Hard starting issues brand new ar195 help please!

[nrightaway]

Hi guys new to this. Just purchased new ar195 only have 7 hrs on it. Everytime it sits for more then 4 days the engine won't start until cranking it on the 4th time. Here is the kicker, I took it back to the dealer to fix a fiberglass Crack under warranty. I explained the starting problem to them and they had a month to diagnose the problem and kept telling me that it starts fine. As I picked it back up I told them I want to see them start it up, and when they did, guess what, it wouldn't start till after the 4th time. They kind of had egg on there face. Note the dealer is 300 miles from where I live so I had to take the boat back home. They told me they would get hold of Yamaha and see if they can come up with a fix.

We live in Yuma Arizona and I bought it from a dealer in Pheonix, the drive is horrendous and this dealer seems to know better than the owner. I told them that it felt to me like a fuel pump problem, or possibly a sensor problem, but they just would not listen and kept telling me that they could not reproduce the problem. It cost me a 600 mile drive to find out that in fact it did have a starting problem the day I was picking the boat back up after they had the boat for a month.

I am just taking a shot here in hopes that someone on the jet forum will have any answers and help us out since the dealer with all their certified mechanics couldn't.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Do you have a shop manual ? If not get one.

I assume it takes 4 attempts whether it is on the trailer or in the water?

And when you say it takes 4 attempts, does the engine do anything at all? Or does it start then die?

How does it start the rest of the day?

When it is cold out, 35-50* my engines regularly take 4 attempts to get going in the water. What were the temps when this problem is happening?

 

[Neutron]

My fzs waverunner with the same engine hates colder temperatures and will immediately stall when trying to start after it sits for days. Sometimes it take a few tries to stay running

 

[nrightaway]

Thank you for the response, first I do have a manual, the boat is hard starting whether in the water or at home but only when it sits for 4 days or so. When I had it on the lake after going thru the hard starting issue, the next day it started right up. Yes it will fire up then stall, it usually takes 4 attempts but this only happens after it sits for approximately 4 days or more. I wanted the dealer to concentrate on a possible fuel pump issue but they would not listen to me, and just kept insisting that there was no issue, that is until I picked it up, and made them try and start it up. Thank you for your help, a brand new $53,000 boat should not have these issues, and the authorized dealer should be able to trouble shoot the problem, but unfortunately they left me hanging.

 

[Neutron]

Unfortunately boat engines are not like automobile engines and cannot have cold start higher idles because they would accelerate unintentionally when put in gear. In the past with carburetors the choke did not utilize a high idle step cam on them, just a choke flap to help start when cold.

A supercharged engine has increased air flow so they are more susceptible to poor cold starts because nothing is much different to aid in a cold start.
Many boats suffer from this problem when the air temps are lower or the engine hasn't fired up in a long time.
Its most likely not a fuel pump problem.
If it starts up fine if you started it every day. After it sits cycle the key on and off a few times to prime the fuel pump and see if it makes a difference but i doubt it.

 

[nrightaway]

Thanks guys, the only problem was when I first had the problem (from the start) it was 105 degrees at Martinez lake in Arizona so it definitely does not have anything to do with a cold ambient temperature. But if the svho engine is susceptible to hard starting issues then I guess I will have to live with it until Yamaha or somebody figures it out. I will keep trying to figure it out. My next step is to replace the plugs and see if that helps.
Thanks

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Thanks guys, the only problem was when I first had the problem (from the start) it was 105 degrees at Martinez lake in Arizona so it definitely does not have anything to do with a cold ambient temperature. But if the svho engine is susceptible to hard starting issues then I guess I will have to live with it until Yamaha or somebody figures it out. I will keep trying to figure it out. My next step is to replace the plugs and see if that helps.
Thanks

And once started, does it start right up the rest of the day?

The svho is not prone to hard starts per se that I know of.

 

[nrightaway]

It starts right up no problem. But if it sits for 4 days, no go takes 4 cranks at least, with 2 of them starting then stalling. I am just saying, it's a brand new boat under warranty. Just not right.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

It starts right up no problem. But if it sits for 4 days, no go takes 4 cranks at least, with 2 of them starting then stalling. I am just saying, it's a brand new boat under warranty. Just not right.

When you put the new plugs in be sure and gap them to minimum spec. Hopefully that takes care of the problem.

 

[rkluck]

I guess it is possible the dealer started it up regularly and didn't wait 4 days so to them it started. It sounds like maybe the system isn't holding the fuel pressure. That is not necessarily a fuel pump problem but rather a loss of fuel pressure in the system. Is there a Yamaha dealer closer to you? You don't have to go to the dealer you bought it from. You may take it to a anyone that can service these boats to have them troubleshoot it. Yes it is not under warranty but if you towing her 600 miles it probably cost the same and you aren't taking so much time. Just my 2 cents worth of thoughts.

 

[nrightaway]

Thanks all I appreciate the help, I took it to the original dealer because there was some fiberglass that needed repair, and was advised to take it to the original dealer to avoid Yamaha possibly denying the claim. The 600 mile statement was a little over the top, I think it is more like 400 round trip but still a big hassle to still have the same problem, plus we had to make the trip twice.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

if it is the fuel issue perhaps try turning on the ignition and NOT cranking it for 15 or so seconds so the fuel pump can fill the system

 

[nrightaway]

RKLUCK wanted to ask you a question. You said lack of fuel pressure. I had the same thoughts but was relating it to the fuel pump not delivering pressure to the fuel rail after the fuel drains back to the tank when sitting for a week or 2. I relayed this to the dealer but was told that the electric fuel pumps don't activate when the key is turned on like a car would. That just doesn't make any sense to me in the year 2025. Then the only option I would have is to install a fuel shut off valve in the fuel line just before it attaches to the fuel rail to prevent fuel from going back to the tank, like the older motorcycles had.

Question do you have any idea or could you elaborate on your lack of pressure within the fuel system statement. Thanks

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

RKLUCK wanted to ask you a question. You said lack of fuel pressure. I had the same thoughts but was relating it to the fuel pump not delivering pressure to the fuel rail after the fuel drains back to the tank when sitting for a week or 2. I relayed this to the dealer but was told that the electric fuel pumps don't activate when the key is turned on like a car would. That just doesn't make any sense to me in the year 2025. Then the only option I would have is to install a fuel shut off valve in the fuel line just before it attaches to the fuel rail to prevent fuel from going back to the tank, like the older motorcycles had.

Question do you have any idea or could you elaborate on your lack of pressure within the fuel system statement. Thanks

That is not your problem.. the amount of fuel that these pumps supply is a lot. After the engines first attempted fire there would be plenty of fuel at the fuel rail and the injectors because the ECU batch fires the injectors on start up.

If you want to check anything check the ohm reading on the pick up coil.

 

[nrightaway]

Thanks, I will relay your message to the dealer who has now vowed to help me, and who promised to contact Yamaha to help out. But then again they promised to check out the starting problem to begin with. NOT! I appreciate the help.. Thanks

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Did you change the plugs and try it?

 

[rkluck]

Also, the fuel pump seems to be working OK. It acts like it is has lost pressure while sitting. Since it starts with no problems if has been running even after a few days. I am not sure if it build pressure when the key is turned but ever vehicle I own will run the fuel pump until the pressure is up and then you start it. Since it runs fine after it is started the fuel pump seems good. One way to find out is after you have let it sit for the typical 4 days or so pull the spark plugs. If one of them is wet you may have a leaking injector. It is a fairly easy way to eliminate that potential problem.

 

[Beachbummer]

I suggest doing a key dance as troubleshooting. I'm not sure if it's the case for this boat but sometimes the initial pump run time with the engine off is limited. If check valves are not functioning correctly on the fuel pump it may take some cranking.

Just try key on, key off, wait 2 seconds and do it again, say 5 times. If it starts easier, you know you are losing fuel priming.

 

[BumbleBee255]

2024 255 FSH sport H. Mine will take several attempts to start if I am in the water for the first crank. I normally start up for a short period of time before I dip in, and then all is good. I have noticed that if there is a 10 or so change in degrees from when it was last running, it will start a little harder. Probably trying to start off of the last ECU set-up for the previous temp.

 

[nrightaway]

Hey guys new question separate topic, being new don't know where to post it. I can't find any stations anymore where everything now is 10 % ethonal. How do you overcome that problem. With the new AR195 I must use 91 octane, and I purchased Sta-bil marine which is specifically developed for ethonal laced fuel and marine engines. So any ideas? How do you guys overcome that problem?