Tow Vehicle Dilemma...

[Jim_in_Delaware]

The posted mileage difference between the two vehicles is not that great, if your budget on fuel is that limited … Speaking of which, do both vehicles recommend 87 or 91 octane fuel?

I know the Tundra uses ASME certified towing standards, does the dodge? I remember that Toyota was the first to go to ASME towing standards, while the other big three balked at it because it would have lowered their tow ratings. Further, be sure to check the tow ratings very very carefully as all of the big three had some slight of hand when it came to tow ratings.

The RAM 5.7 Hemi will run on either 87 or 91 octane. I have 22,000 miles on my 2020 RAM and have never used 91 octane fuel, so my numbers above are with using regular gas.

According to this article, "Beginning with the 2015 model year, Ram will become the first automaker to adopt the Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) J2807 standardized tow rating practices across all three full-size pickup truck segments, including the ½-ton Ram 1500, ¾-ton Ram 2500 Heavy Duty and one-ton Ram 3500 Heavy Duty. "

Jim

 

[FSH 210 Sport]

The RAM 5.7 Hemi will run on either 87 or 91 octane. I have 22,000 miles on my 2020 RAM and have never used 91 octane fuel, so my numbers above are with using regular gas.

According to this article, "Beginning with the 2015 model year, Ram will become the first automaker to adopt the Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) J2807 standardized tow rating practices across all three full-size pickup truck segments, including the ½-ton Ram 1500, ¾-ton Ram 2500 Heavy Duty and one-ton Ram 3500 Heavy Duty. "

Jim

According to this article, which validates what I said above, Toyota was the first to adopt the SAE standards while the big three drug their feet…

Standardized Tow Rating Procedure Finally Gaining Traction | Edmunds

Can you trust the tow ratings on today's pickup trucks? Automakers are pushing back against standards that would make towing capacity more reliable.

www.edmunds.com

 

[AZMark]

Biased Toyota guy here, would never buy a dodge and you basically summed up why right here:
“But, the RAM is younger with newer technology,”

American manufacturers will put untested and unreliable stuff into cars many years before Toyota will finish testing it to make sure it works and lasts. This is why Toyota is “always behind” yet their non-budget cars last longer and hold their value better.

I’d view those two vehicles as being the same functional age despite the 40k mileage difference.

 

[BlkGS]

I'd question the trans cooler you got. Possibly it was too small, IMO there's no reason to use amythingnaller than a tru cool 40k. I've been thinking about using a derale 25 row plate and Finneran cooler in my tbss.

If power is the issue, that's easily solved with a tune and some headers. Do that for a gew months or year fornthings to calm down some.in the used market. JMO.

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

If you're willing to stretch the budget a little, a new Nissan Titan isn't far off on these spec sheets. You can get into a well equipped model for ~$45k, and you'll get some of the new tech like lane departure and adaptive cruise. You'll also get a much better warranty than either of the other two, although I doubt you'll need it. It's not as smooth riding as the RAM, but it'll be as reliable as the Toyota if not better. Gas mileage sucks, which is it's only real achilles heal IMO.....*edit*......Just priced a Titan SV, you're still gonna be in $50k range for that thing. Sorry, my numbers were off...*/edit*

Used cars and trucks are just stupid expensive right now. We went through this when my daughter had her car totalled a few months ago in a hit-and-run. Took some searching, but she ended up finding a new Jeep Renegade for just a few thousand dollars more than a used one. Piece of mind having the new car warranty AND a lower financing rate. Also got an much higher than anticipated settlement from the insurance company for the old car.

Its a no-brainer to me to buy new over used in this market. Honestly, ANY truck with a 5.7ish engine should be able to tow an AR250 without any problems.

Jim

 

[King]

Agree on the 5.7… I was going off of what the spec sheet said…

View attachment 186649View attachment 186650

Yeah, looks like that data sheet was a copy and paste job, and not a good one at that.

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

According to this article, which validates what I said above, Toyota was the first to adopt the SAE standards while the big three drug their feet…

Seriously, who cares! ?‍

Both vehicles in the original post meet the standards. Besides, it not like either manufacturer built trucks that weren't capable of towing loads.

Jim

 

[Jim_in_Delaware]

Yeah, looks like that data sheet was a copy and paste job, and not a good one at that.

Double check the tow stickers on both trucks. Ask the dealer(s) to take a pic and send them to you. Seem what the actually tow numbers are for the specific vehicles to make sure the meet your needs.

Jim

 

[adrianp89]

Biased Toyota guy here, would never buy a dodge and you basically summed up why right here:
“But, the RAM is younger with newer technology,”

American manufacturers will put untested and unreliable stuff into cars many years before Toyota will finish testing it to make sure it works and lasts. This is why Toyota is “always behind” yet their non-budget cars last longer and hold their value better.

I’d view those two vehicles as being the same functional age despite the 40k mileage difference.

This is an outdated mindset. It held true 20 years ago... today not even close. Cars are more reliable than they have ever been. If you look at cars with best re-sale value, sure Toyota is in there with some cars.... but so is Ford, Jeep, and Chevy.

 

[Taylorman]

I started off looking for a Ford or the Chevy/GMC equivalent. Ended up with a Ram and absolutely love it. Toyota makes a great car but their trucks are just ok but priced like it’s the best of the best. The Ram will ride much smoother and quieter. You’re buying used so you should consider how well they were maintained, if any info is available. IMO the Ram is the better value of the two vehicles. It makes zero sense to say the higher price proves the Toyota is better. The higher price simply means you’re paying more for less.

With that said, you know how much you drive per year and how long you’re comfortable keeping a vehicle. Compare both options to your expected use. If you’re comfortable with both then drive them and see which you like best. I find Toyota SUVs and trucks feel narrow to me. I prefer the wider interior seats and space in general of the Ram but others prefer the narrower feel of the Toyota. They’re very different. Those two assessments should help you lean one way or the other. At least they work for me. Best of luck.

 

[AZMark]

This is an outdated mindset. It held true 20 years ago... today not even close. Cars are more reliable than they have ever been. If you look at cars with best re-sale value, sure Toyota is in there with some cars.... but so is Ford, Jeep, and Chevy.

Yes they are getting better. Data seems hard to find. As of 2018 Ford & Dodge trucks seem to have had double Toyota.
I worked at a Ford dealer for 5 years but it was about 20 years ago and every car had a laundry list of real recalls that needed repair.

I’ve had 3 Toyota trucks, 2006, 2012 and 2013 and each has had 2 recalls:
1) Takata airbag that affected the entire industry 2) Floor mats because some idiots hit the gas instead of brake and blamed it on everything but themselves.

I would guess American trucks continue to have more, albeit at a declining rate.

 

[BlkGS]

Recalls are for things that "could be" a safety issue. The domestics have learned its way cheaper to issue a recall for every little thing than have some sleazeball lawyer sue them and drag them through the mud. They're issuing recalls for stuff that affects less than 100 vehicles sometimes, because it's less risky for them.

Toyota had some teething issues with the 5.7L, and seems the new twin turbo v6 isn't that reliable.

 

[Neutron]

Toyota had some teething issues with the 5.7L, and seems the new twin turbo v6 isn't that reliable.

What are the teething issues that Toyota had with the 5.7l. I have been with Toyota since 1997 and never saw anything considered even slightly teething with the 5.7l.



Now the new Tundra 3.5l twin turbo is another story. The truck as a whole is a complete wisdom teeth removal. We have only sold approximately 25 non hybrid (which really isnt a true hybrid) and almost 25% of those trucks have come back with problems. 2 have had wastegate problems which require a complete exhaust manifold removal because it's one complete assembly. Even though this truck has been in development for a while and was supposed to come out a few years ago but release was pushed back a few times , it should have had less bugs

 

[BlkGS]

What are the teething issues that Toyota had with the 5.7l. I have been with Toyota since 1997 and never saw anything considered even slightly teething with the 5.7l.



Now the new Tundra 3.5l twin turbo is another story. The truck as a whole is a complete wisdom teeth removal. We have only sold approximately 25 non hybrid (which really isnt a true hybrid) and almost 25% of those trucks have come back with problems. 2 have had wastegate problems which require a complete exhaust manifold removal because it's one complete assembly. Even though this truck has been in development for a while and was supposed to come out a few years ago but release was pushed back a few times , it should have had less bugs

No personal experience with them, but a few guys I knew minimally had engine issues where the rod wanted to be freeze from inside the motor. May have been beaten on, as most of those guys thought they had the new fast truck at the time.

As a counter point, a buddy has like 150k trouble free miles on his. It's a piece of cheap crap inside, and it rides like a cheap crappy old truck, but it does everything he needs to do without issue. I can't fault a truck for a cheap interior in a cheap truck, if its a tool the interior just has to last. That said, most trucks have left tool.status way behind, and so a cheap interior in those I'm less ok with.

On the new tundra and sequoia... Toyota missed the mark. They should have made them PHEVs, they'd have rocked the market. Whoever makes a 30 to 50 mile ev range truck that's also a real truck will wipe the floor with the competition.

 

[Neutron]

Not to sidetrack this thread but the new "hybrid " version of the tundra and the sequoia is an electric motor assist under initial low end load untill the turbos deliver enough power to take the load over. So it adds approximately 100ft lbs of low end torque and 35ish HP.
Its real fast but the exhaust note is lack luster.
So like a true hybrid which under cruise, deceleration, or complete stops, the engine doesn't run at all, the new tundra with the "I-force max" the engine always runs. So its fuel savings is only a few mpgs over the standard 3.5l tt.

 

[Neutron]

No personal experience with them, but a few guys I knew minimally had engine issues where the rod wanted to be freeze from inside the motor. May have been beaten on, as most of those guys thought they had the new fast truck at the time.

As a counter point, a buddy has like 150k trouble free miles on his. It's a piece of cheap crap inside, and it rides like a cheap crappy old truck, but it does everything he needs to do without issue. I can't fault a truck for a cheap interior in a cheap truck, if its a tool the interior just has to last. That said, most trucks have left tool.status way behind, and so a cheap interior in those I'm less ok with.

On the new tundra and sequoia... Toyota missed the mark. They should have made them PHEVs, they'd have rocked the market. Whoever makes a 30 to 50 mile ev range truck that's also a real truck will wipe the floor with the competition.

I work on many tundras with 300k plus miles on original engine and drive train. They are bulletproof and plenty of power, only real complaint is the mpgs and lack of tech.
My 2020 limited is a great truck and will be with me for the next 8 years( i keep a vehicle 10 years then replace it) i am not in a vehicle long enough to worry about tech. As far as my mpgs. I have an OrangeVirus tune with Corsa exhaust with a s&b intake and i get an average 17 mpg stock 20 inch tires, no lift

 

[I_squared_r]

I started the thread about the RAM gearing and I have been doing a lot of research. I think Toyota is more reliable. On the 5thgenram forums are posts about leaking exhaust manifolds, leaking 3rd brake lights, noisy driveshafts, and uconnect issues (my dad had an issue 2 times with uconnect). The Toyota Tacoma forum has posts about leaky 3rd brake light and noisy front differential bearing when lifting it (it happened to mine). The majority of complaints on the Tacoma forum are about the lack of power especially while towing.. I read something funny "nothing breaks when the truck has no power"

I was a auto technician from 2007 until 2014. I'm a fan of Toyota and I have always recommended the brand. I never drove the Tundra, but I see that the previous generation was outdated, terrible fuel efficiency, and expensive compared to the competition. That's why I never considered the Tundra and I bought my Tacoma. Now the new generation Tundra is out and it's an impressive truck BUT everyone is telling me that they only sell for MSRP or over MSRP. No thanks. So that's why I have been looking at RAM.

I regret not buying the RAM in 2020 when the prices were reasonable. Instead I wanted to do overlanding, 4 wheeling, and do crazy trips. Then life happened, things were crazy for the past few years, and I never did it.

 

[steveinmd]

I started the thread about the RAM gearing and I have been doing a lot of research. I think Toyota is more reliable. On the 5thgenram forums are posts about leaking exhaust manifolds, leaking 3rd brake lights, noisy driveshafts, and uconnect issues (my dad had an issue 2 times with uconnect). The Toyota Tacoma forum has posts about leaky 3rd brake light and noisy front differential bearing when lifting it (it happened to mine). The majority of complaints on the Tacoma forum are about the lack of power especially while towing.. I read something funny "nothing breaks when the truck has no power"

I was a auto technician from 2007 until 2014. I'm a fan of Toyota and I have always recommended the brand. I never drove the Tundra, but I see that the previous generation was outdated, terrible fuel efficiency, and expensive compared to the competition. That's why I never considered the Tundra and I bought my Tacoma. Now the new generation Tundra is out and it's an impressive truck BUT everyone is telling me that they only sell for MSRP or over MSRP. No thanks. So that's why I have been looking at RAM.

I regret not buying the RAM in 2020 when the prices were reasonable. Instead I wanted to do overlanding, 4 wheeling, and do crazy trips. Then life happened, things were crazy for the past few years, and I never did it.

Check out Mark Dodge in Louisiana. They are selling below msrp on ordered trucks and will ship.

 

[Brad460]

Former Tundra owner here who reluctantly switched to a 2019 Ram 1500- Best decision I ever made. Love the Ram..

This is an easy decisions…

 

[crazy4life]

Former Tundra owner here who reluctantly switched to a 2019 Ram 1500- Best decision I ever made. Love the Ram..

This is an easy decisions…

^^^What he said.^^^