Advice on purchase 19' vs 21'

[StlYota]

Hello all,

I have been reading quite a bit on this forum. Very helpful information. Figured this was the best place to gather some advice on an upcoming boat purchase. Background information. Live in the St. Louis area and have a slip w/ hoist secured on the Mississippi in the Alton Pool. Long time boater, but first time jet boater. We will be using the Yamaha 95% of the time on the river, and plan to make 1-2 lake trips a year to nearby lakes such as Table Rock, Bull Shoals, Kentucky Lake, and once in a while in the Nashville area since my daughter lives there. So towing will really only be 1-2 trips a year. We have a 2022 Toyota Tacoma rated at 6400 lbs towing capacity. Therefore I started my search with the AR190, 192, 195. We will do some tubing, wakeboarding, wakesakintg etc.. so AR is the boat. However, I put a deposit down on a 2018 AR210, looks to be in great condition, added dual battery , amp and speakers and thrust vectors. I am using 5000 lbs as a safe number for tow weight. A part of me is thinking that maybe the 19 will be just easier all around if I am launching and towing.

Many times it will be just the wife and I in the boat, but do plan to bring kids along (they are all adults now), or friends, so the 21 is appealing.

So the question is, anyone tow the 210 with a midsize truck, doesn't have to be the Tacoma, but maybe a ranger or Colorado in the same ballpark on tow rating?

Second question. We are looking at the 2018 AR210, a 2016 AR192, and a new 23 195S.
2018 looks super clean, engine hatch etc. 195S is new. The AR192 is older, but has perfect pass, and gator step installed. However the engine area looks pretty grimy in the pic the dealer sent me.

Will struggle towing the 210, and with either of the 19s meet our usage? Thanks in advance for advice and suggestions.

Note: I know the 192 and 195 will be faster. not too worried about the 210 being a slower boat or having to service 2 engines, I will do most of that myself. Watersports, cruising, and sand bars will be the usage on water.

 

[@JC!]

That's a spectrum of choices, the AR210 has twin 1L TR-1s, the AR192 has a single 1.8L SHO and the 195s has a single 1.8L SVHO. I have a 2017 AR195 SVHO that usually has between 5-7 people on it, cruising, pulling tubes, wakeboarding and surfing. We bought the 19 because at the time I didn't have room to store a 212X. We're now living on a lake and I've thought about going bigger but for the lake we're on and the ways we use it, the 19 is about perfect. I've towed the 195 to our other cabin about 225mi each way with a Jeep GC V8, Ram 1500, 2500 PowerWagon and now my TRX and you could barely feel it back there. The AR210 is only about 700lbs heavier and I wouldn't worry about pulling it with any 1/2 ton truck. Get the boat you want but by the way you describe the AR192 I'd probably cross that one off.

 

[RocMOT]

I've been reading these forums for a long time but is my first time giving my opinion on a topic.

When I started looking at replacing my old boat (89 17' StarCraft outboard) I was mainly looking at the 19' Yamahas. It would be longer than my current boat and, of course, a jet boat. The more reading and thinking I did, I decided on a 2021 21' 212SE and am very happy with it. I'm most of the way thru my first season with it and have no regrets.

Some of the considerations for choosing between a 19' and 21'.

The 19' will be better on gas. Both in running it and towing it. Having said that, you don't really buy a boat if you're overly concerned about using gas. Its a fun toy that you will hopefully use a lot and make lots of memories.

The 19' will tow a bit easier. Its lighter and smaller. I have a GMC Sierra and it has no problems pulling the 21' but its rated for much heavier loads. I MUCH prefer the tandem trailer. Its much easier to backup than the single axle that will come with the 19'. Your Tacoma can probably handle it for the # of times you said you're likely to be towing it. Having the 4 tires also means that you could get a flat on the highway and not cause a wreck.

The 19' MIGHT fit in a normal garage. The 21' will probably not. There are lots of threads that talk about that. I store mine indoors in a huge storage facility or next to my driveway so that was never a concern. . Never wanted or needed to put in my garage.

The 19' did not have as much seating area space as my old 17' outboard. The sun deck is great but it does cut into the seating area. The 21' has a bit more room. It says 10 people. The most we've had is 7 and it had no issues.

The twin engines is what ultimately sold me on it. I love the two engines. I like having the maneuverability that you don't get with 1 especially at slow speeds. You can probably get just as good with practice, but I found it easier. But it DID take practice. ANY jet boat will NOT steer like a prop boat. It also nice to know that you have 2 engines in case one has a problem while you are out on the lake/river/ocean. Paddling is NOT fun.

I've hit 50 MPH with just me, half a tank of gas and a calm lake. Upper 40s is typical. However, you can almost watch the gas gauge go down if you stay on WOT for a long time. I still do it because its fun, but it can get expensive. (see above comment on using gas!)

Now that I have the 21', part of me wishes I got a 24' instead. Bigger is (almost) always better. It just wasn't in the budget and hard to justify getting one that was 7ft longer than my other one that lasted ~30 years. But, its a free country. I can upgrade in the future if I want.

I have no regrets of picking the 21' over the 19'. Spent a bunch more $$$ but its a boat that will serve me and my kids for a LOT of years.

Mike

 

[Coult45]

@RocMOT Great input, Mike.

On a side note, if I make my way west on the canal over to Rochester one of these days...how's the boating through Rochester and out into the lake?

 

[RocMOT]

I haven't used a boat around Rochester in probably 25 years. We have a camp on a small lake (Schroon Lake) in the Adirondacks so its really only used up there. There does seem to be a lot of boats that do use the canal a lot. If you like a leisurely trip, it seems like it would be enjoyable. There are stops in a lot of the small towns that have shops and restaurants. We live near Fairport and it has some really nice places to visit and places you can dock your boat. I'm not sure that you can actually get to Lake Ontario thru Rochester.. But I've never tried either. The canal goes all the way to Buffalo and Lake Erie. I think you'd have to go thru Oswego to get to Lake Ontario.

I took my 17' boat out on Lake Ontario once. Would never do that again. Way too small. Irondequoit Bay was nice though. Your 21' is probably OK on most days.

 

[Bottom Bracket]

Get the 19, perfect for 2 people, sized for your truck,
Kids can buy their own boat.

 

[adrianp89]

If your waters are relatively calm, go with the 19. If they can get rough go 21.

 

[OCMD]

Bigger always better. Go twins. More power which you will realize you don't have when you have a single engine.

 

[@JC!]

Bigger always better. Go twins. More power which you will realize you don't have when you have a single engine.

Twin TR-1 HOs push about 260hp through 155mm pumps in a 3200lb dry boat, a single SVHO puts out about 250hp through a 160mm pump in a 2500lb dry boat... Performance, speed, etc are pretty even with the edge to the AR195. IMO if I were to trade my AR195 it would only be for a 212/222 with twin 1.8L engines.

If your waters are relatively calm, go with the 19. If they can get rough go 21.

This is 100% accurate, we took the AR195 down to Lake Okoboji last summer and it was a mess when the big yachts cruised by or the wind came up. The 19 is great on the lakes we normally go to but it was getting tossed around pretty bad on that chain.

 

[drewkaree]

I have a 2019 AR210 that I tow with a 2005 Lexus GX470. Almost identical towing capacity, but I've got a V8, where you have a V6. My kid has a Colorado, and he's also a heavy equipment operator who will sometimes tow smaller equipment with his truck, if needed. He has said he wouldn't feel comfortable towing my boat with his truck, but he could do it if needed. The main reason for his comfort level is fuel use on his truck, and weight-wise, is how the truck would shift with my AR. He thinks based on some other things he's hauled, it would be gear-hunting a lot. I can't comment one way or another, but at least you've got some more info.

We were originally going to go with a 19' AR, but circumstances allowed us to move up to the 21', and I'm glad we did. @adrianp89 is on the money regarding typical water conditions. The biggest reason we went with the 210 was that the TR-1 is slightly better on fuel, it does NOT require premium (and I have access to mid-grade ethanol free near me), and the second engine to possibly help get us back to shore (which has been needed at the beginning of this season). I've had 8 passengers with 2 coolers, and that's the limit that I want on the boat. The experience caused us to really address storage, and go with specific bins/containers and locate them so we can offload the majority of stuff people bring down into storage compartments.

The bench seat for the passenger side has become something the wife doesn't like, even though she didn't feel it would be an issue. We MAY look to add a chair to that side, since I now have a useless OEM pedestal since upgrading the captain's pedestal, but I'm not certain on that. We'll be making that decision after a few more outings with 6-8 people on board. Right now, it seems like it's probable, but some investigation into what's actually under there is going to be in order before I order a seat. Don't overlook the seating arrangement, and make sure your wife is on board with that. Have her figure out where she wants to sit, and how comfortable she feels - that pedestal seat can be her deal breaker that you never even considered.

I'm not certain how many kids you have, or how far the drive is for you to haul with your Tacoma, so fill us in on that info. While I'm with @Bottom Bracket that the 19' seems to be the better size for what your typical use sounds like, you need to fill in that bit. I was looking at buying a Taco and relegating the GX to part-time duty and full-time boat hauler if needed, but since prices are starting to come down again on used GX's, we're going with our original plan of another GX, and the older GX will still be used for the same purposes. I don't feel like the Tacoma would be a comfortable tow with the 21'. I've done more hauling than most here, former semi driver, heavy equipment delivery, landscaping, hazmat & tanker stuff. While others may feel just fine with their setup and are doing exactly what I don't feel comfortable with, that's their choice (and yours). I would consider moving up to a Tundra or a GX like I've got, if you're going with a 21', or stick with what you've got and go with a 19'. The temp solution would be to go with the 21' and see how it is to tow with your Tacoma, and upgrade the tow vehicle later, if needed. Maybe see if the dealer will allow you to hook it up and take it for a spin around the lot just to get a feel for how it'll feel back there. It's not the same as getting it out on the open road, but you'll know pretty quickly if it feels like you'll want a bigger tow vehicle. My neighbor has told me he was surprised how my GX feels with the AR210 behind it - in a good way. He didn't realize what was under the hood, or the tow capaciy.

 

[StlYota]

Appreciate all the input from everyone. We went to the dealership this morning, and after spending time on all 3 boats, the AR210 won out for a few reasons. Price for what we get in return and for only 2 more feet it really felt like a much bigger boat. Mississippi stays relatively calm, except when barges come. But we plan to do lake trips and based on my past boating experience, I just felt the 21 would handle the lakes we would e going to better. Tacoma handled the 200 mile tow home to St. Louis just fine. Sure, a 1/2 ton would be better, if I needed to put the boat in the water more often then I would consider a possible upgrade in tow vehicle, but for 1-2 lake trips a year, the tacoma will do for now. Taking it to the slip tomorrow and for a spin on the river.

 

[Coult45]

Congratulations!

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Toyota was the first manufacturer to go with the SAE tow rating, which is a solid teal world tow rating. I have no problem towing at the rated published SAE tow rating in any conditions, especially from Toyota and I don‘t own one but several of my friends do. Is the Taco a Tundra, no, but I’m sure it will do just fine.

Congrats on getting the 21’ boat! You will enjoy this boat and when your kids join there will be ample room for them as well!