High and Dry Storage Fuel

[Noles187]

So I have an opening at a local high and dry marina but the only fuel they offer is ethanol free and I have the SVHO motors. Do I not NEED to run 93 fuel ONLY?

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

So I have an opening at a local high and dry marina but the only fuel they offer is ethanol free and I have the SVHO motors. Do I not NEED to run 93 fuel ONLY?

What is the octane of the ethanol free fuel?
I think your manual calls for 91 octane?

 

[EastonRob]

Yes, I believe the requirement is 91 octane minimum. Non ethanol gas actually has more energy per gallon than ethanol. I fill my FSH 255 at a local marina that only has 89 ethanol free. The owner there say it's the equivalent of 93 octane ethanol. I'm not sure that's 100% true, so I also add Boostane (gas treatment) to each fill up.

No problems running two seasons this way, but I also rarely go max speed. I'm more comfortable cruising 27 to 35 mph than at WOT.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Yes, I believe the requirement is 91 octane minimum. Non ethanol gas actually has more energy per gallon than ethanol. I fill my FSH 255 at a local marina that only has 89 ethanol free. The owner there say it's the equivalent of 93 octane ethanol. I'm not sure that's 100% true, so I also add Boostane (gas treatment) to each fill up.

No problems running two seasons this way, but I also rarely go max speed. I'm more comfortable cruising 27 to 35 mph than at WOT.

89 & 93 ethanol or not are NOT the same from an anti knock perspective, with 93 having substantially more anti knock than 89.

 

[EastonRob]

Yes, I agree. That's why I still add the octane booster.

 

[Judge]

I have a '22 275SD and the specs say 91 Octane. I rack store my boat as well and most of the Marinas here in Southwest Florida only have Rec 90 Fuel.... a few have Rec 89 and none in the immediate area have Rec 91.

If you aren't running WOT all the time, you likely won't have any issues. The stock compression is 8.5 to 1 and most of the boost isn't going to kick-in unless you are running hard and fast. At 89 Octane I would be more concerned.

I had a '14 SX192 SVHO and it was also required 91. If I was trailering I would fill it with street 91 or 93 but sometimes I only ran 90 or even 89 a few times when that was the only thing available on the water. I never had an issue with the motor and I did run that boat WOT a lot... but that boat was not very heavy.

I have about about 18 hours on my 275SD now and just had it in for the 10-hour service. The dealer is on the water and their marina also only offers Rec 90. When I asked about using 90 instead of 91 they did not think it would be an issue. I'm rarely running WOT because I only average about 1.5MPG as it is..... so running WOT and I can see the fuel level drop real-time! ?


I did buy Boostane Marine off Amazon to try in case I do intend to run harder. I was never much of a believer in Octane Booster..... a lot of it out there is snake oil. I did a bunch of research and Boostane seemed to be legit. I watched a few videos from independent tuners with Dynos do some before and after with Boostane and to their surprise it did make a difference as they monitored engines with knock sensors and automatic timing adjustments.

The good things about it is it only takes a few onces to boost my 90 gallon tank from 90 to 91. I'm not measuring that accurately. According to the mixing chart it would only take 2.7oz mixed with 90 gallons to go from 90 to 91. I'm pouring in about a quarter of the quart can so that would be taking me up to about 92.

I got a 2-pack on Amazon for $62. That would give me 8 tanks worth and end up costing $7.75 a tank. If I actually measured out about 3 ounces it would be more like $4 a tank and I would get about 16 tanks worth.

https://boostane.com/products/boostane-marine-octane-booster

 

[EastonRob]

I did some research on octane boosters as well, and I came to the same conclusion you did and believe Boostane is legit. Getting the lid off the bottle the first time was a nightmare. I tried to do it at the dock fuel point on a busy weekend with other boats in queue. I finally ended up ripping the cap off and splattered some on my brand new boat's cushions, which promptly and permanently stained them Found out later there's actually a video on their website on how to open the bottle. I get that it's strong stuff and hazardous, but who needs an instructional video for opening the bottle?

Still, I do find adding the right amount of the product into the tank without spilling it on the boat or in the water to be a challenge. Any tips for how to do that more gracefully welcome....

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Those cans are sealed like that for a couple of reasons, to prevent spills and to keep the booster from losing its lighter ends. See if you can find a funnel to make adding it at the fuel dock easier. In the boostane videos they are using a cool little funnel to add the boostane to a mustang.

 

[Judge]

I did some research on octane boosters as well, and I came to the same conclusion you did and believe Boostane is legit. Getting the lid off the bottle the first time was a nightmare. I tried to do it at the dock fuel point on a busy weekend with other boats in queue. I finally ended up ripping the cap off and splattered some on my brand new boat's cushions, which promptly and permanently stained them Found out later there's actually a video on their website on how to open the bottle. I get that it's strong stuff and hazardous, but who needs an instructional video for opening the bottle?

Still, I do find adding the right amount of the product into the tank without spilling it on the boat or in the water to be a challenge. Any tips for how to do that more gracefully welcome....

I originally was using the blue funnel but the angle wasn't great to keep from spilling any. I have since switched to something like the second option. The I can be on the swim platform, hold it upright and keep away from the seats. I didn't want to use the screw on spout that came with it because the spout is just too short when the can is full and you are trying to tilt it into the opening.

I didn't have any trouble opening the can.... but it does take care because the can is full and the metal is seriously soft and it bends with the least amount of pressure as you squeeze to hold on to it. Then when its full it can start pushing out the top.

 

[lazergeek]

Ethonal Freel in Miami and key area is 90 octane so your not that far off from 91.

If your going to use fuel cans I suggest getting a Tera Pump. I just tried mine yesterday for the first time and while it does take a little longer to fill then direct poaring I was able to do other things instead of holding a fual can. They also have auto shutoff when the tank is full. I personally use VP Racing cans and love them, Each holds about 5.5 gallon, but the Tera Pump for those cans doens have a screw on cap that fits (it looks right but the threads are wrong) so I just drop the pump directl in the can without the cap and works great.

 

[NewGuy]

I use Rislone (See Link). No mess and easy to keep a few bottles on board. Performs very well. You'll need to do your own math. With 91 at the dock, I need about 3 bottles per fill.

https://www.amazon.com/Rislone-4747-12PK-Concentrated-Booster-Fluid_Ounces/dp/B07FY313PP/ref=sr_1_3?crid=64N4FB0ZVOTF&keywords=rislone+octane+booster&qid=1698004010&s=automotive&sprefix=rislone+octane+booster%2Cautomotive%2C78&sr=1-3

 

[MilesPrower]

I buy the 6-packs of Boostane from Amazon:

Amazon.com

The 6-packs come with 3 screw-on reusable funnels. I always keep 2 funnels on the boat, just in case I lose one.

I installed a stainless-steel-wire shelf in my helm closet specifically to store 2 bottles of Boostane, 2 spray cans of Yamalube, O-ring lube, a couple rags, etc.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

I use Rislone (See Link). No mess and easy to keep a few bottles on board. Performs very well. You'll need to do your own math. With 91 at the dock, I need about 3 bottles per fill.

https://www.amazon.com/Rislone-4747-12PK-Concentrated-Booster-Fluid_Ounces/dp/B07FY313PP/ref=sr_1_3?crid=64N4FB0ZVOTF&keywords=rislone+octane+booster&qid=1698004010&s=automotive&sprefix=rislone+octane+booster%2Cautomotive%2C78&sr=1-3

If you‘ve got 91 octane at the dock, why are you using an octane booster?

 

[Noles187]

If you‘ve got 91 octane at the dock, why are you using an octane booster?

I think most docks have 90 REC

 

[biffdotorg]

I had a '14 SX192 SVHO and it was also required 91.

Did you add and intercooler to your 192? Or did someone else upgrade it to SVHO? 192's were Supercharged with no intercooler from the factory and only required a minimum of 86 like the NA 1.8

Either way, the non SVHO engines are not sensitive to octane. 91-93 won't hurt an NA 1.8, but it won't help it either from an octane perspective.

Folks are still confusing the ethanol and octane numbers with power, quality and detonation. Engines tuned for 91 or greater (SVHO) have the potential of detonation issues with lower octane fuel. (thus knock sensors in many other vehicles, like my snowmobile) But octane ratings are octane ratings, not power ratings. One is a result of the other and not reversed. In other words, an engine tuned for 86 will run efficiently and get power from that octaine rating, but will not usually benefit from a higher octane fuel. But an engine tuned for 91, my be hindered by 87. Not for the ethanol, but for the detonation issues.

2014 AR192 manual (PS: RON is not used in the US)


Just put in what the manual recommends, and store as is recommended and these engines will give you many years.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

I think most docks have 90 REC

Okay, but he said “With 91 at the dock, I need about 3 bottles per fill”, I’m assuming fuel dock here, and also assuming he’s adding three bottles of octane booster to the 91?

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

Did you add and intercooler to your 192? Or did someone else upgrade it to SVHO? 192's were Supercharged with no intercooler from the factory and only required a minimum of 86 like the NA 1.8

Either way, the non SVHO engines are not sensitive to octane. 91-93 won't hurt an NA 1.8, but it won't help it either from an octane perspective.

Folks are still confusing the ethanol and octane numbers with power, quality and detonation. Engines tuned for 91 or greater (SVHO) have the potential of detonation issues with lower octane fuel. (thus knock sensors in many other vehicles, like my snowmobile) But octane ratings are octane ratings, not power ratings. One is a result of the other and not reversed. In other words, an engine tuned for 86 will run efficiently and get power from that octaine rating, but will not usually benefit from a higher octane fuel. But an engine tuned for 91, my be hindered by 87. Not for the ethanol, but for the detonation issues.

2014 AR192 manual (PS: RON is not used in the US)
View attachment 210793

Just put in what the manual recommends, and store as is recommended and these engines will give you many years.

Spot on! There’s a myth that is 91 octane has more power btu’s than 87 octane. The octane numbers are just the AKI (anti knock index) numbers. Ethanol / Non Ethanol doesn’t matter, the AKI is the AKI number and that’s it.

A motorcycle mechanic friend of mine, Brett Scott Calicott, explained the whole octane thing to me. When the four stroke dirt bikes came back, lots of folks were having trouble starting them especially when hot, this was made much worse by people using 100 octane “race gas” instead of the required 91 octane. It has to do with burn rate or flame speed at a given cylinder pressure, if too high of an octane fuel is used in a given engine, 100 instead of 91, the air fuel mix will burn a lot slower than the design, creating several problems, starting is one, too long of flame duration, higher cylinder temperatures, lower power, and higher operating cost. He told me how he was wrenching for a guy in a spec series road racing series, this guy was sponsored by Sunoco and Sunoco was supplying him with 105 octane fuel for an engine that required 85 octane for its 8.5:1 compression ratio. When he tore down the engine he found the piston looked like someone had taken a welding torch to it, melted crater marks and such. Brett took the piston back to his auto shop teacher at Pasadena City college and showed it to him. The teacher asked the correct questions and told Brett that due to the too high octane, the flame was following the piston down into the stroke and creating extreme heating on top of the piston, melting it in fact. He went on to explain that the total burn of the fuel air mix should take place in 30-60° Of crank rotation, this creates the highest power / efficiency for a given fuel charge. Brett passed this along to the rider and the rider insisted that was bs. So Brett snuck in a five gallon can of 85 octane and put that in the bike. The racer came back in after practice and said tge bike was running better than it had ever run, the proceeded to qualify his best and also did much better in the race. After the race, the rider was talking about the noticeable increase in power and that he was able to pull riders in the straights that he could not before. That is when a Brett revealed he had put 85 octane pump gas in his bike instead of the Sunoco 105. Needles to say the 105 was never used again.

In normally aspirated engines, the rule of thumb is a reduction of 1 octane number for every 1000’ of density altitude gain due to the decrease in cylinder pressure. The rule of thumb for SC engines is .5 reduction for every 1000’ of density altitude gain. Turbocharged engines by and large still make the same cylinder pressure at higher altitudes since their turbines and compressors are driven by exhaust gas and not slaved to engine speed, typically a turbocharged engine will hold the same peak cylinder pressure up to 8500-10,000’ depending on the turbo size and waste gate.

 

[biffdotorg]

This is a great explanation. And for all of you that are experiencing hard starts, I am unsure if it effects our boats, but it sure does in all the other engines I own when we get into cold temps.

My buddy runs 91 in his Ranger (for piece of mind, smile) while I run the recommended 87 in my General (similar engines). Once the temps drop below zero, his was hard starting, while mine would fire up as normal. He puts in a tank of 87 and all his hard starting went away. I think snowmobilers know this rule of thumb more than anyone, as we ride in -20f - +35f and the wrong octane will make for a bad weekend.

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

This is a great explanation. And for all of you that are experiencing hard starts, I am unsure if it effects our boats, but it sure does in all the other engines I own when we get into cold temps.

My buddy runs 91 in his Ranger (for piece of mind, smile) while I run the recommended 87 in my General (similar engines). Once the temps drop below zero, his was hard starting, while mine would fire up as normal. He puts in a tank of 87 and all his hard starting went away. I think snowmobilers know this rule of thumb more than anyone, as we ride in -20f - +35f and the wrong octane will make for a bad weekend.

As my friend Brett said, run the lowest octane you can get away with to make your engine start/run/make the most power/get the best mpg and cost you the least. My own personal experience riding one time, I had been running 90 non ethanol when I was in Colorado. Dropped down to Utah on my way home to visit where I had spread my Dads ashes. I went for a long dual sport ride on my 2009 Husaberg fuel injected FE 570, from 7000’ up to 12,000’, during the ride I needed fuel, I had to drop down to Koosuram, the gas pump, singular, in Koosuram had two choices, diesel or 85 octane. After filling up with 85 from about 1/3 of a tank or less, and getting back up to the trails I noticed how much better my bike was running off idle, it no longer was surging as I opened the throttle and how much less my radiator fan was coming on.

 

[NewGuy]

Okay, but he said “With 91 at the dock, I need about 3 bottles per fill”, I’m assuming fuel dock here, and also assuming he’s adding three bottles of octane booster to the 91?

Sorry - been away and that was a mistake. The dock is 90.