Greasing Intermediate Bearings - New Recommended Interval by Yamaha

[Judge]

I did the same with my 10 hour service. My issue was they did not change the spark plugs at 10 hours and when I hit 50 hours when boat was a year and half old, one spark plug broke from being seized by galvanic corrosion. My service adviser said Yamaha recommends replacing plugs ever 6 months for that reason. Of course service manual does not state that. YES does not cover items considered wear such as steering cables and apparently seized spark plugs so I was SOL and had to pay the dealer $1200 to remove the head to get the plug out. Now I always use Anti Seize and replace every 6 months whether they are bad or not.

I plan to replace my own plugs because that is easy enough and can get away with doing it when I have it down on a wash rack even though we aren't allowed to perform service on sight at the marina. I plan to use anti-seize as well. I'm going to end up putting a lot of hours on quickly. I put on 15 hours in 4 days so I will probably be replacing plugs every 6 months at least.

 

[Cobra Jet Steering LLC]

Lots of posts about never seize, I also use dielectric grease on the coils to prevent them from sticking to the plugs be sure to only use a small amount of never seize and do not use the torque on them when the plug seats go 1/2 turn more and stop I do them once a year never any issues. Only salt water use.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

I plan to replace my own plugs because that is easy enough and can get away with doing it when I have it down on a wash rack even though we aren't allowed to perform service on sight at the marina. I plan to use anti-seize as well. I'm going to end up putting a lot of hours on quickly. I put on 15 hours in 4 days so I will probably be replacing plugs every 6 months at least.

Go easy on the anti seize, you don’t want it to get piled up down in the spark plug well. I apply the anti seize with the brush then use a paper towel to wipe off the excess making sure it’s down in the threads then install the plugs. I think as long as there is anti seize on the threads you’d be good for longer than six months, changing them out or at least inspecting them that often is a good idea, at least until you’ve got some good bench mark data. Anytime you put dissimilar metals together, especially in salt water anti seize or thread sealant is a must.

 

[Judge]

Picked up the 275SD from the 10-Hour Service. I've seen $300 - $1000 for 10-hour Service on a twin. I paid $549 w/ tax.

According to the invoice they did grease the Intermediate Bearing as well as change the oil. It also said they sprayed Corrosion Guard all over the engines, etc.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Picked up the 275SD from the 10-Hour Service. I've seen $300 - $1000 for 10-hour Service on a twin. I paid $549 w/ tax.

According to the invoice they did grease the Intermediate Bearing as well as change the oil. It also said they sprayed Corrosion Guard all over the engines, etc.

Thanks for the follow up Judge!! You are on your way now! Did the boat fit under the bridge okay?

 

[Judge]

Thanks for the follow up Judge!! You are on your way now! Did the boat fit under the bridge okay?

I had a bout 6 - 8" to spare hitting low tide..... it would be a tight fit at high tide for sure!

 

[Bottom Bracket]

Compression Check?

 

[Judge]

Compression Check?

Didn't say that they checked the compression.... but I'm not too worried. It gets on plane fast and I'm hitting 50MPH with two people and a full load of fuel with both tachs reading the same RPM.

I'm pretty impressed with the performance for such a big jet boat. It burns a lot of full but it's a perfect size to go out on the Gulf of Mexico and has plenty of power.

 

[Judge]

Just an FYI since spark plugs crept into the discussion. I was doing some research. My 275SD takes LFR7A plugs but NGK also makes the LFR7AIX that is an Iridium plug with a trivalent metal plating to eliminate the need to put anti-seize on the threads.

I'm going to do a little research before ordering any but attached is the brochure for the IX series plugs. I can get them from Amazon for $33 for 4-pack while the LFR7A 8-pack is $57 on eBay.

 

[drewkaree]

Just an FYI since spark plugs crept into the discussion. I was doing some research. My 275SD takes LFR7A plugs but NGK also makes the LFR7AIX that is an Iridium plug with a trivalent metal plating to eliminate the need to put anti-seize on the threads.

I'm going to do a little research before ordering any but attached is the brochure for the IX series plugs. I can get them from Amazon for $33 for 4-pack while the LFR7A 8-pack is $57 on eBay.

I would think you are not going to need the Iridium plugs, as that seems to be a material used for longevity in car to allow those multiple tens of thousands of hours before recommended plug changes in an auto engine and if I remember correctly, NGK has that trivalent coating on all of their plugs

I'm staying out of the anti-seize debate, other than to say I have read several recommendations that when using anti-seize for something that is torqued, unless it's specifically mentions using anti-seize for the torque specification, that you should lower the torque spec by 20 to 25%.

For instance, my plugs are supposed to torqued in at 9.6 ft lb and no anti-seize if I were to add a DOT of anti-seize, I theoretically should be torquing those plugs in anywhere between 7.2 to 7.6 ft lb instead. I pull my plugs at the end of every season to fog the motor, so I simply don't use anti-seize, as I don't use the boat often enough seemingly to have them stick, so I go with the manual recommendation for torque

 

[HangOutdoors]

Just an FYI since spark plugs crept into the discussion. I was doing some research. My 275SD takes LFR7A plugs but NGK also makes the LFR7AIX that is an Iridium plug with a trivalent metal plating to eliminate the need to put anti-seize on the threads.

I'm going to do a little research before ordering any but attached is the brochure for the IX series plugs. I can get them from Amazon for $33 for 4-pack while the LFR7A 8-pack is $57 on eBay.

You won't get any benefit from Iridium's. No performance or fuel savings. Plus you will most likely be changing every year. Some say with the Iridiums you can go two years. Meh. I went down that road and switched back to the standard MFG spec on my plugs. I guess if they are cheaper it makes sense. I also recommend against using anti-seize on the spark plugs, some do. Torque them to spec with a T Wrench and call it good. If you are changing every year with your maintenance, you have nothing to worry about.

 

[RobbieO]

Dropped the boat at the dealer this morning. Of course it is impossible to talk to an actual tech......

According to the Service Manual they don't change the oil filters at the 10-hour service. They change them at the 50-hour service. I questioned it and they said those are the recommendations so they follow what Yamaha recommends and that is what they have done on every jet boat they've sold. I told them ok.... since they are the Yamaha dealers and they sold me the YES Warranty then I should be covered if anything goes off the rails.

The Service Manager couldn't tell me what they do with the Intermediate Bearing lubrication. So I guess I will find out when I get the paperwork later today.

When I lived up north and had a shop and could do all my own service, I would be doing the oil filters and the bearing. But now that I live in Florida and don't have a shop or place to do it (and getting older), I've got to rely on the dealer. While that costs more and you roll the dice on it being done right, the upside is if anything happens it's on the dealer for them to get it covered under YES.

Speaking from my experience, my dealer replaced both of my filters, and said they don’t add grease to the intermediate bearings until 100 Hrs. They did agree to add one small pump from their gun. Not changing the oil filter(s) is BS. That’s one of the purposes of the 10 hour service. To get rid of any manufacturing debris and/or friction wear during the break-in.

 

[Judge]

I would think you are not going to need the Iridium plugs, as that seems to be a material used for longevity in car to allow those multiple tens of thousands of hours before recommended plug changes in an auto engine and if I remember correctly, NGK has that trivalent coating on all of their plugs

I'm staying out of the anti-seize debate, other than to say I have read several recommendations that when using anti-seize for something that is torqued, unless it's specifically mentions using anti-seize for the torque specification, that you should lower the torque spec by 20 to 25%.

For instance, my plugs are supposed to torqued in at 9.6 ft lb and no anti-seize if I were to add a DOT of anti-seize, I theoretically should be torquing those plugs in anywhere between 7.2 to 7.6 ft lb instead. I pull my plugs at the end of every season to fog the motor, so I simply don't use anti-seize, as I don't use the boat often enough seemingly to have them stick, so I go with the manual recommendation for torque

You won't get any benefit from Iridium's. No performance or fuel savings. Plus you will most likely be changing every year. Some say with the Iridiums you can go two years. Meh. I went down that road and switched back to the standard MFG spec on my plugs. I guess if they are cheaper it makes sense. I also recommend against using anti-seize on the spark plugs, some do. Torque them to spec with a T Wrench and call it good. If you are changing every year with your maintenance, you have nothing to worry about.

I'm not looking for any performance benefits from Iridium. If I would run them, it is about the design of the plug not requiring any anti-sieze.

I run exclusively in brackish and salt water in southwest Florida so corrosion is accelerated. The boat will also sit unused June - September. I've seen more than a few posts about spark plugs breaking off from galvanic corrosion. I like the idea of not needing to use an anti-seize compound on the plug threads and not having to worry if I end up going for 12-months or longer without pulling the plugs... especially since I no longer have access to a shop to do my own maintenance, etc.


As an FYI.... NGK does make plugs specific to Marine applications. They also have the Trivalent metal for the threads and also a marine specific resistor that prevents any RFI interference with marine electronics. However, they do not make a plug that meets the specs for the SVHO and what they do offer is fairly limitied.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Here’s the data sheet for the NGK 6955 plugs that go into the TR-1 engines. Notice that the manufacturing gap is .032”, the Yamaha service manual state’s minimum gap at .028” max gap is .031”. The service manual also states if the gap is out of spec to replace the plug. I’m going to read that as, set the gap at .028” and if the gap has grown beyond .031” replace the plug. Spark plug installation torque is 9.6 ft lbs. The service manual also states to be sure and not let any water or debris fall into the open spark plug hole, then goes on to say to clean the spark plug gasket surface, I’d like to see how that’s done without getting debris into the spark plug hole. I do usually give several blasts of compressed air into the spark plug well after removing the coil pack and before removing the plug.



Here‘s the box the set of four plugs came in. Thanks for pointing out the good deal @drewkaree! They do look like the real McCoy based on very close inspection.
Note the install torque for aluminum heads at 7.2-8.7 ft lbs, OR hand tight + 1/2 turn. Notice also the second sentence of the first line below the tightening chart, “ always refer to your owners manual and gap to manufacturer specifications“.



And just to eliminate all confusion [sic] on the individual spark plug box it shows the tightening method of hand tight + 1/4 turn. Way back when, I remember being taught that a spark plug that has this type of sealing surface / gasket which is a crush washer, that tightening by a fractional amount of turns was the proper way to tighten them.



Here is a pic of a brand new plug and it’s crush washer.



And a pic of a plug with 73 hours on it. You can see the crush washer is crushed. Also notice two threads of heat..I’d like to see three, but it is a boat engine, and the threads are pristine. I did not put anti seize on these threads before installation.



Here is a pic of the plugs that came out this season with probably a bit over a hundred hours, and I put anti seize on it.



I’m a pragmatic not a dogmatic, so based on observed conditions, @drewkaree ’s comments and the fact I boat in fresh water I‘m going to have to seriously reconsider putting anti seize on the next set of plugs, at least one set to see what happens. I do think if I was boating in saltwater I would put a very thin coat of anti seize on the plugs and would tighten the plugs between a 1/4 & 1/2 turn (splitting the NGK packaging instructions baby) per the NGK directions, dissimilar metals is bad, toss in salt water and it’s very bad. My intention will be to check the amount of turn when I torque the plugs as well, my recollection is slightly less than a 1/2 turn.

Also, be sure and use a good wire type feeler gauge when checking plug gaps, it should be a snug fit as you pull the wire through. That’s an old school one I’ve had for decades…



Epilogue; I have to wonder if these cases of seized spark plugs is the result of over tightening, in @lazergeek case I think it was the factory installed plugs, toss in a little salt water and the plug becomes one with the head. Does over tightening remove the non corrosion coating ? And why was it only one (think goodness it was only one) plug that seized ? If it was a case of corrosion shouldn’t there have been more that were seized? There’s also something to be said for possible corrosion on the treads that are exposed in the combustion chamber and those threads possibly corroding and those corroded threads making extraction impossible?

 

[Judge]

Just an FYI on my 10-Hour Service. Went out on the boat today and I pulled the clean-out plugs to drain the water and spray a little YamaShield Ant-Corrosion on them. I found the dealer lubed up the clean-out plugs with fresh grease. Nice to know they did that as part of the 10-Hour service.

 

[HangOutdoors]

Just an FYI on my 10-Hour Service. Went out on the boat today and I pulled the clean-out plugs to drain the water and spray a little YamaShield Ant-Corrosion on them. I found the dealer lubed up the clean-out plugs with fresh grease. Nice to know they did that as part of the 10-Hour service.

Use Pool Gasket Lubricant on them, it is fantastic. I prefer it over the YamaShield which isn't as thick and washes out quicker. I keep a tube on the boat and hit them every couple of times out. This is the one that I use.

Amazon.com: 4oz LubeTube – Pool O-Ring Lubricant (Made in USA) : Patio, Lawn & Garden

 

[Judge]

Use Pool Gasket Lubricant on them, it is fantastic. I prefer it over the YamaShield which isn't as thick and washes out quicker. I keep a tube on the boat and hit them every couple of times out. This is the one that I use.

Amazon.com: 4oz LubeTube – Pool O-Ring Lubricant (Made in USA) : Patio, Lawn & Garden

Pretty funny...... I originally had that in my hands to use from my pool filter pump o-ring. Thanks for confirming that's a good choice!

 

[HangOutdoors]

Pretty funny...... I originally had that in my hands to use from my pool filter pump o-ring. Thanks for confirming that's a good choice!

I also use it on my keel plug and compartment drain plugs. Works like a champ.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

I went poking around to see if I could find the spark plug gapping tool and it is a “vintage” 1970’s gapping tool.. found this one on amazon.

https://www.amazon.com/Stanley-Proto-J000K-Spark-Gauge/dp/B002BXJ7F8/ref=sr_1_58_sspa?keywords=spark+plug+gap+tool&qid=1697637562&sr=8-58-spons&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9tdGY&psc=1

I wanted a spare to throw in the boat took kit.

I‘ll let you know how it works..

I also found out how to properly use the tool by watching a you tube vid.. fore head slap “I could have had a V8” moment. Got all 12 plugs gapped last night for future use.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Here’s the data sheet for the NGK 6955 plugs that go into the TR-1 engines. Notice that the manufacturing gap is .032”, the Yamaha service manual state’s minimum gap at .028” max gap is .031”. The service manual also states if the gap is out of spec to replace the plug. I’m going to read that as, set the gap at .028” and if the gap has grown beyond .031” replace the plug. Spark plug installation torque is 9.6 ft lbs. The service manual also states to be sure and not let any water or debris fall into the open spark plug hole, then goes on to say to clean the spark plug gasket surface, I’d like to see how that’s done without getting debris into the spark plug hole. I do usually give several blasts of compressed air into the spark plug well after removing the coil pack and before removing the plug.

View attachment 210419

Here‘s the box the set of four plugs came in. Thanks for pointing out the good deal @drewkaree! They do look like the real McCoy based on very close inspection.
Note the install torque for aluminum heads at 7.2-8.7 ft lbs, OR hand tight + 1/2 turn. Notice also the second sentence of the first line below the tightening chart, “ always refer to your owners manual and gap to manufacturer specifications“.

View attachment 210418

And just to eliminate all confusion [sic] on the individual spark plug box it shows the tightening method of hand tight + 1/4 turn. Way back when, I remember being taught that a spark plug that has this type of sealing surface / gasket which is a crush washer, that tightening by a fractional amount of turns was the proper way to tighten them.

View attachment 210420

Here is a pic of a brand new plug and it’s crush washer.

View attachment 210421

And a pic of a plug with 73 hours on it. You can see the crush washer is crushed. Also notice two threads of heat..I’d like to see three, but it is a boat engine, and the threads are pristine. I did not put anti seize on these threads before installation.

View attachment 210422

Here is a pic of the plugs that came out this season with probably a bit over a hundred hours, and I put anti seize on it.

View attachment 210424

I’m a pragmatic not a dogmatic, so based on observed conditions, @drewkaree ’s comments and the fact I boat in fresh water I‘m going to have to seriously reconsider putting anti seize on the next set of plugs, at least one set to see what happens. I do think if I was boating in saltwater I would put a very thin coat of anti seize on the plugs and would tighten the plugs between a 1/4 & 1/2 turn (splitting the NGK packaging instructions baby) per the NGK directions, dissimilar metals is bad, toss in salt water and it’s very bad. My intention will be to check the amount of turn when I torque the plugs as well, my recollection is slightly less than a 1/2 turn.

Also, be sure and use a good wire type feeler gauge when checking plug gaps, it should be a snug fit as you pull the wire through. That’s an old school one I’ve had for decades…

View attachment 210423

Epilogue; I have to wonder if these cases of seized spark plugs is the result of over tightening, in @lazergeek case I think it was the factory installed plugs, toss in a little salt water and the plug becomes one with the head. Does over tightening remove the non corrosion coating ? And why was it only one (think goodness it was only one) plug that seized ? If it was a case of corrosion shouldn’t there have been more that were seized? There’s also something to be said for possible corrosion on the treads that are exposed in the combustion chamber and those threads possibly corroding and those corroded threads making extraction impossible?

Update: While researching some other motor related stuff, I was informed there was a run of the TR-1 engines from the factory with the #1 cylinder spark plug installed cross threaded. I can’t confirm or deny based on my personal experience, but I think @lazergeek had one of his TR-1 engines have the #1 cylinder spark plug be inexplicably stuck in the head at very low hours, I think it was the OEM plug, I’ve slept a few times since then so ….