Wet Slipping and what stays on

[The Canuck]

Last year we bought a lake house due to the stars aligning for us. And you can't have a lake house without a boat. As luck would have it, someone in our neighborhood had a boat they were looking to sell. Win-win, and here I am a proud owner of a 2015 AR210. The previous owner always trailered his boat, or would store the boat 10-15 miles from the lake. When he was giving me the run-down on the boat and the procedure that he does, he mentioned that every time he takes the boat out, turns the dual battery switch to "off" from "1 & 2" (I think). Having never owned a boat, I was assuming this is the proper way whether you trailer, dry-slip, or wet-slip.

As I have been now on the forums and trying to follow what everyone does, it got me thinking... since we wet-slip our boat, should I be leaving the switch at "1" or "2" instead of "off". My typical procedure when getting on the boat, was/is to turn the switch to "1 & 2", turn on the blower for a little bit while everyone loaded up, as well as turn on the bilge. Last fall I noticed that the boat would have a little bit of water in it, but nothing crazy between the week or couple weeks we weren't there and it would sometimes spit the water out, and sometimes not. Once we were done for the day, after wiping everything down and pulling the plugs, I would turn the switch to "off."

But as I mentioned, being on the forum, I am now wondering if I am essentially counting my lucky stars that the boat hasn't accumulated more water, and since the system is turned "off" the bilge isn't kicking on. Meaning there is a good chance the boat could sink. So should I be leaving some power on while it sits in the slip, and if so, I am assuming I would leave the switch at "2" which I think is the house battery. And as my mind would play out, am I then slowly draining the house battery, and should really have it hooked up to some sort of trickle charger or battery tender while we are gone (solar in my case as no power is allowed down by our docks at the lake we are on).

Appreciate the thoughts/comments in advance.

 

[mark_m]

Hi! Welcome to wet-slipping your boat! We are in our third year with a dock and it is a game changer. Since you are going to be in the water all the time and you don't want to kill those nice batteries by leaving things on...

The best would be to have an separate float switch and bilge pump that are hardwired to one of your batteries. This way, regardless of the battery switch you have an always on (fused) current to the switch, which is ready to pump out any rain water and the like that could find a way into your bilge pump.

When we tie up, I plug in shore power to get my batteries charging up, then I turn the battery switch to "OFF"

If you can figure out if your existing bilge pumps are the style where it is always on (it cycles every few minutes) and shuts off if no resistance (water) is encountered when the pump cycles on that is okay too, but not ideal.... as you are alluding, it can kill a battery if it sits too long without some kind of charge. First, I'd find out how the stock bilge and battery selector switch interrelate so you know that answer first. Next, I would add another bilge and switch to make the stock one (redundant) and the hardwired bilge primary.

Make sense?

 

[The Canuck]

Thanks for the insight...


Digging through the owner's manual online, I am seeing that it states to leave the power on, and the bilge on if you keep it in the water. Which I am now wondering, how quickly the battery will drain, and I guess I should probably look at some sort of solar battery tender. On top of the secondary bilge with a float switch.

 

[haknslash]

I would rather not rely on leaving the switch on. There could be other electronic items drain the battery (amps, stereo, lighting etc) despite you hoping only the bilge would use it if it sensed water. For peace of mind if it were my boat and I were wet slipping and leaving unattended I would either directly wire in an extra bilge pump with float switch to the battery or rewire the stock pump so that it’s always on.

 

[Dave burke]

I have a 2017 212X and have always wet slipped my boat. I did what @mark_m suggests. I added a second bilge with a built in float switch and hardwired it to the house battery (with a fuse). So when I’m leaving the boat for a while, I turn the battery switches off so the only thing getting power is the second bilge.

I didn’t do this right away and the boat almost sank because it rained a lot one week and the house battery died and the boat partially filled up with water. That’s when I learned that for some reason I don’t understand , Yamaha has the bilge pump cycle on every few minutes even if there’s no water in the boat (instead of installing an automatic bilge pump). So if you leave the boat for a while, it will eventually kill the battery even if there’s no rain. And you should not turn the house battery switch off (as your owners manual indicates) since you’ll have no bilge pump.

So if I were you, I’d set up the solar charger asap and eventually add the second bilge. Good luck.

 

[mark_m]

Thanks for the insight...

View attachment 177639
Digging through the owner's manual online, I am seeing that it states to leave the power on, and the bilge on if you keep it in the water. Which I am now wondering, how quickly the battery will drain, and I guess I should probably look at some sort of solar battery tender. On top of the secondary bilge with a float switch.

OK. At least you understand the behavior for your model year.

If It were me, I wouldn't mess with solar battery tender, just put in a secondary bilge with a float switch and be done with it.

 

[The Canuck]

This is why this forum is so great!

Thank you to all.... off to look and see if there is something in the FAQ about a secondary bilge pump, and down the rabbit hole I go in researching solar chargers...

 

[The Canuck]

OK. At least you understand the behavior for your model year.

If It were me, I wouldn't mess with solar battery tender, just put in a secondary bilge with a float switch and be done with it.

So because the bilge with a float switch is directly connected (Fused) to the house battery, it won't drain the battery unless it is running. This allows me to turn "off" the boat, while maintaining some insurance. And if it kills the battery.... I guess a battery is a heck of a lot cheaper than getting a boat that has sunk.

 

[Dave burke]

I’m with @marc_m, unless you can’t install the second bilge quickly. In that case, the solar charger is a good stop gap and it will never hurt to have the battery with the second bilge on a tender.

it should be easy to find threads about second bilges but if you’re having a hard time, search under my name or @swatski. I did pretty much exactly what he did. It’s a bit of work though. But you can get it done in a day, no problem.

 

[mark_m]

I’m with @marc_m, unless you can’t install the second bilge quickly. In that case, the solar charger is a good stop gap and it will never hurt to have the battery with the second bilge on a tender.

it should be easy to find threads about second bilges but if you’re having a hard time, search under my name or @swatski. I did pretty much exactly what he did. It’s a bit of work though. But you can get it done in a day, no problem.

I think the level of effort is inversely proportional to how low you mount the float switch and the second bilge. I had lots of fun removing the waterbox, installing a SS scupper and putting in the second bilge.

 

[Dave burke]

I think the level of effort is inversely proportional to how low you mount the float switch and the second bilge. I had lots of fun removing the waterbox, installing a SS scupper and putting in the second bilge.

good point. I put mine underneath the swim platform because I could see how much water stays there even after the factory bilge runs dry. But putting elsewhere might be easier. And I didn’t bother wiring a switch

 

[mark_m]

good point. I put mine underneath the swim platform because I could see how much water stays there even after the factory bilge runs dry. But putting elsewhere might be easier. And I didn’t bother wiring a switch

Great approach! In hindsight I should have considered this. When I pulled my boat from the slip last season and was cleaning it, I could hear the secondary bilge running nonstop. Turns out my float switch got stuck in up position keeping the bilge running. Who knows how long it was like that on shore power… ?

Quick removal of the clean-out tray and a strategic use of broomstick ? and I was able to free the float switch and it disengaged.

Last weekend after a week of long rain when I stepped on the swim platform the water rolled back into the bilge and it pumped out perfectly.

 

[meegwell]

I have a 2017 212X and have always wet slipped my boat. I did what @mark_m suggests. I added a second bilge with a built in float switch and hardwired it to the house battery (with a fuse). So when I’m leaving the boat for a while, I turn the battery switches off so the only thing getting power is the second bilge.

I didn’t do this right away and the boat almost sank because it rained a lot one week and the house battery died and the boat partially filled up with water. That’s when I learned that for some reason I don’t understand , Yamaha has the bilge pump cycle on every few minutes even if there’s no water in the boat (instead of installing an automatic bilge pump). So if you leave the boat for a while, it will eventually kill the battery even if there’s no rain. And you should not turn the house battery switch off (as your owners manual indicates) since you’ll have no bilge pump.

So if I were you, I’d set up the solar charger asap and eventually add the second bilge. Good luck.

Sorry for the hijack but can someone point me in the direction of the proper fuse to use for a direct wired bilge (2018 242)

 

[The Canuck]

I think it depends on the bilge pump that you have. I purchased an Attwood Sahara MK2 800 and it requires a 5amp fuse based off the literature. I would check the literature that came with your pump.

 

[Dave burke]

Agreed. Mine is also 5 amps so it’s likely in that neighborhood

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

FYI.

The newer bilge pumps don’t cycle like the old ones do to detect water, they have an internal sensor / float that detects water. Also, on the newer models the Auto functionality of the bilge pump has its own 5A fused feed-always hot direct from the battery, and there is a secondary feed coming from the rocker switches on the dash that has its own 5A ckt breaker feed that is fed from the switched side of the house battery switch.

Imho for you, you need to have as big of a solar charger that you can get to put some charge on your batteries. Even then the solar charger is not sufficient to charge your batteries properly, nor are the engines. Over time your lead acid batteries are going to slowly degrade. There two options, you can pull the batteries out from time to time, take them home and put them on a charger that has an equalize function, and when the normal charge is done run the equalize charge on them. Or you can mount a charger in the boat, NOCO genius 10x2 for example (10A of charge per battery is necessary to properly clean the plates and de stratify the electrolyte) , pull the boat out from time to time and just plug it in while it is in the driveway. This would also be a good time to clean the hull of the boat to keep the funk from getting too thick on the hull.

To make the battery switching process automatic you could install a BEP marine battery selector (OEM on the newer Yamaha boats) with a DVSR (digital voltage sensing relay). You will have three manual switches, Start battery, House Battery, and emergency parallel. With the house and start switches turned on, and you leave them on all day, once you start the engines all the charging goes to charge the start battery first, then once the voltage on the start battery reaches 13.4 volts the DVSR will close the switch paralleling the start and house batteries, thereby charging the house battery. When you stop and are hanging out and the voltage on the paralleled start and house batteries drops to 12.7 volts the DVSR opens the switch breaking parallel between the start and house batteries, isolating the start battery so you will not get stranded. The house battery then continues to provide power for accessories until you start the engines and the process repeats.

If for some reason the start battery needs help starting the engines, you can close the emergency paralleling switch to combine the start and house batteries to get the engines started, then switch the emergency paralleling switch to off to allow full output of the alternators to charge the start battery first. I also carry an Anti Gravity jump pack as insurance for myself and to help others if needed.

 

[Matt Phillips]

on my 2009 I made and solar panel holder and hard wired and fused a switch to the bilge pump. Using this method I was able to have the batteries turned off (and thus all electronics on the boat) while also still maintaining battery charge for the pump.

Details are here: https://jetboaters.net/threads/solar-battery-charger-install-w-pics.3414/

 

[The Canuck]

FYI.

The newer bilge pumps don’t cycle like the old ones do to detect water, they have an internal sensor / float that detects water. Also, on the newer models the Auto functionality of the bilge pump has its own 5A fused feed-always hot direct from the battery, and there is a secondary feed coming from the rocker switches on the dash that has its own 5A ckt breaker feed that is fed from the switched side of the house battery switch.

Imho for you, you need to have as big of a solar charger that you can get to put some charge on your batteries. Even then the solar charger is not sufficient to charge your batteries properly, nor are the engines. Over time your lead acid batteries are going to slowly degrade. There two options, you can pull the batteries out from time to time, take them home and put them on a charger that has an equalize function, and when the normal charge is done run the equalize charge on them. Or you can mount a charger in the boat, NOCO genius 10x2 for example (10A of charge per battery is necessary to properly clean the plates and de stratify the electrolyte) , pull the boat out from time to time and just plug it in while it is in the driveway. This would also be a good time to clean the hull of the boat to keep the funk from getting too thick on the hull.

To make the battery switching process automatic you could install a BEP marine battery selector (OEM on the newer Yamaha boats) with a DVSR (digital voltage sensing relay). You will have three manual switches, Start battery, House Battery, and emergency parallel. With the house and start switches turned on, and you leave them on all day, once you start the engines all the charging goes to charge the start battery first, then once the voltage on the start battery reaches 13.4 volts the DVSR will close the switch paralleling the start and house batteries, thereby charging the house battery. When you stop and are hanging out and the voltage on the paralleled start and house batteries drops to 12.7 volts the DVSR opens the switch breaking parallel between the start and house batteries, isolating the start battery so you will not get stranded. The house battery then continues to provide power for accessories until you start the engines and the process repeats.

If for some reason the start battery needs help starting the engines, you can close the emergency paralleling switch to combine the start and house batteries to get the engines started, then switch the emergency paralleling switch to off to allow full output of the alternators to charge the start battery first. I also carry an Anti Gravity jump pack as insurance for myself and to help others if needed.

I will have to look at the boat and see what I have for the BEP and/or DVSR. I know the previous owner had the dealership add a second battery, and there is a switch that allows me to select which batteries I want on. Aside from that, I am a bit clueless.

As for the solar power option, ideally it would be great to have a system that would allow the power gathered from the panel, to be easily converted to AC and have that transfer via a 3-prong plug. That way I could plug the boat in using Noco's port plug that is connected to a charger mounted in the boat. Unfortunately that will most likely involve some additional boxes, cables, etc. that the wife will probably not appreciate.

My other concern is that the lake will in the spring time and sometimes in the fall, flood. A portion of the gangway to the dock can be under water, which wouldn't be a great option if there are controllers or other electronics sitting down there. Maybe the best option is to do something similar to @Matt Phillips with a panel that is easily hung off the tower and can be disconnected as required. Just want something simple and clean looking.

 

[Dave burke]

If I were you, I’d do what @Matt Phillips did. But the most urgent thing is to get the second bilge installed, wired directly to the house battery. I’ve never had a problem with mine no matter how much it rained.

I assume you put the mooring cover on when you’re not going to be there for a few days?

 

[The Canuck]

If I were you, I’d do what @Matt Phillips did. But the most urgent thing is to get the second bilge installed, wired directly to the house battery. I’ve never had a problem with mine no matter how much it rained.

I assume you put the mooring cover on when you’re not going to be there for a few days?

Second bilge and parts are ordered and most are in my possession. Just need to get it installed in a couple weeks when I am back at the lake. And yes, the mooring cover is put on every time we leave, as it is either 1 week or 2 between trips.