Resources Justifying all activities?

[BigAbe75]

Anybody have any good resources to assist in justifying all of our activities on a body of water?

Our local lake, Lake Lou Yaeger (a city owned lake), is attempting to propose that large wake activities be banned. There is a group bringing a proposal to the next city council meeting requesting to explore options. This is the 2nd revision already.... the first revision lasted about 24 hours because it was a resolution jumping straight to banning wakeboarding and wakesurfing. Now, the resolution says they just want to discuss options...

As you can imagine, there are some vocal folks on FB in favor and against.

We have started a group who opposes and is starting to compile councilman contact info, other resources, etc. So, we are going to attempt to educate folks.

The main issue that they have is the large wakes bouncing docks and causing property damage and erosion control.

Personally, I feel like a little smarter deployment of no-wake buoys to keep folks from being too close to private docks would alleviate the problem. But, just curious if anyone else has had to fight this battle and whether you have possible documentation?

At least one of our little group members must be a member of the Water Sports Industry Association, and has shared a report entitled "Characterization of Wake-Sport Wakes and their Potential Impact on Shorelines" prepared in Nov. of 2015. I wish I could share that document here, because it's awesome... but I think it's probably a member only kind of resource and don't want to violate their copyright.

Here's the letter that they posted on FB, yesterday.

Here's the lake website, if interested.

Lake Lou Yaeger - The City of Litchfield

Get outside at Litchfield’s Lake Lou Yaeger. This 1,357-acre, 5.5-mile-long lake is the centerpiece of Litchfield’s bustling outdoors culture.

visitlitchfield.com

 

[anmut]

MN is currently dealing with wake surfing related issues. Like anything, a few people that ride too close to shore and do too many passes in the same area, ruin it for everyone. I would suggest to propose self regulations be adopted (200' from shore, less than 2 passes in the same area by one boat over X time) than let a city council decide it. Also, if you have some kids and teens that could talk about the impact the sports have made on their lives, that holds way more water than "rich guys in expensive boats ruining my shoreline", if you know what I mean.

 

[Dean P]

I can understand their point and agree that large wake creating boats will cause damage to docks and shorelines. Agreed that pushing the buoys further out will/should solve this. Just wondering, is the lake large enough where this could be done in the middle; away from everything?

 

[BigAbe75]

Also, if you have some kids and teens that could talk about the impact the sports have made on their lives, that holds way more water than "rich guys in expensive boats ruining my shoreline", if you know what I mean.

Great point!

 

[Beachbummer]

Random thoughts...
Are big boats allowed that would make similar wakes normally with their displacement? If so I'd make sure the discussion is directed at all wake producers, not just wake boarders, to maybe increase the size of your team. Maybe someone on the council has a big yacht that makes bigger wakes that those wakeboarding? Makes for good press.

 

[BigAbe75]

I can understand their point and agree that large wake creating boats will cause damage to docks and shorelines. Agreed that pushing the buoys further out will/should solve this. Just wondering, is the lake large enough where this could be done in the middle; away from everything?

Well, there's a pretty good cove type area where I always go that has deeper water and has no homes along it. Along the main channel, there are a lot of private docks... honestly the problems are caused more by the boats pulling tubes at high speed and getting too close. If you go more to the center along that area, you're more in the way. So, boats always try to get out of the center... but end up being closer to the docks than residents would prefer.

 

[BigAbe75]

Random thoughts...
Are big boats allowed that would make similar wakes normally with their displacement? If so I'd make sure the discussion is directed at all wake producers, not just wake boarders, to maybe increase the size of your team. Maybe someone on the council has a big yacht that makes bigger wakes that those wakeboarding? Makes for good press.

Not really. It's a small enough lake that 26' is probably about the largest that I've seen. All are bowriders.

They're trying to make it so they are restricting activities, rather than boats. So, your wake boat is welcome as long as you're skiing or pulling a tube.

 

[Dean P]

Well, there's a pretty good cove type area where I always go that has deeper water and has no homes along it. Along the main channel, there are a lot of private docks... honestly the problems are caused more by the boats pulling tubes at high speed and getting too close. If you go more to the center along that area, you're more in the way. So, boats always try to get out of the center... but end up being closer to the docks than residents would prefer.

Are their speed limits on the lake? Is it patrolled? Do you have to pay to use the lake? Are there rules and regulations regarding boating? Just curious...

 

[marcham]

Trying to make them go away is probably not going to work. The best plan is probably to understand their concerns and mitigate any environmental impacts.

1) Are there any especially sensitive shorelines that are protected (state or federal parks)?

2) Are there any endangered species that nest on the shoreline?

3) Are there any sensitive plant systems on the shoreline? In the same sense, are owner allowed to make improvements to the shoreline? If so, then they can't argue wakes are harmful, because any improvement within 100feet of the shoreline will be harmful. ( https://tspace.library.utoronto.ca/bitstream/1807/68007/1/Egan_Kathleen_G_201411_MA_thesis.pdf ). If they are truly concerned about sensitive species or shoreline erosion, then landowner's improvements to the shoreline is what needs to be addressed first and foremost.

4) Are the concerns that it is difficult for paddleboarders and canoes to enjoy the lake while others are making waves? That is a legitimate concern.

One way to address water use concerns is to allocate areas (distances from shoreline) and times of day for certain activities. That way, paddleboarders know that from 0600-0800 they won't get swamped and surfers know they won't have to dodge errant canoes between 0800-1000.

By clearly identifying the time and place for certain activities, then potential conflicts between user groups are reduced.

Get together with like minded individuals and lawyer up. Council will respond much better to representation by a lawyer than that of a homeowner as they have no interest in spending taxpayer money on a lawsuit down the road.

My brother is going through some of the same issues, it's no fun, expensive and stressful. Good luck.

 

[BigAbe75]

Are their speed limits on the lake? Is it patrolled? Do you have to pay to use the lake? Are there rules and regulations regarding boating? Just curious...

Right now, there is a $10 day pass, or an annual pass with differing prices based on horsepower. 300+ hp is the top range and is $80 for Apr 1 thru Mar 31. 200-300hp is $75.

Rules and Regs - just typical safety stuff. No speed limit, no size restriction, travel is counter-clockwise.

Here's the lake: Google Maps

It's about 5.5 miles top to bottom, I believe. Not real sure how far across maybe 1/4 to 1/2 mile.

In the pic below, you can see the problem area in Yellow. It's heavily populated, and not very wide. So, every boat ripping down the channel pulling a ski or tube ends up veering over to the side to get out of the middle and ends up closer than they would like. In red, I circled the area that I like to surf (between the 2 marinas) ... no houses, and water is 20' deep.

 

[anmut]

In the yellow strip, can you have north and southbound boats traveling safely and staying out of a danger area to shore?

 

[Julian]

My coworker lives on that lake....will need to see if he's aware of what they are up to. He is very close to the Mayor I think!!!

 

[BigAbe75]

Trying to make them go away is probably not going to work. The best plan is probably to understand their concerns and mitigate any environmental impacts.

1) Are there any especially sensitive shorelines that are protected (state or federal parks)?

2) Are there any endangered species that nest on the shoreline?

3) Are there any sensitive plant systems on the shoreline? In the same sense, are owner allowed to make improvements to the shoreline? If so, then they can't argue wakes are harmful, because any improvement within 100feet of the shoreline will be harmful. ( https://tspace.library.utoronto.ca/bitstream/1807/68007/1/Egan_Kathleen_G_201411_MA_thesis.pdf ). If they are truly concerned about sensitive species or shoreline erosion, then landowner's improvements to the shoreline is what needs to be addressed first and foremost.

4) Are the concerns that it is difficult for paddleboarders and canoes to enjoy the lake while others are making waves? That is a legitimate concern.

One way to address water use concerns is to allocate areas (distances from shoreline) and times of day for certain activities. That way, paddleboarders know that from 0600-0800 they won't get swamped and surfers know they won't have to dodge errant canoes between 0800-1000.

By clearly identifying the time and place for certain activities, then potential conflicts between user groups are reduced.

Get together with like minded individuals and lawyer up. Council will respond much better to representation by a lawyer than that of a homeowner as they have no interest in spending taxpayer money on a lawsuit down the road.

My brother is going through some of the same issues, it's no fun, expensive and stressful. Good luck.

Good thoughts!

They have precedence for time based restrictions. Jetskiis are currently only allowed on weekdays. Which, also causes some issues. One realtor has said that several home buyers that she was trying to sell on the lake have walked when they realized that. We have a good mix of full time residents and weekenders... and a weekender from the big city is going to want to ride their jetski on the weekend.

The proposal above states that there won't be any financial impact... and I find that to be naive.

Oh, on the shoreline.... so each homeowner is responsible for doing their own thing. So, some have built vertical seawalls (which makes the waves worse as they bounce off), others have installed nice rip-rap rock, and others have done nothing. Also, the lake and lots surrounding are owned by the city. So, when you buy a home, you are also getting a 99yr lease on the lot. City retains ownership.

1 side of the lake has homes. The opposite side of the lake has a nature preserve on the south end, and the rest has city owned primitive camping lots that you can lease on an annual basis.

 

[2kwik4u]

Just googled that lake. It's pretty dang small. 1,300 acres or so. We've got similar problems with the lake closest to Louisville. Taylorsville is highly regarded as being "too small for anything" and it's around 3,050 acres. I'm not sure you're going to really be able to "get away" from surf waves hitting the shoreline on something that small and narrow.

Time allowances, and good stewardship by surfers is likely the best solution I can see.

Considering the lakefront property is actually owned by the city, you may well have little legal legs to stand on. I'm not a lawyer by far, but that's the general feel I would get for something like that being setup in the first place.

 

[BigAbe75]

In the yellow strip, can you have north and southbound boats traveling safely and staying out of a danger area to shore?

Honestly, it is pretty tight along there. The boat traffic usually isn't very heavy, so anyone that is just cruising through usually will stay closer to the middle. As soon as you see boats traveling northbound, then the southbound traffic is going to have to veer closer to the edge. But, there are no buoys there to force people into a reasonable distance away. I think just a line of buoys 75 yards out would make a huge difference and still provide enough room for traffic.

 

[BigAbe75]

Time allowances, and good stewardship by surfers is likely the best solution I can see.

Agreed

Considering the lakefront property is actually owned by the city, you may well have little legal legs to stand on. I'm not a lawyer by far, but that's the general feel I would get for something like that being setup in the first place.

Yeah. The frustrating part is that it just feels like a knee-jerk reaction by a handful of folks. There hasn't been any communication, or other attempts at resolution.

There is a Lake Superintendent that patrols some... but I rarely see him out when I'm on the water. I don't know of anyone that has been ticketed. I have been told that on Saturday of Memorial Day and 4th of July weekend, the IDNR (Illinois Dept of Natural Resources) will be onsite and pull people over for safety checks and write tickets... but that's maybe a once a year event. I've never seen them, but my in-laws live on the lake and say it happens.

 

[BigAbe75]

My coworker lives on that lake....will need to see if he's aware of what they are up to. He is very close to the Mayor I think!!!

I forgot about that... but would be curious to hear his thoughts. This feels like it was put forth by a very small group of folks. But, in small towns... it only takes a small group, and everyone else to ignore it (or be kept in the dark), to get things done.

 

[anmut]

Agreed



Yeah. The frustrating part is that it just feels like a knee-jerk reaction by a handful of folks. There hasn't been any communication, or other attempts at resolution.

There is a Lake Superintendent that patrols some... but I rarely see him out when I'm on the water. I don't know of anyone that has been ticketed. I have been told that on Saturday of Memorial Day and 4th of July weekend, the IDNR (Illinois Dept of Natural Resources) will be onsite and pull people over for safety checks and write tickets... but that's maybe a once a year event. I've never seen them, but my in-laws live on the lake and say it happens.

I might suggest that you might appoint your own committee of non LEO boaters that "patrol" the area looking for offenders. That might be enough and then nobody has to spend money on bringing in actual law enforcement.

 

[haknslash]

Yea that is a very small lake to be sharing with wake boats, or hell any boats for that matter on a busy weekend. Looks like little to no coves to help either. I think the best thing is for boats to have a distance from shore or property but obviously that is not always that simple, especially if there are water hazards and shallows to avoid as a boater, or if there is really only a central narrow channel. I consider myself someone who respects people property and tries my best to stay away from homes and others when surfing, afterall I want to find the most remote and calm body of water away from everyone else for so I can get the best wave possible. However not everyone gives a care about their wake no matter the boat. Big cabin cruisers kick up a monster wave that makes any wake boats wave look like a joke lol. Swarms of pontoon boats and tritoons filled with 15 obese people and 4 massive coolers of beer can also kick up plenty of water and make it rough. Jet skis always buzzing close to the shore. People pulling tubes are about the worst in my area because they seem to go where everyone is hanging out (for the attention) so that means in the coves and always around the homes. Everyone has a part to play but the wake boats, because of advertising big and powerful waves will always be the red herring in teh group as it's an easy target. I don't buy into the erosion caused by wake boats stuff because if you've seen a large body of water on a windy day you know that constant banging of waves for hours on end is probably doing more harm than 50 boats passing by with a big wave. The larger, more open and deeper the body of water it is allows for some big swells that can form and just adding in normal busy pontoon and bowrider boat traffic it's already a washing machine. People like to place the blame solely at the helm of a wake boat but in most cases there are far less wake boats than all other boats on the lakes around the world. They see that big wave and immediately think of the woman and cat meme. You know the one...



I had to overlay and outline your lake on top of our main lake and I can see how that narrow body of water could get churned and feel small on a busy weekend.

 

[BigAbe75]

Yep. It for sure, is small. But, it’s one of the nicest in our area. Lots of people living and working in St Louis prefer to have their 2nd homes here.

Now, for me... it’s extra handy living about 2 miles away from the ramp. We can easily get 2-3 hours of boating in after work on summertime weekdays. But, if they do change the rules... I’ll be spending more time in Shelbyville as that’s only about a 75 minute drive.

We also have Carlyle Lake and Rend Lake in similar proximity. Carlyle is a corps lake, and super windy and busy. We haven’t been there in years.

I certainly understand the frustration of the homeowners. But, I just don’t think using the wake boats as scape goats is going to solve the overall problem of inconsiderate drivers.

Seems like they would be better served to beef up policing and/or enforcing fines, or set aside approved areas or designated time slots.

There are more than a few homeowners with wake boats. If they start telling their own homeowners that they can’t use their boat for its intended use, that will be interesting.

My father in law told me they were going to raise the annual pass for wake boats. (His neighbor is on this lake advocate committee, whatever that is) So, I went on down to the marina last weekend and bought my annual pass at the regular rate. Then, 2 days later, the letter above comes out. No mention of raising fees. It says prohibit the sport. If they do they, I would have skipped the pass.