinning, scored and melted the ring.

 

[Bruce]

not mine. there's a rock stuck in there that kept spinning, scored and melted the ring.

Do you have a picture of what yours looked like when you replaced it?

 

[CrankyGypsy]

mine didn't look too bad when i decided to replace it. i doubt a pic would show much since it's white. but it is grooved, resembling record/LP lines. they aren't deep but they are very easy to feel under your finger. the impeller was pretty worn and i'd guess it hadn't been replaced/refurbished since it came out of the showroom. it's definitely not so bad that i wasn't going to get another for the other pump ...i decided to go SS weeks later.

 

[Bruce]

I think the impeller and housing group buys would need to be separate so everyone can decide what kind of housing they want. I want to try the plastic version. I am fine with replacing them.

@CrankyGypsy do you know who manufactures the plastic lined impeller housing that was on your boat? I suspect there may be a difference in the SBT and RIVA products.

 

[Bruce]

I emailed four Solas impeller vendors to ask about a group buy for impellers only. I should know what we can get within a week.

I also started a discussion with he manufacturer of this $85 pump housing with a $27 replaceable wear ring http://www.precisionmarinetools.com/yamaha-waverunner-pwc-replacement-jet-pump-housing-p-1.html . They also offer a $150 version with a stainless wear ring. The manufacturer has 694 feedback on Ebay 99.6% of which is positive. They say that their products are used by many rental locations. I am waiting for more info. I should credit @Julian who discovered this product years ago.

I understand that replacing the factory pump housing which has a stainless wear ring with something with a plastic wear ring is controversial. In some instances the reaction between the factory aluminum housing and stainless wear ring causes the ring to contract and cause issues with the impeller. This may be the cause of the clang that most of us hear at idle. I spoke to a friend who is a marine mechanic today. He is a big fan of plastic wear rings and credits them for saving impellers. Personally I like the idea of being able to inexpensively replace the wear rings every few years. I do not like the idea of installing new impellers into housings that may be out of spec. I will keep a spare set of wear rings in the boat.

 

[Chillypilot]

Has anything happened with this? I'm defiantly looking at new impellers in the off season. I was hoping this group buy was going to happen.

 

[Bruce]

Has anything happened with this? I'm defiantly looking at new impellers in the off season. I was hoping this group buy was going to happen.

Me too. I contacted four vendors that were not interested. I am hoping they will become more interested in the off season as business slows.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

From first hand experience the plastic liners do not build up corrosion under them, this is a big plus for salt water boaters. With stainless liners as they expand they damage the edges of the impeller.
As for changing impellers, they are a real s. o. b. to remove. I have done several and I always give up trying .
I finally just cut them off with a plasma cutter and a cut off wheel, once I get close to going through I use a chisel and split it.
I have all the correct tools and even some custom made drive shaft holders plus huge pipe wrenches and big acetylene torches but try as I might I can never remove one and yes I know they are left hand thread .
Also I used a solas on the last one I did and I wished I had stayed with the factory impeller, the solas was a bit too aggressive and this killed the hole shot.
Just saying be aware of what you are getting into when you do impellers on a Yamaha. It's no picnic . I will say that I live very close to S B T and I buy my pump liners from them I also have had them recondition several sea doo impellers with very good results so this is another option if you are trying to save some money.

 

[redthumper9]

Anyone have any links to all this stuff you guys are talking about? I glance in my pumps from time to time just to see if the impellers look good, and I am aware that there are wear rings, but it's a subject that I'd like to learn more about. Any descriptive pictures out there?

 

[msavold]

Anyone have any links to all this stuff you guys are talking about? I glance in my pumps from time to time just to see if the impellers look good, and I am aware that there are wear rings, but it's a subject that I'd like to learn more about. Any descriptive pictures out there?

Me too! One summer of boating and in 40 hours I seem to average a piece of wood or a F*#@$*G pine cone (sharp pointy bits that bite back when you try to get them out!) every 10 hours or so, and the blade tips now have a few dings. When are the dings too many?

 

[Ronnie]

I bought Solas impellers from Impros. I told them that I boat mostly at sea level and that I wanted to improve acceleration (not top speed, these are inversely related). They inturn sold me the same model impeller for both sides and re pitched one or both accordingly. They intentionaly and understandably withheld what they re pitched it or them to. As a result my engines Rpms match throughout the throttle range and acceleration feels a lot better.

How many dings are too many? IMHO when you experience new and recurring cavitation or a loss in acceleration or top speed performance you may have too many dings in your impeller.

I've replaced wear rings in seadoo pwcs before. I didn't have to do it often (less than once every five years) but it was not what I consider easy to do. A hammer, block of wood and sawzaw were involved along with a lot of elbow grease. When or if my impeller housings wear down below spec I will add aftermarket wear rings but I'm not sure what they will be made of yet.

 

[Big Shasta]

Anyone have any links to all this stuff you guys are talking about? I glance in my pumps from time to time just to see if the impellers look good, and I am aware that there are wear rings, but it's a subject that I'd like to learn more about. Any descriptive pictures out there?

Here's a topic that I did when I replaced my bearings. It's basically complete tear down of the pumps. https://jetboaters.net/threads/impeller-bearings-trashed-lots-of-rebuild-pics-pg-6.2822/page-6 Back up to page one for the whole story (and ridiculous video of removing my stuck impeller shaft.)

You should consider pulling your pumps off each off season and checking the seals and bearings. It's really an easy job that would take you about an hour per side, maybe a little longer the first one.

Here's a shot of the OEM impeller and housing. The replaceable ring would be around the impeller instead of the stainless collar.

 

[swatski]

Last night, I replaced my OEM impeller and wear ring segment of the pump with Impros repitched Solas Concord and a new wear ring with plastic insert.
I'm about to take it out in the river for testing. I will post the results and pictures.
The boat has 30sth hours on it, the OEM parts looked basically brand new, so it should be a strait forward comparison of before and after.

 

[swatski]

Here is my quick take on the aftermarket impeller/wear ring modifications: work absolutely great, best mods yet.

Vastly improved hole shot and mid range; but lost 1-2mph top speed (47 at 7800 with OEM, 45-46 at 7600 with Solas). My impeller and wear ring look new, so that is not a factor.

The best is loss of vibrations across the RPM spectrum. The headache-inducing metallic vibe is completely gone, I credit the plastic insert.
The boat is MUCH quieter, and I can now cruise without loosing my hearing. It hits a sweet spot at around 6000RPM/~30mph where it is actually pretty quiet (!).

I will never go back to anything else than plastic inserts, even if i have to replace them every season.

As mentioned before, taking off the impeller is no picnic. But mine did (eventually) come off... After I ripped the vice off my work bench, I pinned it down with a truck... (someone here posted this trick - it was done with a black Wrangler, but I can't find that post now). I also used a 6ft long cheater arm... Everything else about this install was easy thanks to this board!

 

[Ronnie]

@swatski , i would love to know more about the new housing and wear ring insert, specifically what brand, how much and from who as I'm all about reducing the running volume. Please post pics when you get the chance. IMHO, it's not likely that a plastic wear ring will be damaged by the things that I commonly suck up during an outing and if I have to put a sacrificial part in the pump the wear ring is the best choice.

Incidentally, @CrankyGypsy is the member who used a jeep to hold down the shaft and impeller assemblies . I used his post as a guide when replacing my impellers.

 

[swatski]

Ronnie - You have been most helpful with your excellent, detailed write-ups, thank you!
Below is a copy of my invoice from Impros. (Hope I'm not breaking any rules here, other wise - the Administrator please remove the post).

My understanding is these parts will work on all single engine and starboard side 1.8l twins.

And thank you @CrankyGypsy, saved my day. It was about midnight and I was so tired, and I just recalled your jeep trick.

I know you are familiar with that outfit, I can not say enough good things about dealing with them, they are awesome. They are tight lipped about re-pitching details, which is fine. the only thing I can tell for sure is the impeller has been balanced, as evidenced by a series of drill holes on the inside.

Happy to comment/provide any additional details. Obviously, this is an experiment with the n=1, and I can not comment on longevity... That said, I am just amazed how well it worked. When my OEM impeller was out, I played with it inside the OEM wear ring, and it was making the dreaded noise... albeit these things are fitting so well, almost hard to turn. it was the same with the Solas, so I conclude the plastic wear ring really cushions the pump.
BTW - I am pretty much obsessed with noise reduction in my Yami... This will be another thread at some point, but let me just say I have so far inserted close to 200 lbs of sound deadening materials in my little SX190. I feel like I'm finally getting there, little by little...





Here is their info. They can be hard to get a hold of, but be patient everyone.

 

[swatski]

Here are the parts, new and old.
View attachment 29230




My pump came apart with no problems.


My OEM impeller and wear ring showed no damage whatsoever, but the boat is at only 30 sth hours, so no surprise.


The boat will run at 7700RPM with 45-46mph GPS, wind/no wind. It was running 7800RPM / 47mph (hitting the rev limiter) with the OEM impeller/wear ring. I dont think I'm hitting the rev limiter anymore. All after ribbon delete.
Please ignore depth finder. I have a Lowrance unit that was showing 20.5ft at that time.

 

[Bruce]

@swatski, thanks for posting we appreciate you sharing a positive experience with a vendor.