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Batteries… Yam 195s

Messages
3
Reaction score
0
Points
10
Boat Make
Yamaha
Year
2025
Boat Model
195S
Boat Length
19
I am at a bit of a loss of what to do next to at the very least make this safe. Works as it is but not ideal.

25 Yamaha 195s came with a single group24 starting battery.
I have added a set of 2 tower speakers (2 speakers each) this is set up on a 4 channel amp w/ a 10” sub.
Powered on the starting battery (I just start the boat often if we’re sitting to not drain the battery) I’ve gotten a few hours and haven’t had any problems but really just want more piece of mind…

I feel I screwed up and got a matching deep cycle but it’s a group 27… Feel like I should’ve swapped it for a dual purpose lithium to begin with?
Was going to add a 3 way Perko and associated wiring but now just constantly second guessing it.. the boat only has one damn spot for the battery and I would have to go pretty small to fit two in there so mounting a second battery means drilling more holes..
 
Lots and lots of threads on here about sound systems and battery capacity, some specific to your model of boat.

Number one piece of advice do this project correctly as the main driver and cost of the project as secondary. If you follow that simple guideline you’ll have a battery system that you’ll never have to think twice about.

1. Get a Victron smart shunt, they’re about $100 bucks and communicate with your smart device via Bluetooth. Then you will know; how much energy you are drawing, how much energy you have drawn out of your battery and the state of charge of your battery, anything else is just a guess, and if you’re guessing you cannot make educated economical decisions. You cannot use voltage on any lead acid battery to determine state of charge unless the battery sits isolated for 24 hours.

2. You need to set up a two battery system with a DVSR / ACR with an emergency paralleling switch so that your group 24 start battery is isolated from house loads such as your sound system. The BEP marine two battery switch with integrated DVSR that comes standard on the twin engine Yamaha boats is a great device, compact and fully automatic and the DVSR is configurable for automatic which is how it comes from the factory, storage mode or run hot mode, the run hot mode will be used with a LiFePO4 or LFP battery if you choose to go that route because you cannot leave a LFP battery tied to a lead acid battery or it will discharge into the lead acid battery due to its higher resting voltage. A lot of people set up the BEP marine battery switch to storage mode so that when the battery switches are off so is the DVSR and allows independent charging of the house and start battery.

LFP batteries are awesome in their capacity to store energy, more than two times that of a given size lead acid battery, half the weight. One of the main cost saving attributes of LFP batteries is their long life, 10,000-15,000 cycles if only discharged 50%, 5000-10,000 cycles if discharged to 80% and roughly 3000 cycles if discharged above 95%, the typical lead acid battery is good for roughly 500 cycles.

But the system LFP batteries are used in needs to be set up properly, also if you’re going to go the LFP battery route do not buy a cheap one, nothing good is cheap and nothing cheap is good. If you’re not willing to pay the price of a good LFP battery then stick with flooded lead acid FLA batteries and charge them properly.

3. Stick with a lead acid battery for your start battery, whether AGM or FLA.

4. If you do not have an on board charger, get one, a good one, I suggest at least 10A of charging power per battery, FLA batteries require 10-13% of Ah rating as the charge amperage, and all LFP batteries I’ve seen require a minimum of 10A of charging power per battery. Your boats charging system is limited to roughly 13A above 3500 rpm and roughly half of that at idle and are not capable of fully charging a FLA / AGM battery as those batteries require a very lengthy amount of time in the absorption phase of charging, up to 8 hours. The charging systems on our boats are well suited for LFP batteries. LFP batteries charge five times as fast as a FLA / AGM battery, and at a much higher rate so if you’re going to go the LFP route you might consider an onboard charger for the LFP battery that has a 25A charge rate. NOCO makes a good charger and you can get an AC charge port which makes plugging in the charger very simple. From my experience I have ended up with the Victron IP 67 battery chargers, Bluetooth enabled and fully configurable for any battery chemistry, and come with two charge rates in each model, mine are 25A or 10A and there are lower amperage versions each with two charge rates. When I started on this battery journey it would take 12-14 hours to recharge my FLA batteries with a 10A charger, now with LFP batteries and the 25A Victron it takes 3.5 hours. Again, if quality LFP batteries are not in the budget then just get FLA batteries, charge and care for them properly, keep them clean, check the electrolyte level, check the specific gravity and perform regular equalizing charges and you’ll get the best performance possible and the longest life. I prefer FLA over AGM as you can perform equalizing charges on FLA batteries and you cannot on AGM batteries, and FLA batteries typically have more Ah and cold cranking amps than AGM. The big advantage of AGM batteries is they are no maintenance other than charging, I have an interstate group 24 AGM dual purpose for my start battery and it has been working great for three years.

5. Use appropriate size conductors, using greatly oversized conductors for the application only increases cost and does nothing for performance.

6. Get a jump pack and leave it on your boat.

I spent quite a bit of time researching about LFP batteries before installing them in my boat and learned a lot along the way with my own efforts as well as input from others on this site. I started out replacing my trolling motor batteries with battle born LFP batteries then replaced my house battery with another battle born battery. Huge improvement in the trolling motor performance in so far as run time, same with the house battery..you can read about it here; Conversion to LiFePo batteries
 
Last edited:
Lots and lots of threads on here about sound systems and battery capacity, some specific to your model of boat.

Number one piece of advice do this project correctly as the main driver and cost of the project as secondary. If you follow that simple guideline you’ll have a battery system that you’ll never have to think twice about.

1. Get a Victron smart shunt, they’re about $100 bucks and communicate with your smart device via Bluetooth. Then you will know; how much energy you are drawing, how much energy you have drawn out of your battery and the state of charge of your battery, anything else is just a guess, and if you’re guessing you cannot make educated economical decisions. You cannot use voltage on any lead acid battery to determine state of charge unless the battery sits isolated for 24 hours.

2. You need to set up a two battery system with a DVSR / ACR with an emergency paralleling switch so that your group 24 start battery is isolated from house loads such as your sound system. The BEP marine two battery switch with integrated DVSR that comes standard on the twin engine Yamaha boats is a great device, compact and fully automatic and the DVSR is configurable for automatic which is how it comes from the factory, storage mode or run hot mode, the run hot mode will be used with a LiFePO4 or LFP battery if you choose to go that route because you cannot leave a LFP battery tied to a lead acid battery or it will discharge into the lead acid battery due to its higher resting voltage. A lot of people set up the BEP marine battery switch to storage mode so that when the battery switches are off so is the DVSR and allows independent charging of the house and start battery.

LFP batteries are awesome in their capacity to store energy, more than two times that of a given size lead acid battery, half the weight. One of the main cost saving attributes of LFP batteries is their long life, 10,000-15,000 cycles if only discharged 50%, 5000-10,000 cycles if discharged to 80% and roughly 3000 cycles if discharged above 95%, the typical lead acid battery is good for roughly 500 cycles.

But the system LFP batteries are used in needs to be set up properly, also if you’re going to go the LFP battery route do not buy a cheap one, nothing good is cheap and nothing cheap is good. If you’re not willing to pay the price of a good LFP battery then stick with flooded lead acid FLA batteries and charge them properly.

3. Stick with a lead acid battery for your start battery, whether AGM or FLA.

4. If you do not have an on board charger, get one, a good one, I suggest at least 10A of charging power per battery, FLA batteries require 10-13% of Ah rating as the charge amperage, and all LFP batteries I’ve seen require a minimum of 10A of charging power per battery. Your boats charging system is limited to roughly 13A above 3500 rpm and roughly half of that at idle and are not capable of fully charging a FLA / AGM battery as those batteries require a very lengthy amount of time in the absorption phase of charging, up to 8 hours. The charging systems on our boats are well suited for LFP batteries. LFP batteries charge five times as fast as a FLA / AGM battery, and at a much higher rate so if you’re going to go the LFP route you might consider an onboard charger for the LFP battery that has a 25A charge rate. NOCO makes a good charger and you can get an AC charge port which makes plugging in the charger very simple. From my experience I have ended up with the Victron IP 67 battery chargers, Bluetooth enabled and fully configurable for any battery chemistry, and come with two charge rates in each model, mine are 25A or 10A and there are lower amperage versions each with two charge rates. When I started on this battery journey it would take 12-14 hours to recharge my FLA batteries with a 10A charger, now with LFP batteries and the 25A Victron it takes 3.5 hours. Again, if quality LFP batteries are not in the budget then just get FLA batteries, charge and care for them properly, keep them clean, check the electrolyte level, check the specific gravity and perform regular equalizing charges and you’ll get the best performance possible and the longest life. I prefer FLA over AGM as you can perform equalizing charges on FLA batteries and you cannot on AGM batteries, and FLA batteries typically have more Ah and cold cranking amps than AGM. The big advantage of AGM batteries is they are no maintenance other than charging, I have an interstate group 24 AGM dual purpose for my start battery and it has been working great for three years.

5. Use appropriate size conductors, using greatly oversized conductors for the application only increases cost and does nothing for performance.

6. Get a jump pack and leave it on your boat.

I spent quite a bit of time researching about LFP batteries before installing them in my boat and learned a lot along the way with my own efforts as well as input from others on this site. I started out replacing my trolling motor batteries with battle born LFP batteries then replaced my house battery with another battle born battery. Huge improvement in the trolling motor performance in so far as run time, same with the house battery..you can read about it here; Conversion to LiFePo batteries
I was planning to use 4/0 for the battery connections, would this be appropriate?
Seems I need to start with the shunt and see what the actual usage is before doing anything else.

Can I setup these two batteries on the BEP switch and at the very least isolate the amp to the extra battery?
I brought up lithium but meant to say LFP and have found a dual purpose one the NOCO nlx27 it’s $900 but seems like it would accomplish what I’m looking for?

I’ve tried to read through quite a bit of these threads.. Glad I haven’t purchased a switch but do I currently need it even though everything “seems” ok? I suppose the shunt would confirm for the current setup…
I am trying to go a bit overkill so I don’t have to worry about it but still need to do it in steps... At this point not much more I want to do as far as adding powered accessories, I’ve got the setup pretty good now.
My only problem was the fact that this boat only comes with the single switch and one starting battery…
I was looking at the NOCO genius 5x2 for a charger but haven’t decided yet.. There is just so much information on this I think I’ve confused myself..

Sorry if I’m rambling a bit, if it’s not obvious I’m a little lost, it will be now. 🤣
 
Lots and lots of threads on here about sound systems and battery capacity, some specific to your model of boat.

Number one piece of advice do this project correctly as the main driver and cost of the project as secondary. If you follow that simple guideline you’ll have a battery system that you’ll never have to think twice about.

1. Get a Victron smart shunt, they’re about $100 bucks and communicate with your smart device via Bluetooth. Then you will know; how much energy you are drawing, how much energy you have drawn out of your battery and the state of charge of your battery, anything else is just a guess, and if you’re guessing you cannot make educated economical decisions. You cannot use voltage on any lead acid battery to determine state of charge unless the battery sits isolated for 24 hours.

2. You need to set up a two battery system with a DVSR / ACR with an emergency paralleling switch so that your group 24 start battery is isolated from house loads such as your sound system. The BEP marine two battery switch with integrated DVSR that comes standard on the twin engine Yamaha boats is a great device, compact and fully automatic and the DVSR is configurable for automatic which is how it comes from the factory, storage mode or run hot mode, the run hot mode will be used with a LiFePO4 or LFP battery if you choose to go that route because you cannot leave a LFP battery tied to a lead acid battery or it will discharge into the lead acid battery due to its higher resting voltage. A lot of people set up the BEP marine battery switch to storage mode so that when the battery switches are off so is the DVSR and allows independent charging of the house and start battery.

LFP batteries are awesome in their capacity to store energy, more than two times that of a given size lead acid battery, half the weight. One of the main cost saving attributes of LFP batteries is their long life, 10,000-15,000 cycles if only discharged 50%, 5000-10,000 cycles if discharged to 80% and roughly 3000 cycles if discharged above 95%, the typical lead acid battery is good for roughly 500 cycles.

But the system LFP batteries are used in needs to be set up properly, also if you’re going to go the LFP battery route do not buy a cheap one, nothing good is cheap and nothing cheap is good. If you’re not willing to pay the price of a good LFP battery then stick with flooded lead acid FLA batteries and charge them properly.

3. Stick with a lead acid battery for your start battery, whether AGM or FLA.

4. If you do not have an on board charger, get one, a good one, I suggest at least 10A of charging power per battery, FLA batteries require 10-13% of Ah rating as the charge amperage, and all LFP batteries I’ve seen require a minimum of 10A of charging power per battery. Your boats charging system is limited to roughly 13A above 3500 rpm and roughly half of that at idle and are not capable of fully charging a FLA / AGM battery as those batteries require a very lengthy amount of time in the absorption phase of charging, up to 8 hours. The charging systems on our boats are well suited for LFP batteries. LFP batteries charge five times as fast as a FLA / AGM battery, and at a much higher rate so if you’re going to go the LFP route you might consider an onboard charger for the LFP battery that has a 25A charge rate. NOCO makes a good charger and you can get an AC charge port which makes plugging in the charger very simple. From my experience I have ended up with the Victron IP 67 battery chargers, Bluetooth enabled and fully configurable for any battery chemistry, and come with two charge rates in each model, mine are 25A or 10A and there are lower amperage versions each with two charge rates. When I started on this battery journey it would take 12-14 hours to recharge my FLA batteries with a 10A charger, now with LFP batteries and the 25A Victron it takes 3.5 hours. Again, if quality LFP batteries are not in the budget then just get FLA batteries, charge and care for them properly, keep them clean, check the electrolyte level, check the specific gravity and perform regular equalizing charges and you’ll get the best performance possible and the longest life. I prefer FLA over AGM as you can perform equalizing charges on FLA batteries and you cannot on AGM batteries, and FLA batteries typically have more Ah and cold cranking amps than AGM. The big advantage of AGM batteries is they are no maintenance other than charging, I have an interstate group 24 AGM dual purpose for my start battery and it has been working great for three years.

5. Use appropriate size conductors, using greatly oversized conductors for the application only increases cost and does nothing for performance.

6. Get a jump pack and leave it on your boat.

I spent quite a bit of time researching about LFP batteries before installing them in my boat and learned a lot along the way with my own efforts as well as input from others on this site. I started out replacing my trolling motor batteries with battle born LFP batteries then replaced my house battery with another battle born battery. Huge improvement in the trolling motor performance in so far as run time, same with the house battery..you can read about it here; Conversion to LiFePo batteries
This one?
 
Your link didn’t work for me but I believe the Victron IP65 (500amp) is what you want.

Regardless of what you decide to do battery wise, the smart shunt is a great idea. Being able to see your battery voltage as it’s discharging/charging with a simple tap on your phone is a very valuable tool - was a game changer for me.

I replaced my AGM house battery with a Battle Born 100Ah LiFePO4 battery two seasons ago and it has worked great so far. It was pricey ($900) but it discharges slow, charges fast, and is about 60% lighter than my previous house battery. If you are going to spend the money to buy a high end LiFePO4 battery make sure you check out Battle Born before pulling the trigger.
 
I was planning to use 4/0 for the battery connections, would this be appropriate?
Seems I need to start with the shunt and see what the actual usage is before doing anything else.

Can I setup these two batteries on the BEP switch and at the very least isolate the amp to the extra battery?
I brought up lithium but meant to say LFP and have found a dual purpose one the NOCO nlx27 it’s $900 but seems like it would accomplish what I’m looking for?

I’ve tried to read through quite a bit of these threads.. Glad I haven’t purchased a switch but do I currently need it even though everything “seems” ok? I suppose the shunt would confirm for the current setup…
I am trying to go a bit overkill so I don’t have to worry about it but still need to do it in steps... At this point not much more I want to do as far as adding powered accessories, I’ve got the setup pretty good now.
My only problem was the fact that this boat only comes with the single switch and one starting battery…
I was looking at the NOCO genius 5x2 for a charger but haven’t decided yet.. There is just so much information on this I think I’ve confused myself..

Sorry if I’m rambling a bit, if it’s not obvious I’m a little lost, it will be now. 🤣
One of my favorite sayings is “overkill is underrated”.

Having said that 4/0 is way too big of a conductor in this application. Aftermarket oversize battery cables for my diesel truck are 2/0, 1/0 are in what’s in most kits, my truck has two 800 cca batteries in parallel. Keep in mind when you look at a wire size rating chart, that’s for continuous load at 100%, conductors can easily handle 200% for short durations, 4 hours or less. You can see from the ampacity chart below that 4/0 is rated at 230 A at 75c. I’d have to double check but I’m pretty sure I used #1 AWG for my LFP battery, you want to use machine wire or welding cable, it has a lot of very fine conductors and is very flexible. The conductor size for your amp and such for your sound system should be spelled out in your installation manual.

Again, you have to know what the load is, or what it’s going to be based on documentation to make the conductor size decision.

The 500A smart shunt can be installed on your existing system so you can measure all of the loads you currently have (see what I did there?), you will also be able to see what your starter draws, and how much amperage your engine is putting back into your battery, as well as the state of charge. The CSR’s at Battle Born can assist you in configuring the smart shunt for any battery chemistry.



IMG_0378.png

I should have mentioned this before, get a service manual for your boat. There should be pull out a wiring diagrams in the back. Since the 195 was designed for a single battery all of the house loads are all tied onto the start battery. Those will have to be broken out and landed on the house battery you’re going to install, including your amp.

Remember if you’re going to go the LFP house battery route you’ll need to set up the DVSR to activate either from a rocker switch like I have or set it up with the run hot, @WiskyDan did that on his boat and made a post about it, perhaps he can provide the link to the thread. There other folks that have done the same, this is a fire and forget set up that activates the DVSR whenever the engine is running and shuts it off as soon as the engine is shut off. I looked at the noco batteries a while back and they seem like a quality product, but I’d have to recommend Battle Born as their customer service is outstanding, all of the people you’ll talk to at BB are tech CSR’s and are highly knowledgeable.

The NOCO 5x2 charger is too small, that’s 5A per battery, every LFP battery I’ve looked at requires 10A minimum charge rate, including the Group24 NOCO LFP. But, depending on the size of your existing battery the 10A charger could be a bit high for your FLA battery as 13% of the Ah rating is the max charge rate and 10% is the minimum. If it’s a 75Ah battery, 7.5 is the minimum charge rate and 9.75 is the maximum. If it was my 75 Ah battery I’d go with the 10A charger, too little charge rate and the electrolyte will stratify and the plates will not be cleaned properly.

What size in Ah is the battery that’s in your boat?

This is the best battery maintenance sheet I’ve seen
 
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