Extra Fuel on FSH

[zackmorris]

First of all…. 50 gallons of gasoline is 300#, 54 gallons is 324#. If you put that much weigh on one side your boat is going to list A LOT. Try standing on one side / corner of your boat and see how much it lists. This list will also dramatically affect how your boat handles, meaning if all that weight in on the starboard side your boat will pull to the port side. I highly recommend that you use a container, like a 150 qt ice / 37 gallons chest filled with water which is 313# and have that in your boat to see how that weight affects the handling of your boat, so you are going to want to have it centered if at all possible. Cut a piece of cardboard with the footprint of the fuel bladder and see how that is going to fit in your boat too. Also check your fuel consumption with that weight on the boat to see how that is going to be affected.

Secondly, these bladders are supposed to be used on deck, not down in a hold, although I do see one in an on deck storage locker. Putting fuel containers below deck is very risky. So that leaves finding a 30”x30” footprint for the bladder. On a 25’ FSH model I’d think you could put it on top of the folded down rear bench seat, which would put it close to the fuel fill of the boats oem fuel tank, or maybe right in front of the CC seat in the bow.

And for sure you want to have quick disconnects that are A-compatible with gasoline, and B-have built in shut off valves. Looks like ATL sells the rated fuel line. Polypropylene fuel line is a good choice as it will not get stiff over time and allows you to roll it up and stow it easy.

I like the 50 gallon fuel locker, that is literally a doubling of the fuel capacity on my boat, so a 100% increase, it would be a 45% increase of fuel on the 255 FSH and a 66% increase in fuel capacity on the 255XD. On my boat that would mean running the tank to zero to get it all to fit, but, I’d probably just run the stock tank down half way then transfer half, or maybe even less to start getting that fuel into the main tank asap to get the weight out of the front of the boat.

It is a neat fuel storage idea as it will just roll up and get stowed when its empty which is nice, as opposed to fuel cans which will always be there full or not.

I have to ask, where is it that you guys are going that you would need to take 50 gallons / 300# of fuel ?

Bimini trips, running out to the ledge on the east coast of fl, etc. Easy to run 40 miles out and troll. Doesn't leave much margin for error when going that far on the stock tank.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Bimini trips, running out to the ledge on the east coast of fl, etc. Easy to run 40 miles out and troll. Doesn't leave much margin for error when going that far on the stock tank.

Because I’m curious…what kind of mpg are you seeing with your boat on your excursions? My guess would be 2-2.2 mpg at best cruise?

I Kinda figured you were running a ways out to a fishing area or wanting to go to Bimini / Dry Tortugas but didn’t want to make an assumption. It’s always good to have a large reserve of fuel in case the bite gets hot or conditions deteriorate.

 

[dwakeman]

First of all…. 50 gallons of gasoline is 300#, 54 gallons is 324#. If you put that much weigh on one side your boat is going to list A LOT. Try standing on one side / corner of your boat and see how much it lists. This list will also dramatically affect how your boat handles, meaning if all that weight in on the starboard side your boat will pull to the port side. I highly recommend that you use a container, like a 150 qt ice / 37 gallons chest filled with water which is 313# and have that in your boat to see how that weight affects the handling of your boat, so you are going to want to have it centered if at all possible. Cut a piece of cardboard with the footprint of the fuel bladder and see how that is going to fit in your boat too. Also check your fuel consumption with that weight on the boat to see how that is going to be affected.

Secondly, these bladders are supposed to be used on deck, not down in a hold, although I do see one in an on deck storage locker. Putting fuel containers below deck is very risky. So that leaves finding a 30”x30” footprint for the bladder. On a 25’ FSH model I’d think you could put it on top of the folded down rear bench seat, which would put it close to the fuel fill of the boats oem fuel tank, or maybe right in front of the CC seat in the bow.

And for sure you want to have quick disconnects that are A-compatible with gasoline, and B-have built in shut off valves. Looks like ATL sells the rated fuel line. Polypropylene fuel line is a good choice as it will not get stiff over time and allows you to roll it up and stow it easy.

I like the 50 gallon fuel locker, that is literally a doubling of the fuel capacity on my boat, so a 100% increase, it would be a 45% increase of fuel on the 255 FSH and a 66% increase in fuel capacity on the 255XD. On my boat that would mean running the tank to zero to get it all to fit, but, I’d probably just run the stock tank down half way then transfer half, or maybe even less to start getting that fuel into the main tank asap to get the weight out of the front of the boat.

It is a neat fuel storage idea as it will just roll up and get stowed when its empty which is nice, as opposed to fuel cans which will always be there full or not.

I have to ask, where is it that you guys are going that you would need to take 50 gallons / 300# of fuel ?

Thanks, this is really great input. Thank you.

Couple of things. First I have a 275SD with a 9 foot beam and I have the ZipWake 300 system installed so that should deal with any issues with leveling the boat. Of course time will tell and that only helps when you’re moving. In addition that’s not much more weight than a few people sitting on that side of the boat, and I’ve done that without much of a notable impact. Second, I only plan to use it when we’re going on longer trips, so hopefully the inconvenience would be short to one leg of the trip and then I’ll be transferring that fuel into the center tank. I’m setting up a system with a fuel transfer pump that I plan to install. I have attached the diagram so you can get a sense of what I’m planning. Depending on which valves are open/closed controls the flow of the fuel. I am a bit concerned about ensuring proper ventilation and am exploring that more. Note. I made a mistake on the boat file take size. It’s actually 90G.

 

[zackmorris]

Because I’m curious…what kind of mpg are you seeing with your boat on your excursions? My guess would be 2-2.2 mpg at best cruise?

I Kinda figured you were running a ways out to a fishing area or wanting to go to Bimini / Dry Tortugas but didn’t want to make an assumption. It’s always good to have a large reserve of fuel in case the bite gets hot or conditions deteriorate.

around 2mpg with decent conditions. When it gets real sloppy, it's not uncommon to been that 1-1.5mpg range.

 

[dwakeman]

I wonder what the durability is like on that bladder? Seems very cheap compared to the other commercial solutions like ATI: 50 Gallon (200 Liter) ATL FueLocker Fuel Bladder - P/N 106050

No doubt that looks like a much better bladder, but it cost three times as much. Given, I don’t plan to use it that much except for a few long trips. It doesn’t make much sense to me to pay three times as much.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

around 2mpg with decent conditions. When it gets real sloppy, it's not uncommon to been that 1-1.5mpg range.

Right on… yeah, if you have to slow way down and put the bow up then I can see the mpg dropping significantly.

When you are trolling I’m going to guess you are at 1-1.5 gph?

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Thanks, this is really great input. Thank you.

Couple of things. First I have a 275SD with a 9 foot beam and I have the ZipWake 300 system installed so that should deal with any issues with leveling the boat. Of course time will tell and that only helps when you’re moving. In addition that’s not much more weight than a few people sitting on that side of the boat, and I’ve done that without much of a notable impact. Second, I only plan to use it when we’re going on longer trips, so hopefully the inconvenience would be short to one leg of the trip and then I’ll be transferring that fuel into the center tank. I’m setting up a system with a fuel transfer pump that I plan to install. I have attached the diagram so you can get a sense of what I’m planning. Depending on which valves are open/closed controls the flow of the fuel. I am a bit concerned about ensuring proper ventilation and am exploring that more. Note. I made a mistake on the boat file take size. It’s actually 90G.

Looks like a pretty good set up to fuel your boat on and off the water.

I appreciate you not wanting to spend more money, but, consider what is in the bladder. If that bladder leaks or comes undone while underway the results could be catastrophic and the savings that were had will seem like ashes in your mouth at that point. The ATL brand is built to MIL spec, I would not choose another that doesn’t meet that level of build. I made a similar post about tires a while back, again, I respect the cost, but, I would only put the absolute best tires I can get onto my truck, period. Also, there are no reviews on the bladder that is on amazon.

Also consider using oteiker type hose clamps when assembling your fuel transfer hoses, these clamps do not loosen over time like the typical worm gear drive hose clamps as they are spring loaded. Look at all of the fuel system hoses on your boat and cars, they all have oteiker clamps..

 

[Ed255fsh]

Thanks for this info. It provided me with a few good ideas. I'm planning on using a 54-gallon fuel bladder and putting it in the starboard rear seat storage compartment on my 2024 Yamaha 275SD. Like you, I will use a quick disconnect (I am going to try this one) so I can pull it out when it is not needed. I'll then permanently mount a 12V fuel transfer pump in the engine compartment. I'll let you know next spring if this all works out.

I was going to suggest this too. Friends would use this for extended offshore tuna fishing.
Roll it up when done.

 

[dwakeman]

Looks like a pretty good set up to fuel your boat on and off the water.

I appreciate you not wanting to spend more money, but, consider what is in the bladder. If that bladder leaks or comes undone while underway the results could be catastrophic and the savings that were had will seem like ashes in your mouth at that point. The ATL brand is built to MIL spec, I would not choose another that doesn’t meet that level of build. I made a similar post about tires a while back, again, I respect the cost, but, I would only put the absolute best tires I can get onto my truck, period. Also, there are no reviews on the bladder that is on amazon.

Also consider using oteiker type hose clamps when assembling your fuel transfer hoses, these clamps do not loosen over time like the typical worm gear drive hose clamps as they are spring loaded. Look at all of the fuel system hoses on your boat and cars, they all have oteiker clamps..

I will definitely check those clamps out. I really don’t trust those worm type. I will take a look at the other bladders and give them serious consideration. Cost wasn’t the only reason I selected this bag, it also happens to be a perfect size to fit under the rear starboard seat. I did check and it can be put inside enclosed compartment. I do plan to add a vent. No doubt a leak could be a serious problem, but the bag is very protected in there. There is always the concern a seam could come loose, which could be an issue with this less expensive bag.

 

[zipper]

My experience with a 25 gallon bladder bag for black water holding, not fuel, on our catamaran did not go well. This bag was layed on a grate in a compartment in the starboard hull, aft of the head. https://defender.com/en_us/nauta-heavy-duty-holding-diesel-fuel-tank . The boat had a bad smell and we were not going to have it. My first trip down to Mass. to work on the boat in April was to measure the hatch opening so we could order a rigid poly tank to replace it. Water / Waste Holding Tank - Ronco Plastics The bag had been pumped out, but some always remains. I pulled on a corner of the bag and felt a release and to my surprise, the bag came out, spilling only a little bit of what remained in there. The hose/pipe fitting seal failed. I did need it out and that made my work quick as the fitting and clamps were on the bottom and hard to get at.
Anyway, little spilled, I removed the bad, support grate and any "liquid" from that compartment. Ordered a 20 gallon poly tank and put it back on the grate and replumbed for inland waters use, no discharge via the "Y" valve.


You can see a stain originating from the outlet running down the bag. Most likely the source of the leak/smell.



Ya, that hot water heater rusted, fell apart and no longer exists.

Obviously not an FSH, but extra fuel for the twin Yamaha 9.9's, is carried forward lashed to the lifeline stantions.

 

[dwakeman]

My experience with a 25 gallon bladder bag for black water holding, not fuel, on our catamaran did not go well. This bag was layed on a grate in a compartment in the starboard hull, aft of the head. https://defender.com/en_us/nauta-heavy-duty-holding-diesel-fuel-tank . The boat had a bad smell and we were not going to have it. My first trip down to Mass. to work on the boat in April was to measure the hatch opening so we could order a rigid poly tank to replace it. Water / Waste Holding Tank - Ronco Plastics The bag had been pumped out, but some always remains. I pulled on a corner of the bag and felt a release and to my surprise, the bag came out, spilling only a little bit of what remained in there. The hose/pipe fitting seal failed. I did need it out and that made my work quick as the fitting and clamps were on the bottom and hard to get at.
Anyway, little spilled, I removed the bad, support grate and any "liquid" from that compartment. Ordered a 20 gallon poly tank and put it back on the grate and replumbed for inland waters use, no discharge via the "Y" valve.

View attachment 229722
You can see a stain originating from the outlet running down the bag. Most likely the source of the leak/smell.
View attachment 229723
View attachment 229724

Ya, that hot water heater rusted, fell apart and no longer exists.

Obviously not an FSH, but extra fuel for the twin Yamaha 9.9's, is carried forward lashed to the lifeline stantions.

View attachment 229728

Thanks for sharing. Sorry to hear about the issues with the bag. While a Polly take would be ideal, I would lose that storage space for good to the auxiliary fuel take, and I sure want to avoid that. I may have to just opt for the more expensive bag as I sure don’t want the same issues you had.

 

[zipper]

Poly tanks are not fail proof. A similar failure happened with a rigid black water tank on our Beneteau. That one leaked down into the bilge pump below the cabin sole, floor. Was a mess to clean up, even though only #1 is allowed. Emergency use only. Go to shore for #2.

Cracked 1 1/2” tank fitting. Nothing lasts forever.

 

[dwakeman]

Poly tanks are not fail proof. A similar failure happened with a rigid black water tank on our Beneteau. That one leaked down into the bilge pump below the cabin sole, floor. Was a mess to clean up, even though only #1 is allowed. Emergency use only. Go to shore for #2.

Cracked 1 1/2” tank fitting. Nothing lasts forever.

View attachment 229732

Dang, proves that a boat is a never ending maintenance chore.